May 4, 2015
matbl So once again. That source is not the full month. It is unclear if the last days are then added to the next month or not. Might differ from brand to brand.
This page is based on actual registration data: Startsida - Elbilen i Sverige
No April numbers yet though...�
May 4, 2015
Adm For the Netherlands:
April 2015: 73 (+52%)
YTD 2015: 484 (+85%)
April 2014: 48
YTD 2014: 261
Source Rai Vereniging (click on Excel symbol on the right) https://raivereniging.nl/pers/nieuwsberichten/2015-q3/0501-tot-en-met-april-12-meer-nieuwe-auto%E2%80%99s-geregistreerd.html�
May 4, 2015
hobbes Added a April column and data for Sweden (preliminary), Finland and Netherlands to the Wiki. Actually, it should be renamed (removing the Q1 from its title) - moderators, can you help please?
Everybody feel invited to add numbers for your country as they come in!�
May 4, 2015
svp Norway
Google Translate
Norway April sales at 227 according to above.�
May 4, 2015
Model 3 Correction, found 4 more during the weekend: 231
Wiki updated.�
May 5, 2015
bonaire "bought 600" is somewhat interesting. Did they say they were inventory cars or just price locked-in on the old price via the ordering process and the cars are yet to be built/shipped?�
May 5, 2015
schonelucht For exact details you'd have to ask forum member pvh who reported this in the Dutch section. Since I haven't been to the store myself recently, I am just relaying information. As far as I understood, these are not inventory cars. They still have to be built and shipped for sure but the configuration may be fixed besides maybe minor details.�
May 5, 2015
bonaire Thanks schonelucht, I suspect this is a good thing to pre-order prior to the price rise recently. What I guess is happening was in some EU markets, the price rise was forecast and then the countries reacted with some orders even without customers and that is allowed similar to how China worked last year.�
May 5, 2015
svp Austria - 18
STATISTIK AUSTRIA - Kraftfahrzeuge - Neuzulassungen
The numbers for Germany and Switzerland are also out (according to links on a wiki page) , but I'm not sure how to extract Tesla numbers from those tables�
May 6, 2015
AustinPowers No detailed numbers for Germany yet, but 684 BEVs in total in April (+14.2% compared to 2014).
Will have to wait a few more days to see how many of those 684 are Model S's.�
May 6, 2015
Earlian 86 Model S April 2015 Germany�
May 6, 2015
AustinPowers Out of curiosity, where did you get that number, it hasn't officially been published yet by the KBA?�
May 6, 2015
Earlian TFF Forum - Tesla Fahrer Zulassungszahlen KBA April 2015�
May 7, 2015
Ingenieur Im getting paid KBA Updates, 86 is correct, beat me to it
Can someone from Norway explain the govt decision on EV Incentives?
http://www.hegnar.no/motor/artikkel546473.ece
http://www.dn.no/nyheter/politikkSamfunn/2015/05/06/2201/Politikk/slik-blir-de-nye-bilavgiftene
Does this 200k Kroner Regulation arrive in 2017 or this year?
Acc. to Hengar PHEV are now also included ?
Could you sum it up a little bit?�
May 7, 2015
allz 1 Model S in April - Latvia�
May 7, 2015
RobStark Electric cars lose right to drive in Oslo bus lanes - The Local
According to article above EVs lose bus lane access and exemption to road tolls.
Everything else stays the same til 2017 for another review.�
May 7, 2015
Model 3 This is not entirely correct. The right here is that the government leaves it up to the county to determine whether certain advantages for EVs should continue or not. These advantages are access to public transport lanes - "bus lanes", free parking and free charging.
The only place where the access to bus files are under discussion is around Oslo. Oslo has said that they will work to keep the access as long as possible, but how Akershus (the county surrounding Oslo) will react is currently too unknown. Nor is it known when this transfer of authority would happen.
- - - Updated - - -
The 200k regulation is an invention of the journalist. Just forget that part...
From 1/1 2018 there will be 25% VAT on electric cars, just as it is on (almost) everything. But buyers will receive a compensation which shall be equivalent to that paid in VAT, but to be gradually reduced to zero over a few years. This compensation will have one upper limit which currently is not known - this will probably be "punishing" expensive cars like Tesla.How this compensation will work, and how high this ceiling will be, and how many years it will take down to zero is for the time being unknown.
PHEVs does also have some incentives, but not as much as BEVs.�
May 7, 2015
Yggdrasill Here's a litte article detailing Oslo county's position on the EV incentives. If you look at the table, all the different parties have answered Yes/No to whether they will keep the different incentives until they leave office in 2019. "Ja" means "yes", and the incentives asked about were road toll exemptions, free parking, public chargers and a subsidy for putting up chargers. Now, the access to the bus lanes weren't included in the table in this article, because at the time it wasn't known that this would be a choice the counties would be facing, but I think the other answers is an indication of what they would answer. Of course, it is being discussed to change the access to the bus lanes so that only EVs with 2+ people can use them. This would both cut down on congestion and incentivice green transportation.
http://www.osloby.no/nyheter/Disse-elbil-fordelene-lover-Oslo-politikerne-a-beholde-helt-til-2019-7956416.html
Also, I would say that the access to bus lanes has almost zero impact on Tesla sales. If you're buying an EV to commute into Oslo, you generally won't pick a Tesla. It's a big car that's not very suitable for narrow steets and cramped parking lots. And those who do use the Model S for their commute generally do it because they need the range, and if you're commuting 150-400 km/day, you'll have massive fuel savings which almost pays for the car in full, so losing the access to bus lanes generally won't be devastating.�
May 7, 2015
Earlian Bus lane driving is rubbish.
