Jan 1, 2016
Blip Tesla tok fyr under hurtiglading - NRK Srlandet - Lokale nyheter, TV og radio
"I en melding til NRK skriver Tesla f�lgende om bilen som brant p� Brokelandsheia:
� Ingen ble skadet. Vi skal gj�re omfattende unders�kelser, for deretter � komme tilbake med flere svar."
Edit Translated:
"In a message to NRK Tesla writes the following about the car that burned on Brokelandsheia:
- No one was injured. We do extensive research and will then come back with more answers."�
Jan 1, 2016
Yggdrasill I can't find a direct qute from the fire department ragarding that specific issue, but I think it's fairly clear the fire department didn't know enough about EV fires. Google Oversetter Of course, they might never have extingusihed an EV fire before, so that isn't entirely strange.
Actual qute from the fire depatment:
"Generally, we are cautious about putting out fires in electric vehicles, because there is high voltage in the battery pack, and fighting the fire can involve danger to the crews and can cause other dangerous situations. In addition, each electric car differs when it comes to preferred method of extinguishing, says Hans Henrik Bakke, emergency manager in East Agder fire departments."�
Jan 1, 2016
JRP3
From the article:
That's not what they did, they apparently used the foam as containment only, and we don't yet know if the batteries were even involved.�
Jan 1, 2016
kennybobby TM will do a root cause investigation to determine what happened. There are many possible culprits due to the nature of the sensors, signal conditioning, communications, thermal management and control system, ESS charging and control, etc. The results will be reported by EM asap and used to modify monitoring circuits, firmware or interlocks as necessary to prevent this.�
Jan 1, 2016
FlatSix911 Interesting to note that only the steel B pillars remained while all of the aluminum structure melted away ...
�
Jan 1, 2016
Yggdrasill Another quote from the fire department:
"The car was entirely engulfed in flames when fire crews arrived. The only thing we could do was to contain the area and cool it off with foam, says duty officer Steinar Olsen in �stre Agder fire department to F�drelandsvennen."�
Jan 1, 2016
FlatSix911 
�
Jan 1, 2016
Right_Said_Fred First (possible) supercharging-related fire in say... 1 million supercharges (100,000 cars? 10 per car on average?). I am not too worried. But ofcourse it will be blown out of proportions again. As if there are not thousands of car fires every day!
While writing this post at least one gasoline powered car burned to the ground.�
Jan 1, 2016
FredTMC Note: I'm not speculating about the cause, just stating some facts (as I've observed).
Seems clear to me that the main HV cells became involved at some point and served as fuel for the fire. I can't imagine what other fuel source would be available to cause the car to completely burn up
thinking thru what's data is available to tesla, at a minimum they know the charge level of the HV battery and when charging started and when it ended. They also know the voltage and current being supplied to the car.
Beyond this, we don't know what if anything the car transmitted about its status to tesla. Certainly, tesla has prior status history of the car since it's not brand new.
Hopefully the prior owner and new current owner are fully cooperative with tesla in their investigation.
As a side note, I recall that tesla designed the cell layout so that a single cell failure doesn't propagate to neighboring cells.�
Jan 1, 2016
David99 Looking at this photo, I'm pretty sure the battery burnt up. There isn't enough other flammable material in the car to fuel a fire strong/hot enough to melt aluminum away like we see here. What caused the fire is a different issue but I'm pretty sure the battery has burnt up.
Whatever the cause, this is really bad news for Tesla and EVs in general. Yes we all know more ICE burn up and they burn much more dangerously, but the public's perception and facts rarely match.�
Jan 1, 2016
Yggdrasill Third quote:
"Electric car fires is pretty new to us here in Agder. It's pretty rare for electric cars to burn, and when they do burn, the litium-ion batteries make it more challenging, says Anders Torbj�rnsen at the fire department operations central in Agder."�
Jan 1, 2016
smac @Yggdrassill. Thanks for the link:
Is there a translation glitch here? (Seems common for Google to invert meaning by missing out a negating phrase between Norwegian and English)
" They had pulled the car away from the charging station, but was not trying actively to extinguish the fire, since there was a risk to life or other property."
I presume it means
" They had pulled the car away from the charging station, but was not trying actively to extinguish the fire, since there was NO risk to life or other property."
