1/1/2015
guest just got it, and the car balks at entering the garage opening, after it stops I just start it from where it stopped and it then continues to park, maybe it will learn my opening and operate "cleaner" as time goes on.�
1/1/2015
guest Just a friendly PSA that we really don't need all the "I just got it" or "I'm still waiting for it" posts in this thread. In fact it was an attempt to eliminate those that was one of the reasons the Firmware Upgrade Tracker was developed.
Certainly the first people to receive an update should post. People who are exceptions to the patterns developing, etc. should post, because it is of interest to the group. When it seemed no P90Ds were getting the update, of course it made sense for the first few P90D owners to post about their updates. Since California had apparently been late to start receiving the update, of course it made sense for the first few people in California to post that they were receiving the update.
Obviously everyone is free to post whatever they want. Assuming most of us don't want to post if we think others wouldn't want to read it, I'm merely suggesting that you think twice before posting a "I still don't have it" or an "I just got it" post.
Thanks!�
1/1/2015
guest I had backed in manually last night (while still on 7.0) and tried Summon this morning to pull out of my garage. As expected, Summon was aborted as soon as the car sensed the relatively steep incline:
�
1/1/2015
guest This is false. There are 2 problems with speed limits, one is that the camera sucessfully reads the signs less than 50% of the time. The second problem is that it pulls speed limits from somewhere other than signs (and they are frequently wrong). Neither of these issues have been fixed, or even improved.
How do I know which ones without going to 7.1? there's nowhere on the cluster that it tells you if it thinks the road is divided or not. I can't give specific locations without going to 7.1 I do know it will happen though, because the maps are atrocious, and other people have reported it doing exactly this. Combined I know that it will do it for me as well.
As they have not acted on any feedback I have provided so far, and act very rarely on any feedback provided by customers in general, I don't see why I should lose functionality just so that I can provide feedback that will be ignored.
Ok. please come here and drive every single divided highway in Western Canada. I think that some of these roads will be misidentified. If you can prove that they aren't, I'll upgrade. What possible objection could you have to identifying these roads?�
1/1/2015
guest Just got 7.1. On multi-lane highways, should the cars be rendered until you pass them or is it correct that they disappear when they are about 5 feet in front of you? Also, how well do your side-sensors work? Most of the time, I get no indication that there is a car on the right of me (the "glowing" halo to the right almost never displays).�
1/1/2015
guest I think it is blatantly obvious at this point that while I am trying to be helpful you are just trying to make a point.
I never suggested that you upgrade. I never suggested that you would have to know which roads would be problematic. I suggested you provide the details of a few highways that you drive that you are worried about, and let others determine for you if they are a problem or not.�
1/1/2015
guest The rendering doesn't show cars to your side, only ahead. So if they are in adjacent lanes to yours, they will only show up when they pass you (or you pass them) up to a certain distance in front of you. Check out my videos upthread for some examples.�
1/1/2015
guest I don't drive one road, I drive roads all over the place. I KNOW there are problems with misidentified roads because it's been reported by several people with 7.1, There's nothing to be gained by myself in randomly guessing at WHERE that will be. I know it will happen, and that's enough.
For now, I'll let others have the limitations, and I'll continue to enjoy my no-limits experience. I have nothing to gain, and everything to lose by going to 7.1
If you want to provide feedback to Tesla, go ahead. Please do, maybe they'll back off on their restrictions, but I highly doubt it. I also highly doubt they'll do anything to fix those locations, that's just not how Tesla has ever worked, it's not "sexy" they'd rather release new features than fix broken ones. I find it easier to just avoid letting them break it.
If you really do want a list, prove that there will be no limits at all on:
Trans Canada Highway Medicine Hat-Vancouver (including the coquihalla)
Alberta QE2 Highway Lethbridge-Edmonton
Alberta Highway 11 Red Deer to Rocky Mountain House
Calgary Deerfoot trail, Stoney Trail, Crowchild Trail, Sarcee Trail, Shaganappi Trail, Bow Trail, Glenmore Trail, Macleod Trail, Nose Hill Drive, John Laurie Blvd, 14th St, Beddington Trail, Symons Valley Blvd, Country Hills Blvd, Metis Trail, Blackfoot Trail, 16th ave, Highway 22x, Highway 8
And that's just off the top of my head, there are probably dozens more these are all divided roads that work perfectly in 7.0, any change in that means I have lost functionality. I could really add all divided roads throughout the lower mainland in BC, as well as interior BC as well. It's not feasible to ask someone to go around and drive every one of these roads in 7.1, find the inevitable spots where the restriction comes on, and provide feedback to Tesla that they will then ignore.
You say I'm "just proving a point", what point are you trying to prove by saying I shouldn't complain if features I've come to enjoy are being removed?�
1/1/2015
guest LOL! Best guess so far! =)
It's a tiny file, only 53 bytes of binary, and whatever it is it went from version 4 to version 5.�
1/1/2015
guest Probably an ATM cell.�
1/1/2015
guest Amazing what you have done mapping this out Ingineer. Reading back through your posts is an absolute torrent of detail.�
1/1/2015
guest I can see what versions change in the package. To determine what actually changed, I'd have to disassemble the code of both versions and analyze the differences, which is a lot of work. On the BMS there are 2 blocks of code, one for the TMS320 DSP Microcontoller which is the "main brain" of the BMS, and it's companion CPLD which assists the microcontroller as well as performing error checking and validation. Both of these received changes in 2.9.154.
- - - Updated - - -
No ATM anywhere near a Tesla, but that's pretty funny in a geek sort of way! =)�
1/1/2015
guest OK. Now we're getting somewhere.
Hopefully some other TMC users in Canada who have already updated to 7.1 who drive those roads will read this and report back on whether those roads are correctly identified as divided or incorrectly identified as undivided. If any are identified incorrectly, I would hope the person identifying the fact would also report it to Tesla. Perhaps progress will be made.
I don't think I've said that. I certainly haven't said it in this most recent discussion.