It only increases the envy of ice drivers, instead of acceptance.�
May 7, 2015
Yggdrasill I disagree. The bus lanes were underutilized a few years ago, so using the bus lanes for something positive was unproblematic. And the bus lanes alone have ensured probably something like 5-10k sales of i-MiEVs, Leafs, i3s, etc. Without access to the bus lanes in the first few years, where no one knew anything about EVs, there were no charging points, EVs were really expensive and their range was miniscule, getting those early adopters on board would have been much more difficult. And sales breed sales; word spreads that these are really nice cars provided you don't need to travel far, prices drop, you get more and more chargers and service providers, etc.
But this has always been intended as a temporary boost for the startup phase. As the bus lanes start to approach maximum capacity, it will be necessary to start cutting down the access.�
May 7, 2015
slcuervo So, in summary, it is not sure the access to bus lanes will be shut down for EVs? That will depend entirely now on each municipality?
And what about the tolls?�
May 7, 2015
Runarbt the same goes for tolls as for the bus lane access.
imo, it would be rather stupid to demand city tolls from EVs when there are a airpolution problem in the cities.�
May 8, 2015
ev-enthusiast The situation in Norway and Germany might be difficult to compare as there are very different prerequisites.
BTW thanks for reporting directly from Norway Yggdrasill!
For example in Munich in Germany there tends to be some traffic jam in the inner city during rush hour.
Going north from the city center there is a very busy street (Leopold street) and unfortunately only a tiny part of let's say 300m is avaliable as bus line.
Makes absolutely no sense to allow EV driving there, you will be part of the traffic jam before these 300m and after these 300m;(
In general there are so few bus lines in Munich that it is no incentive if you could use these with an EV to my opinion.
BTW this is just one lever showing why EV adoption in Germany is a bit more difficult in Germany compared to other countires.
What about keeping the benefit of using bus lanes / car pool lanes in countries where this makes sense and just increasing the requirements for using them during the next years?
I could imagine simply requireing an EV to be zero emissions and using energy more efficient than a certain threshold that might be reduced during the next years.
To my opinion the issue is not that there are some vehicles using bus lanes / car pool lanes in countries where this makes sense but too many.
This tells me that people like this incentive, should not be discarded for the future!
Good idea / bad idea?!�
May 8, 2015
Model 3 Access to the bus lanes is only for zero emissions cars (BEVs) and has never been open for PHEVs. The discussion is about make the requirement (as Yggdrasill mention) to zero emission and 2+ people in the car.
Btw: here you see a part of the most discussed bus lane: Oslo, Norway. Electric Car in bus lane - YouTube�
May 8, 2015
RobStark 
Norwegian Krone seems to be rebounding in conjunction with oil markets.
5/7/2015 NOK/USD close:0.13413�
May 8, 2015
Robert.Boston Bus lanes need to be prioritized for buses, which save far more CO2 than EVs. If those lanes become congested, buses slow down, removing one of their key advantages vs. driving private cars. So it's inevitable that, as EVs become more popular, their use of the bus lanes must be restricted. Taken to the logical extreme, if everyone drives EVs, allowing them to use bus lanes has effectively ended bus lanes. You actually get to that point well before 100% EV penetration.
The idea of allowing only HOV (2+ occupants) EVs in bus lanes is a good one.
Note that this reasoning re bus lanes can't be used to support removal of the toll waiver for EVs. To the extent these tolls exist to reduce in-city air and noise pollution, EVs should continue to be exempt.�
May 8, 2015
Yggdrasill In all probability, the logical extreme with everyone talking the bus (diesel buses) would entail far greater CO2 emissions than if everyone drove EVs or even fossil cars. This is because with each bus route you add, the amount of passengers per bus will decrease, given you start with the best routes first. But on the other hand, if you go from no diesel buses to one diesel bus, the CO2 savings would be significant.
Buses can be good and they can be bad. Every empty seat on a bus represents unnecessary emissions of PM, NOX and CO2. A bus will use 5-10 times more fuel than a fossil car, and an electric car running on clean hydropower will have a lifetime carbon footprint in the area of 30% of a fossil car. That means CO2-wise, a bus needs 5-10 passengers to be better than a fossil car, and about 17-33 passengers to be better than an electric car. Studies show that in Norway, the average bus has around 12 passengers, so, most likely, single occupant electric cars are better for the environment than diesel buses.
Buses are really primarily intended to deal with the congestion issue, not to be good for the environment. And I think buses don't make a huge amount of sense, until they are electric.
Yes, it's certainly a good way to cut down congestion in the bus lanes.
This is not the only thing that should be done. Currently, both taxis and buses are allowed in the bus lanes. I would like it to be so that only *electric* taxis and buses are allowed in the bus lanes. We already have a few electric taxis and buses, so this is proven technology. Taxis and buses cover vast distances in a year, most of it in urban zones, so the emission cuts will be very significant.�
May 8, 2015
Robert.Boston Oh, you use diesel buses in Norway? Ouch. The cities I know in the U.S. switch to CNG years ago, and I had assumed as much in Norway. Diesel would change the equation, as you point out.
mta.info | Facts and Figures
MBTA Events
MBTA Events
Maine transit agency spurs wider adoption of alt fuels - Metro Magazine
Here in Portland we're even shifting over the school bus fleet to CNG:
Portland transitions to compressed natural gas school buses to save money, lungs BDN Maine�
May 8, 2015
svp Denmark April sales - 53�
May 8, 2015
svp France - 24 (Google Translate
Belgium - 14�
May 8, 2015
Yggdrasill The only place I know that use a significant number of CNG buses in Norway is Trondheim. I'd guesstimate that 95% of buses use diesel.