�
Jan 1, 2016
DavidB According to: Vehicle fire trends and patterns
"According to the U.S Federal Highway Administration data, roughly 2,980 billion miles were driven, on average, per year on U.S. roads during this period. Roughly 90 highway vehicle fires and 0.15 highway vehicle fire deaths were reported per billion miles driven."
On average, 90 highway vehicle fires per billion miles driven. There have been (maybe) 1.2 billion miles driven in Teslas, so you might expect 1.2*90 or 108 fires. There have been only 6 fires.�
Jan 1, 2016
Yggdrasill This is the first time we've seen a Tesla fire where it has been allowed to burn out. Aluminium is flammable, as is all the plastics, transmission oil, etc.
This is what a burned Fisker Karma looks like, where the battery pack was intact:
- - - Updated - - -
Indeed. Google translate sucks at times.�
Jan 1, 2016
nwdiver Well... a Fisker also has a gas tank... the ignition temperature of aluminum is >700C... I have a really hard time imagining anything in the car except the battery producing that kind of heat.
Be interesting to see what the investigation reveals...�
Jan 1, 2016
Hoffa Video
http://www.vgtv.no/#!/video/122942/her-staar-teslaen-i-full-fyr�
Jan 1, 2016
Doug_G That confirms that the battery pack was involved. Nice little pop with a bunch of sparks. Doesn't mean it started in the pack, of course.
Also aluminum will burn at a high enough temperature.
We should also point out that this is only newsworthy at all because it's a Tesla. Hundreds of gas cars a day burn in the USA alone.�
Jan 1, 2016
smac The problem with averages is that not all cars are average, some are decidedly sub-par.
We have a big thing here with Vauxhall Zafira's catching fire. They are mainly old ones, that have been poorly maintained, with people replacing switches which fail due to blocked cabin filters with cheap knock off chinese parts.
Root cause found for Vauxhall Zafira fires | Autocar
The amazing thing is GM recalled all the cars to check for botched repairs done outside their dealer network on cars approaching 10yrs old!
Anyway back on topic, does this or any other Tesla fire article make me think my car is going to spontaneously combust? Nope.
One thing really not going for Tesla is quite how spectacular the end result looks, whilst a fire damaged ICE it may just look superficially scorched, it's just as totalled.
The reality is in a case like this where the fire brigade can just wheel the car out the way cordon it off and leave it, with an ICE they have to put out the fire in case of a fuel tank explosion, and further risk to property or life. Unfortunately the former leads to more headline grabbing pictures like this one.
Of course most people aren't that capable of critical thinking like this but that's a whole different story
�
Jan 1, 2016
stopcrazypp The car has plastics (a petroleum based product), cloth, leather and other flammable materials inside. Let's see what the investigation says before drawing conclusions.
Definitely not a good way to start the year though.�
Jan 1, 2016
yobigd20 Those look like aftermarket 20s.�
Jan 2, 2016
mmccord Someone posted that the temp stalls are faster than the permanent ones (perhaps because they are newer). Not sure how many 90kw chargers are left around the world�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill This was a new owner, so I doubt that had anything to do with it. It was probably just a psychological choice made in the moment. Like some people prefer to sit in a corner with a view of the room.�
Jan 2, 2016
thegruf [speculation] if the shed emitting the white smoke (oil smoke?) contains step down transformer(s), could it be that one of these failed and resulted in excess volts being directed atthe SC stall and car? If the car was to overdraw current then you would expect trips to trip. IT does seem the earlier shots have more white smoke from the shed than later ones which might support thoughts an intial failure here.�
Jan 2, 2016
tom66 Well that confirms that the fire either began at the rear of the car or in the passenger compartment and NOT in the battery as the battery vents out the front of the car. Interesting that the hatch appears to be open. Could it be something as silly as the motor for the power liftgate jamming and overheating?
The original European chargers are 105kW IIRC, the next gen are 135kW but 120kW max per car. (Or ~67kW/car if shared) and the temporary stalls are usually rated 135kW depending on the supply capability.
My prediction: Early 2013 P85, second owner, Norway. The drive unit will have been replaced due to high failure rate. As part of the service the HVJB may have been serviced. During service, tech disconnected battery bolts. Later they were reconnected but inadequately. As a result, overheating occurred during supercharging. (Could equally apply to HVJB connecting to HVAC battery heater/AC chiller)
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=60398&d=1412123709�
Jan 2, 2016
robin051 Great news! I have been waiting for something to send the share price down.�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill You mean early 2014 S85. I also supect the HVJB somewhat.