I agree that Tesla is often very slow to respond to feedback from its customers. I've been extremely critical of Tesla on a number of topics. I'm just willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on this one, and think they have the ability to come up with a system that could work for you. Whether they will or won't is yet to be determined. But it is in everyone's best interest if they do come up with a system that allows for quick correction of roads that incorrectly have the restrictions imposed once those roads have been reported to Tesla and confirmed to be divided highways. I'm genuinely trying to help you and Tesla.
If, for argument's sake, you learned that a month from now Tesla had a system in place that while still mis-categorizing roads regularly allowed for corrections to be called in, confirmed, and implemented in the database within 48 hours, you'd probably be a lot more likely to update than you are now. And even if you wouldn't be, that system would be a much better system than the one in place now.
Perhaps I'm too optimistic. But I really am just trying to help.�
1/1/2015
guest And here we're on the same page. The difference is that I'm a bit less optimistic that this will happen.
Yes, I would commit to going to 7.1 if there was an actual ability to fix those issues in a timely manner. But not in it's current state.�
1/1/2015
guest Those glowing halos are blind spot indicators, they don't indicate cars that you can plainly see right beside you.�
1/1/2015
guest Just was out and about trying 7.1 for an hour. I personally didn't find more nags with Autosteer, and I'd say this release has more positives (FOR ME) than any drawbacks:
- Very happy with the extension to Homelink -- worked perfectly by just flipping ON both flags on the 17" for only my right garage door where my MS is housed. I had no reprogramming or the wrong door opening as some have reported. When I backed-out, the correct door closed as I got to the street, and it magically opened as I approached and drove right in. Well done. Love it. It's a little thing, but probably what I like best and will use the most in this whole release.
- As discussed previously, FOR ME, Summon is a gimmick and something to show off in this first iteration. Lots of potential, I agree.
- As also posted earlier, it appears Autosteer is either a little smarter or is identifying some neighborhood streets as eligible, that it didn't have a clue about before. However that happened (fleet learning or just smarter code) is fine by me.
- Autosteer worked better for me on the freeway and some long 55MPH surface streets. As others reported, it keeps to the center a little better, so I may well use it more as 7.0 freaked me out riding too close to semi's on my left especially when I had someone on my right in heavier freeway traffic -- I just don't (yet) trust it when I'm boxed-in. I did have my first ever situation with "Take over Steering Immediately" -- geeesss, that was startling even though I knew it was a possibility. Was using Auto Lane Change to my left going 70 down the freeway, holding down the signal in a perfectly clear lane with very visible markers -- got halfway over the line and the beeps and IC pop-up occurred on the freeway. Odd it decided to fail when it did. Tried it a couple times later in different sections of the freeway and had no problem in it's execution.
- New AutoPilot IC displaying surrounding toy vehicle icons is interesting -- almost distracting to me as so many ghostly vehicles come and go when you are surrounded by traffic, but perhaps that's because the interface is new to me. Found a couple of strange anomalies on it's ID of a Truck and Motorcycle... A large black semi with a full-wrapped skin (an energy drink company), completely threw off ID of it being a truck. It was consistently displayed as a car icon in front of me, when other white semis (and even a red Coke truck) were ID'd correctly. When the black truck was to my left, it displayed as a car but as I pulled ahead, it became a motorcycle. No sun in the camera or glare problems today -- very overcast, so perhaps BLACK trucks with colorful graphics are a bit of a problem in it's current logic. Not a big deal, just always interesting to me as an x-programmer when things like this do and don't work. Oh, was on the road with 2 real motorcycles, and they showed up as they should.
- Autodim of the IC and 17" for me is a significant improvement, and I appreciate Tesla kept my original setting for the new enhancement.
Overall, as I said before, a worthwhile update for me. It's wishful thinking, but hopefully we get even more basic fixes and improvements, and promoting some more basic Beta things like Calendar in the next round, before much more Beta stuff is introduced.
�
1/1/2015
guest So far my feedback on 7.1 - the lane control is much better and smoother. I don't experience any extra "nags." I am happy to have the upgrade.�
1/1/2015
guest Still ugly stereo
They said to wait for 7.1 when I got those ugly large buttons on my stereo after 7.0. (Along with other, less than useful, changes) But, I can see that all of the comments about it went unnoticed by the design team. To me, for a $125,000 car, I want a stereo that looks nicer than one that comes from Fisher Price. I've had my display on night mode for 3 months waiting for this update because I was embarrassed showing this car with that stereo. At least on night mode, the black background made the screen a little easier to show. I would usually close the stereo when showing the car.
The fact that they moved some of the icons to the upper corners where you cannot see them, the turn signal indicators to the bottom, and moved the charge to the left instead of in the center, is something I've learned to live with because I understand they really want to concentrate on there new autopilot. But, what about those of us who bought just before the autopilot? Why cant we keep the car we bought? The stereo was nothing special before, but at least it was not a hideous deal breaker. And when the charge icon was in the center, I could tell you exactly what it was on any given day. Now, I barely look at it. But hey, they needed the room for the cool autopilot. Oh, wait, my car doesn't have autopilot. Again, why do I have to put up with the crappy displays? Not what I bought. Not what I want. For sale, loaded Model S! (downgraded stereo included)�
1/1/2015
guest There's absolutely no reason you can't keep the car you bought. You just have to decline the software changes, then the car remains exactly as it was when you bought it.
I'm not sure why some people think software changes are mandatory, if they were mandatory there wouldn't be a way to skip them.�
1/1/2015
guest 7.1 from a 6.2 user's point of view
This may be redundant but I figured since most of you came from 7.0, maybe my perspective is a little different.
Upgrade was a tiny bit bumpy - maybe because this is a less tested version step? I got an "update failed" message on the phone, went out to the car, saw nothing useful. Then another "update available". Started the update again and then got the "update successful".