CNG is better, of course, but it's still not a slam dunk for the buses.�
May 8, 2015
hobbes Thanks for the numbers - on the page you linked for France I only find April numbers though, can you check if you have another link?
Do you also have a source for Belgium?�
May 8, 2015
svp Sorry, wrong link
France - Avril 2015 : un mois record pour les ventes de véhicules électriques
Belgium - http://febiac.web4pro.com/nl_mon_brand.xls�
May 8, 2015
Cobos Oslo has quite a few testbusses of different types. They have single digit H2 Fuelcell busses, some ethanol-based biofuel busses, some CNG busses, and some local Oslo busses are mild hybrids as well. They usually also mix some biofuels into their diesel. Looking at Ruters webpage tells of all their different projects.
Cobos�
May 8, 2015
hobbes Updated the Wiki - especially Switzerland looks good, with 117 new Model S in April (30/19/149 for Jan-Mar).
Total is 669, so more than Jan/Feb but only about half as much as one third of Q1 totals - looks like they still need some end-of-quarter-rush even though Elon hinted in the ER CC that they would try to do without that in the Future. But there are some countries missing still.�
May 8, 2015
svp Italy - 3 cars - Focus2move| New Car Sales in Italy -April 2015
- - - Updated - - -
hobbes, thanks. Agree. The one "major" market missing is UK.
According to the data here: http://www.smmt.co.uk/2015/05/new-car-buyers-go-to-the-polls-confident-as-april-registrations-hit-10-year-high/
"other imports" is 179. For Jan-Mar, "other imports" is 510, while Tesla numbers according to Wiki table - 280. So ~54% of "other imports" were Teslas
If roughly the same proportion holds, we are at about 100 cars in UK for April.
All markets combined, probably around 800 cars in April, much more than in January, but below 1100-1200 Q1 monthly average�
May 8, 2015
hobbes Thanks! Added.
If you find more numbers, you can also add them to the table yourself:
1. Go to Europe Q1 2015 Model S sales - Tesla Motors Club - Enthusiasts & Owners Forum
2. Click edit
3. Add the number (only if you have a good source to link!)
4. In the column Source, put the month name and link it to your source for the data
5. Put your name and date in the "Last Update" column
5. Update the totals
6. Add a small note into the field "Reason for editing" below the table (like "added number for Cuba April 2015")
7. Hit "Save Changes"�
May 8, 2015
svp hobbes, thank you! I'll add myself if I find further information with good source.
P.S. Especially for Cuba�
May 9, 2015
Car4CivilizedAge I think numbers are looking good. Seems sales are picking up across the continent. Isn't the first month of quarters usually lot slower than last two? For Norway i think numbers will be substantially higher in May and June.�
May 9, 2015
Model 3 Just realiced that no official numbers was posted for Norway in April, so here it is:
230 (one less then my count)
http://www.ofvas.no/bilsalget-i-april/category659.html
Wiki updated.�
May 10, 2015
matbl There are less particles from CNG, sure. But it is still a fossil fuel that adds CO2. So not a huge advantage compared to dirsel.
unless the CNG is made from biomass of course. But that is not very common.�
Jun 1, 2015
svp First numbers seem to be in for Sweden - 77 cars in May
http://www.bilsweden.se/storage/ma/08caf056f5364ee986077704d8f676b2/4f07a46f9b6c4e7393d7e1f636c06b79/xlsx/17FB9B9F8019C69C94C2BE2F074D23D3935DB5B9/topplistanmaj15.xlsx?MediaArchive_ForceDownload=True
- - - Updated - - -
Austria - 33 cars in May
http://www.statistik.at/wcm/idc/idcplg?IdcService=GET_PDF_FILE&RevisionSelectionMethod=LatestReleased&dDocName=035718
- - - Updated - - -
Finland - 12 cars
http://aut.fi/files/979/Toukokuu_2015.pdf�
Jun 1, 2015
Model 3 Norway 346 in May, #2 after Golf (including eGolf) and 2.9% of total sale.
YTD is 2108 - 3.5%
Source: http://www.ofvas.no/aktuelt-2/bilsalget-i-april-article490-396.html
Yes, it say "april", but if you scroll down to the list, you can select "mai" (May) and "modellfordelt" (rated by model).
Edit: Scrap the above, that page is now removed and replaced with this new:
http://www.ofvas.no/bilsalget-i-mai/category661.html
Witch of course have the same numbers....
But this has some more analyces of the numbers:
(As you can see, the "D" fits our marked :tongue: )�
Jun 1, 2015
hobbes Thanks for the new numbers! Added a May column to the wiki table and put Norway, Sweden, Austria and Finland results. Comparing Apr+May with Jan+Feb for these four, we have an increase of 73% for Q2! However, as noted before, Elon said they were planning to not make as strong end-of quarter-rushes as they used to.
If you want to add new numbers yourself, see my post below.
- - - Updated - - -
France also posts good results for Tesla in May:
The article this is from also has a nice picture�
Jun 2, 2015
schonelucht 129 for the Netherlands in May. A very good number for a half-between month, but as hobbes said, we will have to wait and see what impact the new geographical planning has on overseas end-of-quarter deliveries. We can reasonably expect 1000 deliveries this month, maybe 2000 next month.