I wonder if the previous owner never supercharged, or hadn't done it since a service where the HVJB was opened, and the first thing the new owner did was to do a road trip. This would explain why it happened two days after a new owner took posession and it would fit with the approximate location of the ignition source.�
Jan 2, 2016
tom66 Right... 2014 for Europe (unless imported but then it wouldn't supercharge.) It could have been that the HVJB overheated at the higher charge rate, possibly due to a lower SOC. (New owner might have run the pack lower than expected.)
Tesla do sense the temperature at the charge connector for the supercharger, but I doubt they sense the temperature at internal components.�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill Someone mentioned in the short-term investor thread that they didn't sense the temperature in the HVJB in the first revision, but that they added it to later revisions. The car in question is probably old enough to have the first revision.�
Jan 2, 2016
Skotty Regarding people in the back at a fueling station, they shouldn't be left alone there unless they are capable enough to get themselves out; this includes being able to crawl to the front if needed for rear seat passengers. That goes for all cars, not just Teslas. It's not a concern (at least not in current society) if a rear door can't be opened from the inside. Pretty much all cars these days come with a button that explicitly prevents rear doors from being opened from the inside, mostly to prevent children from smashing their doors into things or opening the door while the car is moving.�
Jan 2, 2016
Caligula Per capita? Maybe not. There are states here that have laws preventing you from pumping your own gas. An attending employee must do it for you.�
Jan 2, 2016
DougH Have any comments been posted on any media outlets from the owner of the car?�
Jan 2, 2016
dpeilow I was once on an electric train that caught fire. Dangerous things with all those megawatts flowing through the floor constantly.�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill This is all I've seen: Google Oversetter
�
Jan 2, 2016
asudan This is the most helpful picture IMO.
1) Steam or smoke coming from the infrastructure cabinet appears to be a transformer smoking (failing)
2) Fire appears to be initially isolated on the charging port side of the car.
3) Color of flame might indicate temperature of the fire isn't hot enough to be the batteries burning - can someone with more knowledge of this chime in?�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill I don't think the smoke is coming from the transformers. I think something happened to the car that threw white smoke, just before the picture was taken. Possibly a gas strut or something went off.
Disagree. Looks like the fire is in the entire trunk/rear seat area.�
Jan 2, 2016
Stretch2727 But I would think they would sense DC voltage directly at the battery, inverter and charge port? This should detect a loose or poor connection under load in the HVJB (i.e driving, charging etc.).
Anyway, we are just guessing at a cause.
Have not seen anything in the main stream media. Surprising quiet.�
Jan 2, 2016
AmpedRealtor I think this is prudent advice until the cause of the fire is determined. Although what happened in Norway is most likely the first time anything like this has occurred, it's not worth the risk in my opinion. All it takes is one time.�
Jan 2, 2016
tom66 Right - but just a few volts dropped in the wrong area could be a huge amount of power dissipated, with temperature rise being inversely proportional to the area over which the power is dissipated (so a loose bolt could mean a lot of power dissipated over the small contact patch that remains.) I know Tesla measure battery voltage, for charge management, but do they measure the voltage at the charge port too?
The other possibly, because the trunk almost looks like it is open (the black bar in the fire might be part of the frame) it could be possible that an overheated motor due to jam might cause a fire. Spontaneous cause would be user accidentally opening trunk by pressing keyfob, trunk getting stuck somehow which is not detected by the controller (for unknown reasons), heated motor & fire. I imagine the motor is pretty beefy, in order to lift the heavy glass.�
Jan 2, 2016
GoTslaGo Wow that bites. Good thing no one was hurt.�
Jan 2, 2016
dpeilow It has been said elsewhere that in the videos the supercharger plug appears to be stowed in its holster on the supercharger frame.�
Jan 2, 2016
Iowa92x Watch the video again and notice the white smoke streaming from the small shed to the right. Did the fire originate there or the car first? Tesla Model S caught fire / Her står Teslaen i full fyr - YouTube�
Jan 2, 2016
WMAC The one in the left looks holstered in this pic.