- UI: what can I say. My wife really likes it, thinks it's a lot less cluttered. I bemoan the loss of the power meter, the loss of AC details, the flat look... but will grudgingly admit that this is not as bad as I thought it would be. I guess one gets used to it quickly
- A/C: what the heck? I had my car(s) at the same temperature setting for the last 2.5 years. With 7.1 I need to set the temp about 5�F higher to have about the same perceived temperature (and no, range mode is off)
- Autosteer: the toy car really conveys the message... this is a high speed adventure ride. Phases of happiness interrupted by moments of sheer terror when the car suddenly appears to steer into oncoming traffic or off the edge of the road (yeah, I know, I'm talking about non-divided Hwy here). In all instances I took over before I got any warnings on the screen. I wasn't quite ready to "see what would happen" if I didn't.
On the freeway I was seriously impressed. Choice of position in lane was solid most of the time (I guess this is one of the big improvements over 7.0?). I experienced almost no ping-pong. We did get so close to a semi right next to me that I decided to take over once, but since I could see the sensor noticing the truck I assume (hope?) that we wouldn't have touched. Even in rather heavy rain (who would have thought. rain. in Portland. in January...) it did a very nice job.- Nag: after reading here (and given that I am certainly still lacking confidence in this) I had my hand on the wheel plus my knee lightly pressed against it. Got two nags total. One when it was getting lost (the lane markings were very hard to see among the tire tracks in the water on the road), one when I got so comfortable that apparently both my knee and my hand barely touched the wheel. Felt totally acceptable to nag me at that point
- Restrictions: that worked out extremely well for me. There's a 2 lane road @45mph that drops down to 35 before entering a traffic circle. Since 45 really is the highest comfortable speed there I had the TACC set to 45. As we pass the 35 line the car slows down to 40. PERFECT. That's what I would have done otherwise as well. But of course, as discussed here at nauseum, if the car misreads the signs, that's a PITA. BTW: 6.2 would misread speed signs on this very commute all the time. I had not a single misread sign today in heavy rain. Nicely done, Tesla.
- Oh, back to the UI one more time: the cars and the lines and the lights and all that activity... maybe one gets used to it and ignores it more, maybe I paid more attention because it's all new to me. But I found that more than a little distracting. If my mom (75) came to visit, this is not the car I would suggest she should drive. Which will be a problem if we become a Model S/X only family, I guess.
- Other comments:
- why did Tesla take the quick pick audio source button away? I didn't realize that I use that several times a day.
- the map (both in dash and on the big screen) looks much better without all the frames and other skeuomorphisms we used to have
- the position of some of the information on the IC still bothers me. Battery and light/high beam are both invisible in my usual sitting position; on the flip side I love that I have an icon for the hill hold
Summary: I'm pretty happy. I don't regret holding out, from what I read here I think I would have liked 7.0 a lot less. But this is solid. It's a step forward. Yes, I said it. Go ahead, make fun of me.�
1/1/2015
guest I've also found references to a "Tesla Connectivity Subscription", so it's clear Tesla plans to make customers pay for 3G/LTE at some point soon.
Interesting to note that "Max Power Mode" is internally referred to as "Drag Strip Mode".
Another interesting tidbit on the Auto-Brightness: (I didn't read how this works until now)
"When auto-adjust is checked, the car will dynamically adjust the screen brightness based on the amount of light outside the vehicle. While in this mode, you may further fine-tune by using the the brightness slider. The auto-adjust system will take this into account.
Toggling auto-adjust off will erase fine-tuning and revert system to default auto-adjust state."�
1/1/2015
guest This is something I'm very interested in, if they have in fact figured out a way to make speed limit detection (both by signs, and by database) much more accurate, I would consider going to 7.1 I'll have to ask some more drivers, especially local ones.�
1/1/2015
guest Hands-on-wheel
The car detects whether your hands are on the wheel by looking for reaction torque as it makes fine adjustments. So it needs added mass, not "tugging". If you hands are in contact with the wheel, but not gripping (and thus adding mass), the system will not detect them. Note that gripping and keeping your arm stiff are two different things. Ideally you want to grip it, but keep your arm relaxed so it just moves along with the wheel.
Their algorithm also takes a few seconds to detect the added mass, so when you are satisfying a "nag", you need to give it time to detect you.�
1/1/2015
guest A slight amount of torque on the wheel will also clear it pretty much instantaneously.
I find that if I grip it just tightly enough that the wheel moving moves my hand, that's enough to avoid all nags.�
1/1/2015
guest So I have posted about this a few times. It would RELIABLY misread three different speed limit signs that I drive past more or less every day. It got all three of them right today. But that's 6.2->7.1 -- I cannot tell you how 7.0 compared to that.�
1/1/2015
guest It would be great if they also allowed a hotspot mode. Tesla's connectivity is often better than my tablet's or phone's.�
1/1/2015
guest Great review and very well written!!
Thanks�
1/1/2015
guest Yeah, me too, though over time it has become less distracting. Although I'm sure the "force field" animations are a cool achievement, they really don't help me with my driving at all. A simple blind spot indicator would suffice.�
1/1/2015
guest I only had 6.2 for a short while, however I did not notice any difference going from 6.2->7.0 in speed limit accuracy. Of course signs are only half the battle, I frequently get speed limits pop up (usually inaccurate ones) when no sign has been passed. I suspect this is from a database somewhere.�
1/1/2015
guest Yes. My thinking was that it was detecting a larger polar moment on the wheel that would indicate hands and arm weight hanging from the wheel. Driving with one hand on the wheel is not comfortable, because you need to take the weight yourself or cause the AP to disengage. AP seems to want the balance there, in both directions. Two hands at the normal spots encouraged by the wheel shape, simply hanging, allow the system to work just fine. And you instantly feel when the car is going to do something you might not like, because the steering reacts very quickly. I wouldn't expect a driver could reliably make a grab for the wheel quickly enough to catch a mistake... hands on the wheel is prudent.