(I wanted to edit the WIKI but wasn't sure I wouldn't mess up everything)�
Jun 2, 2015
Model 3 Btw: An update with some headlines in Norwegian media about the May sales: (google translated quotes (with some fixes))
http://www.dn.no/nyheter/naringsliv/2015/06/02/0840/Bilsalg/norsk-nybilsalg-sank-i-mai
http://www.hegnar.no/motor/artikkel549227.ece
�
Jun 2, 2015
svp Belgium - 75
http://www.febiac.be/documents_febiac/publications/2015/06-2015/cars.pdf
- - - Updated - - -
Updated wiki for Belgium and Netherlands
BTW, my estimate at this point is that Elon referred only to the push of the last few days when they were scrambling to squeeze as many cars as possible into the quarter, but NOT to the geographical distribution of cars to optimize last month of quarter deliveries. There's simply no evidence to that - April dropped compared to March in all territories, if you look at delivery times, they pretty quickly went to June for US, but were pushed out for Europe. Anecdotal evidence of people getting new VINs in UK with delivery targets of Sep (month 3 of Q3), etc..�
Jun 2, 2015
SebastianR Looks like a strong month for Tesla in EU - oh, I can already smell the bear headlines that of course the demand in the US must be crumbling...
By the way: only a total of 574 electric cars in all of Germany in May. I didn't find a number for Tesla yet.�
Jun 2, 2015
hobbes Look like we at least have estimates to refute that:
Tesla Sales Rev Up 50% In May As Stock Outlook Lifts�
Jun 2, 2015
svp Inside Ev estimates very good sales in May
May 2015 Electric Vehicle Sales in US Hit New Highs�
Jun 2, 2015
svp I am surprised by very high numbers by Inside EV. They are also saying EU and ROW are dropping, which we know is wrong
"we would be very much surprised to see more than ~800 or so delivered in the rest of the world during the month."
Estimates for US deliveries from other websites are way lower. Could it be that Inside EV started significantly overestimating US sales?
Until now they have been pretty much accurate (look at Q1 numbers for example - seem reasonable).�
Jun 2, 2015
techmaven InsideEV's is as fallible as anyone else's guesses. In this case, they are likely very wrong, but since we won't have conclusive information on a monthly basis except for Europe, they have plenty of time to shim up the estimates to make the year look right after 3 Tesla earnings reports.�
Jun 3, 2015
bonaire Is Europe entirely new cars? Is there any chance CPO cars were sent to Europe and elsewhere and would they count in say Norway or Netherlands during registration tracking?�
Jun 3, 2015
Yggdrasill The Norwegian numbers are new registrations only. Used car imports are a different statistic.�
Jun 3, 2015
matbl That would require some rebuilding of the car first. I doubt they will go that way unless they have a huge stockpile of cars in the US.
And as Yggdrasill says, the norwegian number is new registrations only. Same goes for the swedish number.�
Jun 3, 2015
Yggdrasill I thought the same thing about the Leafs, but we've been receiving them from the US in large numbers. Without working GPS and Carwings, that is.
But the obstacles to exporting Model S to Europe are probably a bit too high. For one thing, you'd need to basically replace the entire charge system; Charge port, Chargers, High Voltage Junction Box and a good chunk of the cabling. Probably a ~20k USD job. (If you don't do this, the fastest compatible charging will be 220V 32A. No supercharging, no three phase charging. You could include the CHAdeMO adapter, of course, which brings the max up to 45 kW or whatever.)�
Jun 3, 2015
ggr That is ample for home charging; you get home from work, plug in, and it's full in the morning. Superchargers are available for long distance charging. I don't understand why anything else would be important.�
Jun 3, 2015
Cobos You can't supercharge a US Model S on the European supercharger network. They use completely different plugs, US uses Tesla's proprietary 2 pin plug, while EU uses Teslas variant of a Type II plug.
Cobos�
Jun 3, 2015
Yggdrasill Yes, the lack of supercharging would definitely be the biggest issue. That's not to say a US Model S wouldn't sell, they would just be compared to a 60 kWh without supercharging enabled. And on an EU Model S, you at least have the option of enabling supercharging, so the comparison wouldn't be entirely favourable for the US Model S.
Assuming Tesla would honor the warranty, my guess is that you could sell a US 2014 60 kWh Model S without supercharger access for around 400.000 NOK, or about 51k USD. A 2014 P85+ bundled with a CHAdeMO adapter might go for 550k NOK, or about 70k USD. And a 2015 P85D bundled with a CHAdeMO adapter might go for 600k NOK, or 77k USD.
Assuming shipping costs, documentation, minor modifications, etc at around 5k USD, that means that a 2014 60kWh Model S would need to be bought at 46k USD or less, a 2014 P85+ at 65k USD or less and a 2015 P85D at 73k USD or less, for it to make any kind of sense in shipping them to Norway. I don't know exactly where prices are in the US, but I'm guessing this wouldn't be a big money maker.�
Jun 4, 2015
Model 3 And here is the problem... Was it not that one or two Model S was imported before the European deliveries started? If I remember correct they had to send the cars back to US to get warranty repairs.�
Jun 4, 2015
Yggdrasill Yes, but if we're talking about CPO cars, sold by Tesla Norway, I think they would honor the warranty.
Of course, when we're talking about US Nissan Leafs, they're certainly not sold by Nissan Norway. They are sold by independent dealers, and you get no factory warranty. Nissan Norway doesn't want these cars on norwegian roads, but there's little they can do. Transferring this to Tesla - do we think Tesla wants these crippled Model S with the US charge port on Norwegian roads? I'm thinking: Definitely not. They could potentially undermine Tesla's reputation.