And the one on the right looks holstered in this pic. Not sure if those cables are the SC cables or internal cables.
�
Jan 2, 2016
AmpedRealtor There is definitely smoke coming from that shed where the transformer is located... If this was caused by the Supercharger itself, I hope this doesn't negatively impact Tesla's ability to obtain property leases for new Supercharger installations. I also wonder if there is any possibility that the equipment had been tampered with?�
Jan 2, 2016
dpeilow Looks like frost evaporating from the heat to me.�
Jan 2, 2016
Cobbler So the conclusion of the fire is, based on the pictures:
- a temporary charger unit overheated while charging the car, resulted in the cabinet to explode. The MS caught fire and this resulted in the total car loss.
"Nothing" to worry about really. This is not a structural problem for TM. A matter of stricter installation/safety guidelines when installing a charger unit.�
Jan 2, 2016
dpeilow A bit premature I think.�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill You have three sheds. The one directly behind the burning Tesla is where the supercharger cabinets for the permanent superchargers are housed. The red one I think houses the transformer for the hotel - it predates the superchargers. And then a bit further behind the burning Tesla, you have the main transformer for the supercharger. Circled in red.
�
Jan 2, 2016
Caligula There is way too much assuming going on in this thread. My face and palm both hurt from so much physical contact.
Now, I'm just waiting for this guy to show up...
�
Jan 2, 2016
tom66 I doubt the charger failure caused the car to catch fire, but it's more than possible that a fire in the car damaged the charger, which caused a transformer overload.
The reason I doubt that we're seeing a charger failure is that there is a doubly-redundant pair of contactors, one at the car side and one at the charger side. Should a failure in the charger occur, causing the system voltage to rise, the contactors should disengage, preventing much energy from being dumped into the car. Also, the charger unit used in the Model S has complete isolation between the HVB and the mains connection, so a mains-side transient can't inject much, if any, energy into the system.�
Jan 2, 2016
Cobbler
My impression is that a lot of people are overreacting on this event. If I read statements like "buyers will never trust EV's again; the battery is a potential bom; no passengers allowed in the car while supercharging; TSLA shares will go down; supercharger design faulted;.... "
Let's wait until further investigation has been done and the Norwegian CSI team has revealed the real cause of this event.
No captain Picard facepalm, but a Spock image would be more in place
�
Jan 2, 2016
Jgint I am serious and I agree. It is more a matter of foreseeability or cause and effect that are up in the air and unknowns right now.
Look I am a very happy Tesla owner. So much so that I have referred tons of people regardless of reward programs or not (Friends, family, business associates, etc.). I am also a decent sized stock holder.
I am simply saying I will could not leave any aged person in a Tesla while supercharging after seeing that picture and not worry. That is until we fully understand what happened. Then we can know the foreseeable risks if any. I am not bashing Tesla or being one sided here. We simply must learn what caused this before I feel as safe as I did before. I am not comparing to ICE cars or ICE statistics. Of course a tesla is better and I agree. Thats why I own one.�
Jan 2, 2016
AlMc You might find this post interesting: WK057 is pretty well known on TMC, especially when it comes to the electronics in a model S. he has torn apart a battery pack..etc. etc...
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/59770-Short-Term-TSLA-Price-Movements-2016?p=1302596&viewfull=1#post1302596�
Jan 2, 2016
Saghost I actually thought this one was more useful:
Short-Term TSLA Price Movements - 2016 - Page 8
Some good discussion going on in that other thread.
Walter�
Jan 2, 2016
3mp_kwh From that WK057 post, about "bus bars" accidentally being used. VIN25XXX was likely serviced in the days/week before it caught fire. It was just bought. I know I'm adding a face palm here, but have to wonder if employees of a service center in Norway aren't a little nervous. They wouldn't use bus bars, but is it possible someone could have bypassed a fuse during a routine charge port replacement? The VIN implies a "B" battery. That is more odds-making but it helps not point to a 90kw max "A" unit somehow getting 115kw.�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill No "A" batteries were delivered in Norway.�
Jan 2, 2016
Ingineer There have been plenty of US-spec cars exported to Norway. I'm sure there are a few A packs still running around, though the charge port would be incompatible with the SpC there.�
Jan 2, 2016
Yggdrasill No, not many. I think two or three. A couple of demo cars and one in the Bergen area, all made in 2012.�
Jan 2, 2016
S4WRXTTCS Yeah, that's all correct but it's one thing to know and another thing to actually do it. So my plan is to try it because in emergency situations people tend to freak out, and I would encourage other people to test it as well. If I was a parent my primary concern would be that my kids could hit the manual release under the carpet.