In spite of the comment about 30 entries above, I do keep my hands on the wheel and don't consider myself to be an idiot for doing so. It's an assist function, not a self-drive function. I wouldn't be overly happy if the pilot and copilot of the 747 I'm travelling in came into the seats and started chatting with the passengers. Yeah, the autopilot should manage to keep the plane flying straight and level, but I wouldn't be comfortable. And there are no dogs running across the flight path, potholes, innumerable other planes, etc., that would add to the danger level we have on the ground.�
1/1/2015
guest It's possible we're all participants in a massive A/B test. Two groups, one with the previous AP behavior and one with new (timed nag) behavior. After some period of time (weeks, months) Tesla will compare the number of incidents as well as the number of pieces of feedback from the two groups.�
1/1/2015
guest That's the most reasonbale explanation I've heard.�
1/1/2015
guest Driving with the left arm resting on the armrest and left hand applying gentle pressure just for the torque sensor to know that I am there works for me.�
1/1/2015
guest When I'm holding the wheel, I do the same, and that's also how I drove my previous car without AP, so it just feels natural�
1/1/2015
guest You mean we're all just a bunch of mice in Tesla's lab? Say it ain't so!! :biggrin:�
1/1/2015
guest You must have weird speed limit signs in Alberta. I so far have observed at least a 98% rate of correct speeds in all my 49,000 km of travels in eastern Canada and US and also to South Dakota. Since I stay on the metric system while travelling in the US, even the US mph speed limit signs are translated correctly into km signs on the instrument panel.
If your camera does not see the signs correctly then get it looked at or at least clean the windshield.
Do all the other Alberta owners have the same problem?�
1/1/2015
guest It's only partially the signs, I frequently get speed limits popping up on my dash where no sign was passed, many of these are wrong too (most likely from a database somewhere)
As for the signs themselves, the vast majority of the time it doesn't read them at all. I would say it's probably about 35% correct reads, 55% no read at all, 10% incorrect read.�
1/1/2015
guest In Edmonton I'm finding 7.1 significantly better with speed limit recognition - yet to see it provide an incorrect reading. Overall very impressed with this update, it's quite amazing what they can accomplish in a couple of months.�
1/1/2015
guest This would be really smart on their part. They probably should be doing crowd-sourced design exactly like this.�
1/1/2015
guest After 100 miles with autopilot on 7.1, I gotta say in my estimation it's massively improved. I didn't have more nagging than before on the same mixed route (Hwy 1/Hwy 17 in the Bay Area). It handles curves better, has fewer confusions and is much more tolerant. On restricted areas I didn't find that applying a little pressure to the accelerator to override was especially burdensome.�
1/1/2015
guest There's a stretch of I-25 near me where the speed limit is 75 mph, but a sign on the left side of the two southbound lanes reads "left lane min. speed", in a small font, above a standard size speed limit sign that reads "55 mph". You can guess how much of that the AP reads.
That said, I got an update notification via the iOS app yesterday, but I'm a thousand miles away from the P85D at the moment, so I haven't done the update to see if it's 7.1, and I don't know if 7.1 will read this sign correctly...�
1/1/2015
guest Apparently someone has figured out a fix for the time-based nagging (partial sarcasm).�
1/1/2015
guest And this is what a timed nag encourages, and this makes it more dangerous, because in a place where the AP really does need your input, it doesn't know that you're not already providing it.
Adding timed nags reduces the safety of the whole system.�
1/1/2015
guest I expect you know this, but will point it out in case you don't.
Depending on how you have speed assist set up, the speed limit sign may be shown whenever you are speeding. From the manual:
--
If you set the speed limit warning to Display (see Controlling Speed Assist on page 82), the speed limit sign on the instrumental panel increases in size whenever you exceed the speed limit.
--
This doesn't explain it being incorrect, but could explain it popping up when you aren't expecting it to. Also, if the system has read the speed incorrectly, this could happen even if you are not speeding.
I also found the following in the same section of the manual:
--
In situations where Speed Assist is unable to detect a speed (for example, speed limit signs and GPS data are not available at the current location), the instrument panel does not display a speed limit sign. If Speed Assist is uncertain that an acquired speed limit is accurate (for example, although a speed limit sign was initially detected, some time has passed before a subsequent sign has been detected), the speed limit sign is dimmed. In both cases, warnings do not take effect.
--
This could be relevant to your situation as follows: perhaps the software isn't especially bad at reading the speed limit signs where you drive, but what's actually going on is that the GPS database being used has a lot of bad data in it. I'm just throwing this out as a possibility. Not making excuses for Tesla.
- - - Updated - - -
I'm only somewhat optimistic that it will happen. But there are things that all of us should be doing to encourage it, or something like it, to happen.
Any time any of us finds ourselves on a divided highway that the system identifies as undivided, we need to report it to Tesla. When we do, we should ask if there is a system in place to correct the error, and when we should expect to be able to drive without limitations on this particular road that should not have limitations.
If the answer we receive is that there is no such system, we should keep asking the questions, and essentially demand that Tesla develop such a system. Getting the information wrong initially is understandable. Not having a way to process corrections to it, which would in effect force restrictions on us on roads that should not have any restrictions is not.
What I'm saying is that if Tesla does not have a system in place yet to make corrections to the system, it is incumbent on all of us to help them get that system in place.�
1/1/2015
guest It's probably moot if it can read it or not. Isn't I-25 a divided highway? There is no speed limitation on highways, only secondary roads.
In fact, I've seen it remove the restriction on multi-lane undivided highways, although not in all cases so I don't know how it decides.�
1/1/2015
guest I'm not in Canada but I have never had a misread of a speed limit sign. I've had it miss one in the fog and one time a tree obscured the sign from the camera by never a misread. Very strange about your issue @green1. Sorry it's not working for you.�
1/1/2015
guest In Canada a 120km/h signs near Vancouver on Hwy-1 are not recognized at all and the system clearly pulls the old 110km/h limit from the database.