And if US Model S were to be imported into Norway by independent dealers and no factory warranty, I think we'd be talking about entirely different prices. Maybe a 25% drop from the previous numbers I gave. And a dealer would have to be insane to take on the risk.�
Jun 4, 2015
Model 3 Of course, my bad, I forgot that it was CPO cars that was discussed.�
Jun 4, 2015
svp http://www.kba.de/SharedDocs/Publikationen/DE/Statistik/Fahrzeuge/FZ/2015_monatlich/FZ10/fz10_2015_05_pdf.pdf?__blob=publicationFile&v=3
92 for Germany�
Jun 4, 2015
SebastianR Thanks - I would say, that's actually not bad for Germany. Interesting also that the Model S still has a lot more private buyers than the other cars of the "Oberklasse"�
Jun 4, 2015
Johann Koeber In Germany only 6 out of 92 went with RWD. I wonder what RWD has in other markets.
My speculation: RWD will be phased out in a few months.�
Jun 5, 2015
republic Maybe there is an inventory of RWD motors, and Tesla will phase out RWD orders when there are no motors left.�
Jun 5, 2015
Johann Koeber I think you have the right clue. But from what I understand the motor is the same for the P version. But it is probably some assembly other than the motor that is being phased out.�
Jun 5, 2015
Yggdrasill I believe the inverter is different. So, they may be phasing out the S85 when they run out of S85 inverters.�
Jun 6, 2015
glhs272 Tesla has told me something different. There is a large back order of latest revision regular(non-performance) RWD drive units. Meaning there are none to be had. These are mostly for replacing older version drive units in older cars like mine. It appears the older version drive units have a lifetime expectancy of about 25,000 miles (in my case anyway, on my 3rd drive unit with it due to be replaced). At that point they usually begin to develop a milling noise. This noise and associated drive line slop is mostly to do with a condition where current is "leaking" out from the rotor, through the bearings. This damages the bearings over time.
My assumption is that because they now fully understand these drive unit failures, they have fixed most of the flaws in the latest revision. Therefore they would rather not just put a re-furb drive unit, but go with a new latest and greatest one. If it were an emergency (i.e. total drive unit failure), then they would throw a refurb in my car just to get me back on the road. So for the time being I am patiently waiting for a new batch of RWD non-performance drive units to be made. I am sure they will be needing to be building these things for a long time.
Edit: I also just want to point out that I am not trying to scare anyone. Model S owners relax, Tesla seems to be on top of this.�
Jun 6, 2015
Chickenlittle Trying to give you the benefit of being wrong and not malicous. My model S 85 vin 57xx has over thirty thousand miles. No replacement no problems no extra sounds. Pardon me if I don't believe you
especially in light of your previous post
In my case I feel I have been remarkably lucky. Software bugs aside I have had very few issues, but would be happy to go over them in detail if anyone cared. That said, other cars have had some pretty bad experiences. Taking my car to the service center is a PIA. My car is about to go out of warranty. If I had the problems that others have had with their cars (islandbayy are you listening) I probably would have given up and either traded in for a new Tesla, Lemoned the car if possible, or just take a bath and sell it. My plan is to drive my car until at least 250,000 miles if possible. What really matters is how well it holds up between then and now. How outrageously expensive (or not) it is to get things fixed out of warranty. And how well it maintains range.
After almost 2 years of ownership I am still drunk on the kool-aid, if not more so.�
Jun 6, 2015
schonelucht That seems hard to reconcile with the fact that regular non-performance RWD cars had (and continue to have) the shortest delivery time the last few months.�
Jun 7, 2015
hobbes Regarding the wiki - would be nice if everybody putting in new numbers would also update the totals, and note that change in the "Last Change/By" columns, too. It's a pain to figure that out afterwards. Thanks!�
Jun 7, 2015
glhs272 Probably reasonable to assume they are prioritizing new drive unit builds for new car production.
- - - Updated - - -
Not trying to be malicious, just being honest. Probably posting on the wrong thread for this. This was more in response to the comment that "that there is some warehouse full of new rear drive units to use up" or something like that. If there are, Tesla is holding them close to their vest. I too am very happy with my model S. The drive units being biggest issue I have had to deal with. Tesla has been excellent about it, and I couldn't ask for anything better from them. My car has never left me stranded. But in my experience is that they go for about 25,000 miles, at least with mine. Then they start to mill... It happens very slowly and is subtle. In fact I really didn't notice it much until I drove another Tesla that didn't make the noise. I had mine in for it's annual and Tesla found the drive unit failing. I still have this failing drive unit in my car, waiting for the new units to be built. The service center recommended this versus another re-furb (BTW the last two were refurbs). It was Tesla's description of the how the drive units fail, not mine. I too plan on keeping my car for 250,000 miles or more. I have full confidence Tesla will keep my car running just fine. I don't think the drive unit woes will be a big deal. Even long after they are out of warranty, they will be easily refurbished (just replace the bearings and get a good grounding wiper on the rotor to keep the current from flowing through the bearings). Hopefully this issue is only on a few early model S. I am glad yours doesn't seem to have the issue. Pass the kool-aid, it's very tasty.
Edit: Full disclosure, I am a Tesla long, heavily weighted in Tesla stock.
Edit2: I do not have or plan on getting the extended warrenty... How's that for confidence in the car. Also, to make it less confusing on drive unit lifetimes.. currently at 49K miles. Original drive unit replaced at 24K miles. Next drive unit replaced 5 miles later. 3rd drive unit still in car need to be replaced.