There are so many cases completely unrelated to fire that you want to get passengers out of the car. I don't care to compare it to an ICE car, but to acknowledge the reality of what it takes to escape a car we own. The biggest danger is probably escaping the car due to flooding (flash floods, etc), and not fire.
So instead of freaking out about this fire which we have no idea what caused it we should focus on knowing our cars, and creating a simple guide of how to test escaping this car if there is an electrical glitch/problem. What fuses to pull to test it.�
Jan 2, 2016
Lerxt Don't tell the Transport Department, they might ban Superchargers.�
Jan 2, 2016
stopcrazypp Looking at the latest pictures, I think it is clear the fire started in the rear of the car. It doesn't seem likely it was the battery then. Hopefully there is still enough left to find out the cause.�
Jan 2, 2016
brucet999 Actually, the auto shut-off trips the nozzle mechanism, not the pump. You can easily restart it by pulling the lever, although in a full tank it will nearly instantly shut off again and remain off even if you are still gripping the lever.
- - - Updated - - -
The driver borrowed the car from a 2-day owner. What would he know about supercharger capabilities?
- - - Updated - - -
To fail that way, a step-down transformer would have to grow more coils of wire on its secondary (output) side. Not very likely, to say the least
- - - Updated - - -
And HVJB = what? High voltage junction box?
- - - Updated - - -�
Jan 2, 2016
tom66 Yes. HVJB is the high-voltage junction box.
On 2012-2014 single-motor cars, it's located behind the rear seats between the chargers.
On 2014-onwards, there's a HVJB in the rear and one in the front, for dual motor cars.�
Jan 2, 2016
wdolson Could be steam from the water and snow on the ground evaporating. There may have been some water that collected in some container near the car that boiled off as the car got going.
- - - Updated - - -
It is possible the fire started somewhere in the charging hardware. Though it's also possible the fire didn't start as an electrical fire at all. As many have pointed out, nobody knows right now, but we'll probably find out more in the next week.
Just thinking about the stock price stuff mentioned above. Monday will be the first day with the markets open and investors will have the news of the fire as well as the 4th quarter production report out there.�
Jan 2, 2016
AudubonB I am not the HongKong moderator, but respectfully ask all to abide by TMC rules and NOT TO CONTINUE this thread as there is an extremely active one with 22 pages and 219 posts at the time I write this, here: A Model S just caught fire while supercharging in Norway (link in Norwegian)�
Jan 2, 2016
bonnie It doesn't look like it was connected to the Supercharger or started in the battery. So many things it could have been ... a hoverboard received at Christmas, an iPhone charging in the car. Let's wait til we hear the facts.�
Jan 2, 2016
JRP3 You must be new around here :wink:�
Jan 2, 2016
wdolson It appears the threads were merged. I believe three different threads were merged into this one.�
Jan 2, 2016
Auzie
�
Jan 2, 2016
S'toon Why on Earth is this thread now in Hong Kong?�
Jan 2, 2016
AlMc because they want us to make new friends/meet new people?�
Jan 2, 2016
JRP3 Thread merge mayhem.�
Jan 2, 2016
Auzie I like that idea. I was planning to visit this place
they have some cool topics going, but Honk Kong is equally cool�
Jan 2, 2016
wdolson It appears the mod merged the Model S sub-forum thread into the Hong Kong thread instead of merging the Hong Kong thread into the Model S thread.�
Jan 2, 2016
smac Sorry it was posted on another forum and not attributed.�
Jan 3, 2016
GreenT Sorry, don't have time to read entire thead(s) count - greater now that my sheets! - but question ...
The video ... who took the video? Coincidence that it covers almost the entire event? Reminds me of the video of the car burn1ng on an off ramp 2 years ago?
Could it be staged?�
Jan 3, 2016
Yggdrasill The video was a reader video sent in to the online newspaper VG. Edit: I went back and watched the video, the person who shot the video was Hanna Otto Treldal. Some online stalking tells me this is a teacher that lives about an hour away from where the fire was by car.