In Oregon about a half of traffic signs are not recognized at all because they use a non-standard font for numbers (it's larger than usual and more "squished").�
1/1/2015
guest This appears fixed in 7.1. I had it recognize signs that 6.2 couldn't read.�
1/1/2015
guest I'm waiting for confirmation from somebody in Oregon first.�
1/1/2015
guest It may not change the TACC set speed, but if it continues to display the speed limit wrong on the IC, it's not moot.�
1/1/2015
guest You realize Dirk is from Portland right?�
1/1/2015
guest Yes, adding mass works fine to "fool" the system. To test this, I taped a lead weight to the bottom of the wheel (where it's out of the way). Of course, I did my testing on a closed private road. Please don't attempt this yourself!�
1/1/2015
guest Err, where do you think I live?�
1/1/2015
guest My paranoia is really resonating with this thought.�
1/1/2015
guest Definite slow down in the roll-out. We have reached 304 entries in the tracker, only 14 of which came today; this more or less matches what we had for the initial 7.0 roll-out (307 - but fewer than 300 reporting in the first 5 days)... assuming we can get a few more stragglers to post their update we'll have an all time high.
If you got your update - would you please post it to ev-fw.com ?
Still no report from China or Japan, no report from a Model X
All models, all VIN ranges (ok, 120xxx is missing and I know a couple of people with brand new cars have received 7.1), but I think this is fairly complete at this point.
If you haven't received it, yet, I'd love to hear about it. (I know, normally we all discourage "I haven't gotten it, yet" posts, but I'm trying to get an idea how complete the roll-out is. Did they reach 95+% of Model S in 5 days?�
1/1/2015
guest There's a section of I-66 near me which just got dynamic speed control. This is done by placing electronic signs above the road at intervals. Normally, the signs are blank or display informational stuff, but when dynamic speed control is in effect they display speed limit signs. These electronic speed limits don't look like normal speed limit signs at all. They have a yellow background, they're very pixelated, and they're suspended high above the road rather than being on the side. As of 7.1, my car now recognizes these, which really surprised me.�
1/1/2015
guest The speed limit signs always appear, but get larger when speeding. what I am reporting is completely different, where no speed at all, or an existing correct speed, is replaced with a different speed when no sign at all has been passed. This sign shows "small" unless I'm more than my offset above it when it appears.
The "GPS Data" is the database chock full of incorrect numbers, and which is responsible for signs appearing on the dash when no physical sign was passed.
In my case it's both. The car is abysmal at reading speed limit signs (I have had days where I have counted 8-10 speed limit signs that I have passed without a single one registering on the dash) AND the GPS database has tons of bad data in it (hence the speed limit signs appearing when I didn't pass a sign)
Either way though, it's rather irrelevant to me how it gets it's bad data, it's how it uses that bad data. Right now I ignore the bad data, and the worst it does is prevent me being able to automatically set the speed with a long pull of the cruise control stalk and listen to a "bing" as I ignore it's incorrect speedlimit.
But in 7.1 the car actually uses that bad data to tell me how I'm allowed to use AP. So as long as I know how bad the data is, I don't want any part of that.
I partially agree. I want everyone who did go to 7.1 to do this. But I don't believe it's my responsibility in any way to go to 7.1 just so that I can do this, when we don't have any commitment from Tesla that they have any plan to address this.�
1/1/2015
guest Yes, since it is understood that you're not upgrading yet, I was not including you in the "us." The us I wrote of includes anyone who already has upgraded.�
1/1/2015
guest I'm now feeling obliged to upgrade and start reporting bad mapping data. Thanks a lot.�
1/1/2015
guest For what it's worth, I took a drive a way up the Coquihalla Highway today to see if the 120 km/h signs were read more accurately with 7.1. Answer: No.
I went by three of them. Two were ignored altogether. The third (at the end of an on-ramp) I went by quite slowly, right close to the shoulder. It came up as '20 km/h'. Not overly helpful. My initial impression (based on this test and other observations on other, lesser, highways in the area) is that the identification of speed signs is unchanged, or perhaps even less reliable than before.
Note, I've *never* had a 120 sign recognized properly on any of the segments of the Coquihalla.�
1/1/2015
guest Interesting that you are finding the signs in Canada not being read any better than before. Dirk's experience in Oregon is different, but that could be because the Oregon signs apparently used some odd font, and Tesla may have simply adjusted the software to recognize it.
The bigger question, though, beeeerock, either for now, or as you drive around in the future, is are you finding any divided highways that the software is identifying as undivided highways, and thus instituting restrictions on? That is where I think we can really help Tesla improve, by identifying those errors, and then seeing if Tesla has a system in place to correct them.�
1/1/2015
guest FWIW, I have submitted bug reports as I pass each and every 120 sign on the coq multiple times. Obviously Tesla doesn't care.�
1/1/2015
guest Well, this might be a dumb question and perhaps I've missed it in the release notes... but how do I know whether it's deciding on 'divided' or 'undivided'? Simply by the upper speed limit it will engage AP? I don't recall seeing anything on the dash that would be indicative one way or the other...
Roads haven't been the best around here lately, so I haven't been pushing the limits by very much! However, we're in a bit of a melt, so perhaps I can soon.
Not entirely related, but I tried the AP on a 60 km/h (divided!) 4-lane arterial road in the city today. Long story why, but at one point, the road narrows to a lane in each direction and makes a 90 degree turn. The road is supposed to continue one day in the distant future and this will then be an intersection. I was watching how the AP flipped between line recognition and following the 'blue car'. At the corner, it attempted to follow the blue car around the tight corner and I think it would have managed it except for the two or three foot almost vertical pile of snow, black from splashed sand and road grime. My car seemed to want to follow the car a little more tightly than the road would have allowed and I had to intervene. I didn't even see it detect the snow bank with the side sensors (odd) before I caused it to turn a little wider and not sideswipe the black gravelled snow. Pre-7.1 I don't think it would even have tried, but just odd that it wanted to follow the leading car without really paying attention to the road (or so it seemed).�
1/1/2015
guest Getting the speed limit wrong in the past, and the ramifications of that are very different from getting the road-type designation wrong now, and the ramifications of that.