Edit3: For comparison my last car, A 2008 Honda Civic SI that I bought new, turned out to have a defective set of 3rd gear syncros in the transmission. Honda refused to fix it under warranty, said I didn't know how to shift. That says a lot about who I want to buy a car from
Edit4: I post this stuff because I don't think I would be doing Tesla or Tesla owners any favors by hiding these problems or sweeping them under the rug.�
Jun 7, 2015
hobbes I found May UK registration data, but Tesla is not specified, even though Chevy (1 car) and
Chrysler (4) are. This doesn�t seem fair... There are 184 "other" cars imported from outside
the UK listed - that is our upper bound, but hard to say how many of those are Teslas.
download the May 2015 new car registrations news release and data table
The news release including the table above is interesting though, seems like EVs are on a strong uptrend (not that this is a surprise
New car registrations grow steadily as ultra-low emission vehicles surge past 10k mark - SMMT�
Jun 7, 2015
hobbes Looked up the "other imports" to the UK from the SMMT website:
Oct 2014: 92
Nov 2014: 135
Dec 2014: 225
Jan 2015: 152 (100 estimate for Tesla in our table)
Feb 2015: 34 (!) (30 estimate for Tesla in our table)
Mar 2015: 323 (150 estimate for Tesla in our table)
Apr 2015: 179
May 2015: 184
For total Q1, our estimates were 280 for 509 in the "other imports" category. If we keep this ratio (55%), we get 98 and 101 for Apr/May 2015, so I think I would put 100 for those months. Comments/better ideas to come up with an estimate?!
Update:
From this official table (which only goes up to Q4/14 at this time) which was mentioned in this thread above, we get (numbers in table are cumulative!)
Q4 2014: 194
So that is 43% of the "other imports". As I think that the fraction of Tesla in this category should increase over time, I think the 100 for April/May is an o.k. estimate.�
Jun 10, 2015
hobbes Talking to myself here
That puts Europe total for May at 1062. Jan was 547, Feb 507, so May is more than the sum of those two months! On the other hand, still +1700 to go in June to match Q1. See wiki for details.�
Jun 10, 2015
RobStark 
�
Jun 10, 2015
Bgarret So by my figuring - to meet the same delivery numbers as Q1, Tesla needs to deliver 1663 cars in Europe in June vs. the 2358 cars they delivered in March. I like their chances and I'm interested in how much this improves their bottom line based on potentially lower shipping costs/overtime to achieve their numbers.
I would guess that Europe could be a 1200-1500 car market/month for the Model S when Great Britain gets the D versions and some of the smaller markets continue to mature - I think China will have to pitch in more to make the 48-50k of Model S happen in 2015 and 2016.�
Jun 14, 2015
Yggdrasill Some numbers for June were posted on the Norwgian EV forum; as of June 13th, there were:
- 191 new Model S registered
- 187 of these were AWD and 4 were RWD
That means that for Tesla, AWD currently has a 98% market share in Norway. (I would be surprised if Tesla still offers a RWD Model S in three months.)�
Jun 14, 2015
hobbes Was going to add it to wiki, but you did it already
Any idea how this number compares to March 13? Looks like registrations have picked up compared to Apr/May, but not enough to hit Q1 total. (I know the answer is probably within this thread, but don�t have the time to search right now.)
- - - Updated - - -
Gave myself 10 minutes anyway...
Compare percentage of cars delivered in the first half of the last month of Q1/Q2 relative of that month�s total (1140 in Mar, for June assuming same total (1532) for whole Q2 as in Q1):
Q1: 316/1140 = 28%
Q2: 191/(1532-230-346) = 20%
Looks like we are a bit behind. But then, we still have a day to go until 1st half of June
Hope theStreet doesn�t make any FUD out of this...�
Jun 14, 2015
smac Take it with a pinch of salt Hobbes, ULEV's include the Mitsubishi Outlander, and they are selling like hotcakes.
The latest government figures are out for Q1, and Mitsubishi sold 4,900 Outlanders here in Q1 alone. That brings their total to almost 10k units since UK launch, and I'd expect them to keep shifting units at those sorts of rates for a while longer yet.
The Model S in comparison sold 219 cars in Q1, which I'm sure must be slightly disappointing.�
Jun 14, 2015
hobbes Yeah, I wonder why they often mix EVs with hybrids. The article also has this plot though which differentiates EVs, and even though we don�t get the numbers, my estimate is about a factor of 2 from last year.
O.k., the estimate we had in the wiki was 280. Gonna change that. Do you have a source I can link to?�
Jun 14, 2015
smac Technically because the government targets here are based on ULEV adoption, not ZEV adoption.
The stuff that is really selling well that counts as ULEV is actually PHEV in the main.
i3 REX, Outlander, and even the i8 all outsold the Tesla. The Leaf has hung in, but mainly because of crazy finance discounts.
The i3 REX is pulling way ahead of the i3 BEV now, at 478 vs 271.
I hate to say it, but for the UK market a REX in the Model S would have probably made more sales traction than a faster 0-60 time or AWD. Q2 numbers here will be dire, as they've had no product to sell with people waiting until September for the D motor cars.
I don't mean to be all gloom and doom, but it's not looking great here atm. Sometimes it's just what the market wants, and even if you have the most fabulous product if no one wants to buy it, then it doesn't matter
All licensed vehicles and new registrations (VEH01) - Statistical data sets - GOV.UK�
Jun 14, 2015
Earlian There is a race for Q2 numbers - starting now.
This is one of severall pictures of European Service Centers, with a lot of cars, waiting to get delivered:
�
Jun 19, 2015
schonelucht Dutch car incentives will undergo a big change starting 2017. The current plan under discussion in the second chamber is not so favorable for the model S and model X but is very favorable for a cheaper full EV like the model 3. Basically fiscal incentives for a full EV will top out at 50 000EUR. PHEVs will loose all fiscal benefits. The Dutch government is also dropping the official target of 200 000 full EV cars by 2020. Since the Dutch car market is very sensitive to fiscal pricing incentives, I foresee a big positive impact on 2016Q4 Tesla sales and a big negative impact on 2017 sales.�
Jun 19, 2015
AnxietyRanger FWIW, I appreciate that. I get that there are disagreements on this, but personally I think it is both useful and helpful to have posters like you.�
Jun 19, 2015
glhs272 Thanks. I posted a follow up in a more appropriate thread. http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/29834-Drive-Unit-Replacement-Poll/page28�
Jun 20, 2015
hobbes New numbers from elbilforum.no for June as of 6/20 (thanks to MrBacardi for counting!):
384 new registrations
-including 380 dual motor, 4 rear wheel drive
-including 347 85 kWh and 37 with standard battery (60/70 kWh)
-including 382 with 5 seats and 2 with 4 seats (executive rear seats)
So the rate has about doubled compared to the first two weeks of June.
Someone from Norway please correct me if I didn�t translate this correctly.�
Jun 20, 2015
Car4CivilizedAge The above is correct. June sales will be about 1000 model s I reckon.
Also in the news from Norway: two biggest cities might abolish gasoline cars within inner city limits.�
Jun 20, 2015
Model 3 That was the headline. If you read the articles all the way down to the bottom it was talking about an environmental fee.
http://www.nrk.no/hordaland/vil-stenge-sentrum-for-vanlige-biler-1.12419197
(Google translated)
Some media also talked about an possible exception for AWD diesel cars?!?!?�
Jun 20, 2015
hobbes Wow... now that is a step forward! In comparison, Germany it thinking about opening bus lanes for electric cars but including hybrids.
Thanks for checking my translation.�
Jun 20, 2015
Yggdrasill I doubt there will be a ban. But if it's watered down to a $50-100 toll fee for the inner city for fossil cars, that will still be great.
I doubt it would mean much for the Model S or Model X, but Model 3 sales should benefit greatly from such a policy. (Though if the policy would also apply to taxis, Model X sales could really be affected.)�
Jun 20, 2015
hobbes Are there many Model X taxis in Norway�
Jun 20, 2015
Model 3 More headroom in the back-seat.
Easier entrance/exit.
Room for 7 adults.
Absolutely.�
Jun 20, 2015
hobbes Ok, makes sense, I guess. It�s just unusual around here to see SUV-type vehicles as taxis.�
Jun 20, 2015
Yggdrasill That's because their gas mileage sucks.�
Jun 20, 2015
hobbes That sounded a bit high for me at first... Then I looked back into the posts from March to see where we were at around Mar 20 and found this from Yggdrasil as of 2015-03-23:
Now that sounds like a realistic number�
Jun 20, 2015
Car4CivilizedAge Yeah, this was also my assumption. Another reason for a strong June is that people were afraid of a removal of incentives from 1. July( that didn't happen) so many of June deliveries were ordered in October after D announcement. (+Currency situation)�
Jun 21, 2015
smac I agree, the only spanner in the works is if Elon's "It's not cool to abuse local Superchargers" letter, expands into something with more legal teeth.
There were caveats being rumoured for commercial use. The UK taxis putting big miles on the cars purely from Supercharging, and causing congestion at Heathrow and we know the same is true in Amsterdam.
It's a real challenge, how do Tesla balance the economics of the car which is being swayed by the "free fuel" to the taxi fleet, yet still deliver a useable network for occasional long distance travel of private cars.
An interesting factoid. When O2 launched the unlimited data plan into the UK (the equivalent in many ways to the current free fuel for life), 0.1% of users used 36% of the data! This is when they started throttling, and eventually stopped offering the service altogether. Step 1 in them addressing the issue was to write an "education letter" obviously this didn't work.
History doesn't repeat but it often rhymes�
Jun 21, 2015
Yggdrasill Yeah, abusing the superchargers isn't cool. But the first non-Tesla operated supercharger recently opened in Sweden (though limited to 60 kW): Tesla Sold 60KW to a Business Owner | Electrek
It's likely that taxi companies buying hundreds of Model X will get access to buy Superchargers.
(Though the need for Supercharging for taxis isn't huge. The experience with the Model S is that it can last a whole shift on a full battery, so a 11 kW charger overnight is usually enough.)�
Jun 21, 2015
hobbes In Amsterdam they got 100 Model S (I think), wouldn�t that warrant building them their own Supercharger, given the huge publicity for Tesla (many people who never sat in one getting a test ride)?�
Jun 21, 2015
smac Hopefully, or Tesla put in dedicated Taxi Superchargers, and charge to use it. Who knows.
I agree if it's an owner operated Taxi it might be possible for city centre usage. That is not what's happening on the executive transport side, they are running them as close to 24/7 as they can with shift pattern drivers. Ultimately they have to recoup the �30k premium over a lightly used E class diesel.�
Jun 21, 2015
Model 3 From what I have read elsewhere they do indeed have one or more of this 60kW "fastchargers" - and some 22kW Type2.
�
Jun 21, 2015
Robert.Boston In NYC each taxi cab runs pretty much 24/7; drivers swap out, but the car stays in service. Supercharging is the only charging method to support that intensity. I'm not sure if the airport taxis are in the EU are used with the same pattern, though, or whether there's a late-night window for them to charge more slowly.�
Jun 21, 2015
Yggdrasill This is because the medallion is tied to the car, right? In Norway at least, there's a licence that is tied to either a person or company, and they can swap cars around freely, so there isn't the same focus on keeping the cars on the road 24/7. Many taxi drivers own their own cars and decide themselves how many hours they work and when. Of course, cars owned by taxi companies can certainly rack up the miles.�
Jun 21, 2015
mrdoubleb So I just learned this like 2 days ago - somehow missed it in local news. Tesla partnered wirth a company called Business Lease Group (a company of Dutch AutoBinck Holding N.V.) and have started leasing cars in Hungary as of 6.15 via this firm. Note, that Tesla is not in Hungary in any official capacity - there is no store or service center and as far as I knoiw the 1-2 Superchargers they plan setting up here later this year are being done from Vienna.