It is possible that Tesla still doesn't care about the latter, but it is also possible that they recognize how important this is now, in light of the changes they have made in the software, and thus are going to make correcting this information a priority. And if Tesla doesn't do it on their own, we have to help them see why it is important that they do.
Getting the speed limit wrong before this most recent update had relatively little impact. Getting the road-type wrong after this update means people will not be able to use one of the main high-tech features of their cars the way they expected to. The stakes are significantly higher on this.�
1/1/2015
guest If it's the spot I'm thinking of on the main highway through, in my 7.0 car (in good weather) my car behaved very much like you're describing now, it tried hard to go around the corner, but it also didn't try to slow down at all to do it, so I intervened.�
1/1/2015
guest On a road that the software thinks is undivided, if you attempt to set the TACC speed with Auto-Steer more than 10 kph above the identified speed limit, the car will present an error message on the instrument cluster. Also when on a road it thinks is undivided, if you have a higher set speed and the speed limit lowers, the car will slow, and I believe a message will pop up, explaining why the speed is limited.
None of these things happen on roads the car identifies as divided highways.�
1/1/2015
guest All of the nonsense around the new restriction is ridiculous, really. There really just is no reason for it. I honestly don't see how it solves any problem whatsoever. It seems much more probable that it will cause more problems then it solves.
In case anyone missed in my hacking thread where I disabled this restriction in 7.1... I got a little more driving in with it disabled. +9 MPH over the posted limit or so usually (~54 in 45 is pretty normal). I must say, I'm actually pretty impressed with the improvements from 7.0 to 7.1 with back roads. So, they made it perform better than it did before.... and then they neutered it. lol. Makes no sense to me. It works great now on stretches I wouldn't even enable it on before. There is a somewhat curvy road nearby that's a 2-lane 45 MPH road. Before I couldn't use autopilot here are all unless I was at maybe 40 MPH or less. Today it worked pretty flawlessly at 55 MPH and even took some reasonably tight curves well. My only gripe with 7.1 autopilot (aside from the restriction) is that it seems to want to hug the right side of the road too much, to the point where it sometimes gets a bit too close to things like mailboxes (rural areas where houses are set back 100+ft from the road) and so far those have been the only times I've really needed to take over in places where lanes are clear.
Yes, it nags a bit on the curvy roads, but even letting it continue until it's final gasp of a nag before slowing down, it does nicely.
I'm seriously disappointed in Tesla over this stupid speed restriction rule, especially since it performs so well now without it. I'm going to have to make a video of it or something. 7.1 autopilot minus the restriction is pretty much exactly what I've wanted since day 1. Works great on highways, well enough on other roads.
Edit: I'm also going to note again for the people inditing they added a timed nag... THERE ARE NO TIMED NAGS. All of the nags are based on one or more confidence variables. Nothing more. I can still drive for many miles with no nags at all in clear conditions, just like before. I also see no evidence of a timed nag in any of the data on the car.�
1/1/2015
guest No update here yet. Sac area in NORCAL. new car S70. VIN 118xxx. Battling depression at this point!�
1/1/2015
guest My experience was on the Summit Connector, below the University. It was speed limited by the car ahead, so I can't say if it would have tried to careen around the corner or not. My gut says it would have baled out before it got that far in 7.0. Right turn, it tried to cut the corner tighter than I was comfortable with. This was the spot: Google Maps
Ah, got it. Those are the behaviours I understood would identify undivided highways. In other words it's trial and error to test. I was starting to wonder if there was some sort of indication on the dash I hadn't noticed. Upon further reflection, perhaps there should be.�
1/1/2015
guest ah, not where I was thinking of, I just looked up where it was I was thinking of, it's the 90degree turn on the main highway in salmon arm.�
1/1/2015
guest Got you. Salmon River, narrow bridge, hard right westbound. I've driven the MS over that bridge a few dozen times since 7.0 arrived but can't honestly say I've been comfortable doing it with AP. Too tight a curve, too narrow a bridge. If it went bad, it would do so quickly... so probably only tried it a couple of times and very carefully. Haven't yet been out that way with 7.1 and the roads are too messy to give it a fair test anyway.�
1/1/2015
guest No Spotify here�
1/1/2015
guest Not sure that's an obvious conclusion by any means; it's a projection of your frustration because they haven't acknowledged your reports.
I think Tesla is not unlike many technology companies with a large user base, where bug reports can frequently come in faster than engineering can deal with them. If your issue isn't fixed right away, it's probably because they've had to triage higher-priority problems, or this is actually harder/riskier to fix than it appears and they don't have a solution yet. No inside knowledge of Tesla here, just an educated guess based on having to make similar hard choices with limited time and resources.�
1/1/2015
guest Just received 2.9.172 tonight in Vancouver, BC I had already received 2.9.154 earlier this week. Looking through the release notes no new notes. On a 70D non-ap so can't comment on any ap changes (getting ap installed next week). Also updated the firmware tracker.�
1/1/2015
guest Finally I'm on 7.1, but with some issues.
Two days ago I had 7.0 and was sitting in my car as the screen froze. I did the usual scroll wheel reset, but with no effect. I pulled the touchscreen fuse, but also no luck. Charging was at 1kW from a 11kW source. Had no heat and 300km to Berlin SC. Tech support advised same reset procedure. Next was the Berlin service center, who tried to pull logs. After they connected to the car, they advised to reset again and then pull the fuse once more. This time scroll wheel reset worked! As the screen turned on, I saw the software update prompt. According to SC, the cause might have been receiving 7.1. They said they did nothing more than log pull from my car, yet suddenly it got OK.
One interesting observation that I made was that while the touchscreen was unresponsive, the dash was displaying speed in miles per hour with "km/h" underneath (km/h is my normal setting). So when it was saying my speed is 60 km/h, it was actually ~100km/h. Resetting the dash had no effect on this. I believe this is a bug. Theoretically could get me a speeding ticket, but 1.6x speed difference is quite obvious if you look outside.�
1/1/2015
guest I can also report the following bug in 2.9.154:
My European P85D is now showing 20km less range with the same SoC! I hope they will push the new version soon to correct this!�
1/1/2015
guest I suspect the problem with recognizing 120 km/h sign is that the numbers are too close together to fit the standard North American sign width. The number 2 in the middle takes more real estate than the number 1 in a 110 km/h sign.�
1/1/2015
guest I have an update for my car, I'm already on 7.1 2.9.154.... Take it and possibly get more restrictions? Wait it out and not be first?�
1/1/2015
guest Be the lab rat for us all!�
1/1/2015
guest Coming this soon it sounds like some sort of bug fix release. Besides, we're all curious about what the guinea pigs experience.�
1/1/2015
guest I haven't read all 52 pages so apologies in advance if this is duplicative. A few thoughts:
+ Overall I'm pleased to have time and temp back on instrument panel screen
+ getting much smarter routings via Superchargers - big improvement
+ Nav told me to drive "under 60" to reach my destination, not just "drive slowly"
- reaction time from clicking on a listed Supercharger, favorite or recent destination to drawing and finishing the map seems much slower - and is exacerbated by the lack of visible response to my destination choice touch. It feels like the app didn't sense my touch or else froze
- I don't understand why they removed the quick media choice button. They were not running out of screen real estate. Main screen alternative takes more clicks and is less intuitive. Scroll wheel isn't accessible to passenger, and means I can't have it preset for sunroof or other control
- a v7.x issue, but putting the battery gauge on the lower left rather than where odometer is now means that sometimes it's covered by Nav lane diagrams. Noticed this on a drive yesterday when I was at a decision point for whether to go for a more distant SpC or stop and charge. Had to quickly pull up the energy app to see my remaining charge. I would rather have the odometer covered in that case.�
1/1/2015
guest If your model is 70D, then you will get V2.9.172 with includes a correction of the model type bug introduced in V2.9.154. The bug caused the car to show model 60 instead of 70 when you tap the Tesla T. This bug was reported by few 70D owners on the German Tesla forum. The release noted were exactly the same.�
1/1/2015
guest I doubt most people expected it in the USA, even if some would like some other additional streaming service to be made available directly in the MS interface.
Not directed at you specifically, but I don't see why a for-profit fledgling company like Tesla should take cash from their bottom line to pay outside companies for additional free services. The USA didn't have the Rdio problem that Europe had with Rdio going out of business, and I applaud Tesla providing an alternative for those Owners. Even if some don't prefer to use them, Tesla continues to provide US owners 2 different free streaming alternatives as described when we each ordered our MS.
- - - Updated - - -
Ah, come on. Being a guinea pig can be fun. Being first gives you the opportunity to be in the headlines. Install, and it will give everyone something new to banter about (in a couple of cases, over and over and over).�
1/1/2015
guest It's downloading now, I'll try to get out at lunch to mess with it. Though based on the answer below, I'm not first, and it's nothing exciting...
- - - Updated - - -
I have a 70D, I didn't notice it showing as a 60. Also 2.7.172 in the firmware tracker is showing for both 70D and 90D, so it has to have something else besides making the 60 a 70? (maybe the 90's were showing 85?)�
1/1/2015
guest What's the verdict?�
1/1/2015
guest There were definitely some instances where the update caused some owners of 70's to get the 60 logo, but I don't know exactly which owners had this happen or why.�
1/1/2015
guest See above. It's downloading now (started about 20mins ago, and actually it's done, finished in 18minutes. that's a VERY quick update).
But based on the above, it seems like it's just a bug fix to some 70D owners seeing their cars showing a 60 (though I didn't notice this).
I'll test it out during lunch.�
1/1/2015
guest Yes sorry, saw that after I posted. I did see a 90 car in Tracker though so was hopeful there would be something there for me like range algorithm update [emoji6]�
1/1/2015
guest Re: Spotify
There have been MANY threads about this. We are not asking for a Tesla-paid account. We're asking for them to enable Spotify so we can use our own accounts.
According to wk057's work the Spotify app is included in US builds as well but disabled. The disappointing things he discovered were a) sound quality of the Spotify app was disappointing and b) you can have only either Slacker or Spotify, but not both. Which makes sense given it was designed for different markets, but is still disappointing.
- - - Updated - - -
Sorry to be a stickler for details... but you get the "update available message" AFTER it was downloaded to your car. I think what you mean is "it's installing".�
1/1/2015
guest hah, yeah, you're absolutely right.�
1/1/2015
guest It it took me a few days to notice it, but I think 7.1 must have turned off walk-away door locking on my car. At least, I know I didn't turn it off, but after my wife complained the car wasn't locking I checked, and sure enough, it was turned off. After turning it back on, no further problems noticed. Also auto-folding mirrors.�
1/1/2015
guest I've noticed that after pulling the car out of the garage with summons that the auto present handles do not open, I have to use the fob to open the door�
1/1/2015
guest Curious. I think they auto-present for me. I'll check later today.�
1/1/2015
guest While I'm enjoying the "Driver Mode" to make only the driver door handle extend first. But I'll share a couple points:
1 - When using the Tesla app to unlock, all door handles extend even when in driver mode.
2 - The only other way to get all handles to extend from outside the car would be to double-click the keyfob. Double pressingn the driver door handle or pressing other doors while you have the fob at that door will not extend the handles.
Mainly because of #2, I'm tempted to turn off driver mode. It's thrown my passengers for a loop because they need to get in the car after I pull out the garage and when popping into park, the door handles retract while I'm in the garage. They ended up tapping the glass and I scrambled to press unlock on the screen since it was raining.
Still, a worthwhile first attempt by Tesla. Just too extreme for my use-case, but plenty great for others.�
1/1/2015
guest Make sure you update the tracker if you install it!
I just got 154, so if there is a bug fix/another update I'm sure we're all keen to know�
1/1/2015
guest It's already installed, once I get to my car I'll update the tracker (don't know the version number), but from later in the thread I think it's .172 and nothing exciting.�
1/1/2015
guest
I think that�s normal after the update. It seems to reset these functions.