I have a feeling this means they won't really set up shop here for a few more years, maybe until Model 3, but this could add a few dozen leased cars to the EU total this year. Unfortunately i cannot help with Hungarian car registration data - it looks like it's not available for free, only via a company called DataHouse to vehicle manufacturers/importers who pay for the service.�
Jun 21, 2015
schonelucht Actual experience says differently : dutch taxis clock between 350 and 500km for a single shift so they need to charge in between. You can't just explain your customer that you're driving 90 to preserve battery. Furthermore : taxis don't know where their next destination will bring them, so they need to keep a larger buffer just in case the last customer asks them for a longer ride somewhere in the country. They absolutely need supercharging to make their business model work.�
Jun 21, 2015
Model 3 I think this is gone some OT, and should probably be moved to a "Tesla as Taxi" thread....
I have no experiences with taxies in NY or the Netherlands, but here they usually use a lot of time waiting in line for customers. If they could utilise this time to charge - even at low speed, there would be no need for any more charging. Except for any longer trips out of town where they would use the superchargers just like any other Tesla's on a trip.
My best guess to solve this is to have inductive charging at the taxi ranks.�
Jun 21, 2015
Yggdrasill Experiences will obviously differ between countries, regions, use cases, etc. The Norwegian Model S taxis are generally well served with overnight charging. And the occasional trip they have to pass up, they more than make up for in fuel savings.
To serve all the different needs, a range of of charging options will be required. Some will be okay with overnight charging. Some will need 22 kW chargers spread out. Some will need superchargers. Some will need CHAdeMO adapters. Etc.�
Jun 21, 2015
svp Are you sure the company is really a partner? Unless there's official statement by Tesla, I would take it with a grain of salt. Tesla hasn't done this in any other country, only direct so far.
There's a similar story in Russia with a company called Revolta Motors that seem to have no connection whatsoever with Tesla (in fact they haven't even bothered to update the website with "small" details like dual drive - Revolta Motors - премиальные �лектромобили: Tesla, Volvo, BMW.). They even had a press release with local mobile carrier Yota, claiming they are designing "special SIM cards for Tesla".
Could it be this Business Lease Group is doing it on their own - just buying Teslas elsewhere and leasing in Hungary?�
Jun 22, 2015
mrdoubleb Well, the PR said "in cooperation with Tesla Europe", but I also managed to find the news item on the English version of their website: http://www.businesslease.hu/en/about-us/news/2015/business-lease-is-the-first-to-offer-tesla-fleet-cars/�
Jun 27, 2015
hobbes News from MrBacardi from elbilforum.no (numbers for month of June as of the 27th):
521 new registrations
- including 517 D-models and 4 with rear wheel drive
- including 453 with 85 kWh og 68 with standard battery (60/70 kWh)
- including 517 with 5 seats and 4 with 4 seats (executive rear seats)
(Translation of this post: (Nesten) 1500 nye Model S registrert i Mars! )
- - - Updated - - -
This was on March 27:
So the end-of quarter-push seems much weaker this time after all. Last week it looked like the opposite. 1097 is the current total for Norway in Q2, after 1532 final in Q1. So looks like we�ll have a few hundered fewer registrations there than Q1. I know, you told me...
- - - Updated - - -
Maybe someone from Norway who is member at elbilforum can post some thanks to MrBacardi or we could crowd-fund a bottle or two for him
�
Jun 27, 2015
Krugerrand I think Mr. 'Bacardi' already has the bottle covered. Just sayin.�
Jun 27, 2015
schonelucht Is it possible that Tesla delivered comparatively more cars in the USA this quarter around since incentives in some states end on the 1st of July? A retrospective look at the delivery times thread seems to confirm the theory with June deliveries being available in the US for a much longer time than they were in Europe. July was the other way around, though!�
Jun 27, 2015
hobbes Yeah, incentives ending will likely have an influence. Apr and May were quite strong though in Europe, so I guess (hope) maybe the end-of-quarter push was redirected to those US states this time.�
Jun 30, 2015
mwulff Today the new danish government issued a statement that the tax-exemption for BEV's will not be extended beyond December 31st, 2015.
This has grave and serious consequences for Tesla in Denmark as their cars are the most expensive BEV's. A 70D will probably see a 50% price increase, while a P85D could see as much as 100-120%.
However the government has not presented the new "all-inclusive" tax model yet so we don't know exactly what kind of tax that a will be due on a Model S. But it is almost certain to be a lot. The danish government does not allow luxury.
If the tax-exemption expires and no reforms are made of the registration-tax-laws then all Tesla sales in Denmark will likely come to a complete stop on the 31st of December.
Source in danish:
Venstre dropper SR's afgiftsfritagelse for elbiler | Ingeniøren�
Jun 30, 2015
pGo Do we have the latest update from Norway? Thank you!�
Jun 30, 2015
hobbes Unlike last quarter there was an update on registration only once a week, I believe because they tried to prevent automated access to the registrations site that the elbilforum-guy ran a script on. Last number was 521 from Saturday (see above in this thread). I think there will be no update before official numbers come out in the next few days.�
Jun 30, 2015
Wenche I have now asked MrBacardi on the Norwegian elbilforum.no, of how fast he may deliver the numbers. I also gave him credits and geetings from TMC�
Jun 30, 2015
hobbes I just was looking at elbilforum to check for new numbers and saw your post, thanks! Funny how well one can understand another language in writing when you basically know what it is about.�
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