Same after my update to 7.1
Good to know now (I�ll check seriously after the next update) as I walked away after parking in the city without closing by keyfob.
Fortunately nobody got aware of my open Tesla within these 10 minutes I was away (handles were retracted).
Now I switched these functions ON again and everything is working fine!�
1/1/2015
guest Same here. I'm thinking its related to holding down the center button to activate summon but not sure if that's it or a bug.�
1/1/2015
guest Update: So my update was .172, I updated the firmware tracker. Same release notes (or at least I couldn't find a difference). No real difference elsewhere either.
I had to run an errand, so I took the car for a drive, a few more points of interest about the timed nag
1. I was going 55mph in a 55mph, TACC at 3, at the 3minute mark it said to the hold the wheel (straight road, no turns at/around that section). I thought "hey, crazy idea, what if it's TACC set to 3 for 3 minutes?" Like I said, crazy idea.
2. I changed 2 variables (bad me), 65mph in a 55mph TACC at 7. I got stuck behind a dump truck going 48mph. I made it to 3:32 seconds before I disengaged AP (no nag at all, I just had to change lanes)
3. 55mph in a 55mph TACC at 1, got stuck behind a car going 52mph. I made it to 4:58seconds before I got the message. So either I made it to 5 minutes and I screwed up by pressing the start button on my phone's stopwatch later than intended or this is unrelated.
In either case, it's interesting that both times the car was going less than the speed limit, I made it past the 3 minute mark (this is the same road where I had the 3-minute nag 4 consecutive times)�
1/1/2015
guest I don't think the car knows it's in or out when summoning, it just knows forward/backward.�
1/1/2015
guest If you noted your rated range before the update did you happen to notice any change/increase? :fingers crossed:�
1/1/2015
guest I didn't note it before the update, sorry.
I know what my 90% is, so I can check it tonight after it's done to see if it changed since last night.�
1/1/2015
guest An S70 (RWD) owner reported update .154 changed his car ID to S60 without affecting any function. .172 fixed that issue...and seems to have marked the release to the remaining S70 RWD cars, including yours truly.�
1/1/2015
guest No, I'm saying than holding down the center button on the fob to initiate the sequence is causing the issue about locking auto present.�
1/1/2015
guest This morning I was just about to reply to your post and report that I for one still hadn't received 7.1 for my 70D (VIN 115xxx), still on original 7.0 received on delivery... was beginning to wonder the logic in the rollout pattern
but just before clicking "submit reply", I went out to the car to double check and was surprised to finally see an update waiting. I will report in the firmware tracker once complete.
BTW, I thought the Tesla iOS app was supposed to send a notification any time there's an update? But I never got a notification...�
1/1/2015
guest in my one day of having the upgrade my 90% did not change one bit�
1/1/2015
guest Make sure that particular notification is enabled in the app.�
1/1/2015
guest Mine does. Be sure you have the notification setting turned on for software updates within the App. ...also, not sure if you need the App running in the background or not to get those notifications -- I keep mine there, as it's needed to get Calendar pop-ups when I get into MS.�
1/1/2015
guest I am not seeing the nag at anywhere near the frequency some have reported. SoCal, freeway travel.�
1/1/2015
guest You have .172 also?�
1/1/2015
guest thx. [...]
edit: nevermind - user error. I was expecting to find the update notification on my lockscreen where I usually find my charging notifications each morning but it wasn't there. But I just found it buried among the longer list of notifications from various other apps. oops!
p.s. today's update was 2.9.172, directly from 7.0 (2.7.106) which I've had since delivery�
1/1/2015
guest Weird. I received 7.0 2.9.12 in my new car on December 4th. When I didn't receive a notice of OTA 7.1 update by Tuesday, I emailed Raleigh Service, they resent, and I scheduled the update for last night. I went out to the garage this morning excited to test Summon and go for a drive only to find that the update was for 7.0 2.9.77, and another update notice had been received. Fingers crossed it's .154�
1/1/2015
guest Finally got my 7.1 sometime in the middle of the night (.172) took an hour to apply according to the notifications from the Tesla app.�
1/1/2015
guest Well, my statement still applies (just not to your specific question/problem). Yea, I've noticed that when starting the sequence (pressing on the middle button), it does lock the doors before flashing the lights.�
1/1/2015
guest Received 7.1 on the 12th. Not bad for the UK. Unfortunately, the summoning feature is not yet available in Europe but everything else is good. I suspect we have different laws over here regarding a vehicle moving without a driver?? I'm sure Tesla are working on it and it must give them an opportunity to measure its success in the States before rolling it out world wide. What a car!!�
1/1/2015
guest I was having fun with Summons yesterday. I was parked diagonally at a bank parking lot with a downgrade and from the outside I told Heartbeat to travel backwards. A man was watching and he went into a panic as he thought the car was rolling down and rushed to the rear and tried to stop the car by pushing on the trunk. I thanked him for his effort.
At another location an observer asked if that was a Google car. Tried perpendicular parking with excellent results. I think Summons will call more attention to Tesla as bystanders see the car in action. This morning I demonstrated Summons in front of 10 members of our ROMEO club (Retired Old Men Eating Out).�
1/1/2015
guest My speculation is that Tesla (well, Elon) really didn't want to add any sort of restrictions. But due to some of the bad press they felt compelled to add _something_. Since, on undivided roads most people won't be driving much over the speed limit +5 (at least on the curvy roads around me) this doesn't create much, if any, of a restriction in practice. It was likely intended to be a non-restrictive restriction.
Now, I have had several encounters of divided roads being classified as undivided (boo!) and divided roads classified as undivided (yeah!), so I agree this "restriction" creates more problems than it solves.�
1/1/2015
guest That was my theory too. Others have shot me down on this�
1/1/2015
guest Wait, I thought Heartbeat was a Chevrolet! :wink:
I guess you were lucky that you didn't having it move forwards as he might've pushed on the frunk!�
1/1/2015
guest I got it last night. It's updating now.�
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