It's probably not staged. The fire was right next to a hotel and a busy intersection. I would be surprised if this is the only video out there.�
Jan 3, 2016
Rane Just some thinking, maybe it has been discussed before but I couldn't find it.
One picture show what appears to be the trunk open and a video seems to show the charging cables still hanging "holstered".
Could it have been that the driver (not the owner) backed the car up to the charger, opened the trunk to get something and accidentally set of something, a cigarette or perhaps just noticed that something was wrong. Panicked (the car was not his/hers and fairly expensive), ran of and acted as if the fire started after he/she left the car charging. Called the emergency services and told the story to direct the blame on something else? Once he/she told that version it might have felt hard to back away from it and change the story.
It must not be a deliberate insurance/"get a new car out of goodwill"-scam. It could just have been an accident and panic...�
Jan 3, 2016
Earlian You have a video that's filming over an hour? I only know videos with half minute, but not more.
Please share the link to this video with almost the whole entire event.
Thx�
Jan 3, 2016
bonnie I have no idea what I was thinking.�
Jan 3, 2016
Yggdrasill You probably weren't thinking. :tongue:
MORE SPECULATION! FASTER!
How do we even know it was a Model S that burned? Maybe it was a close facsimile made out of papier-mache? And are we certain the fire was on Earth? The pixels tells me the video was made entirely in Photoshop. And is that Jeremy Clarkson I see in the background?�
Jan 3, 2016
Yggdrasill More seriously: I found another video in this article: Aust-Agder Blad - Kraftig brann i el-bil på Brokelandsheia�
Jan 3, 2016
Matias Are there Jimmy Hoffa and Elvis standing in the background?�
Jan 3, 2016
Doug_G One post moved to snippiness.�
Jan 3, 2016
russman I know ICEs cause a lot of fires and we like to compare them to our Tesla, does anyone have a measurement of cars 4 or 5 years or newer and catching on fire? That would be a better statistic to compare to Tesla. Comparing a 20 year old car with old parts and hoses isn't quite a fair comparison.
Also, all the speculation is impressive, considering there's always 3 sides to a story. So will be curious to see if we can ever find out the truth.�
Jan 3, 2016
JRP3 So just thinking of possible fire fighting solutions, I wonder about shot crete or aircrete being sprayed onto a car. No liquid water to run all over the ground which should greatly reduce any chance of shock, and I think those would really cover and smother a fire. Any fire experts with insight? Even a conventional cement truck with a chute might be able to get close enough and just dump a few tons of concrete on it. Then once cured just haul away the giant brick :biggrin:�
Jan 3, 2016
ohmman SecureFoam to the rescue!
�
Jan 3, 2016
Hoffa I guess some investigation is going to take place by the police or Tesla. A tent covers the SC and car. The picture is taken a couple of houres ago.
�
Jan 3, 2016
Blip ... And the white stuff on the ground is snow. The white in the photos from the fire was foam (probably AFFF). The weather has produced some snow since yesterday.�
Jan 3, 2016
Lessmog OK, so now ... where's Elvis??!�
Jan 3, 2016
smac On the moon living in a London double decker bus, everyone knows this.�
Jan 3, 2016
mgoetzke Bj�rn already confirmed Tesla was investigating�
Jan 3, 2016
DougH Isn't he in Thailand?....I wonder if he knows the owner of the car.�
Jan 3, 2016
Yggdrasill Thanks for the picture.
It is good to know they are preserving the evidence. If we're talking about arson or something similar, it could be that someone should be arrested. If so, it's important to have good evidence.
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I just watched his video and he doesn't seem to know anything not mentioned in this thread. So he likely read this thread or the one on the Norwegian EV forum.�
Jan 3, 2016
mgoetzke He wrote something on Facebook about that incident and said he had contacted Tesla then. It was shortly after the news got wind of it.�
Jan 3, 2016
Zythryn Surprisingly, it is pretty close.
This is a long report, and is based on 2003-2007. I'll keep looking for a newer one.
In this report, figure 6 on page 24 seems to be the best match to your question.
Newer cars seem to have a higher incidence of intentional fires and fires due to collision/accidents.
Older cars (5-10 year) have a higher incidence of mechanical/electrical fires.
They balance out fairly well, with a slight increase in the 5-15 year old cars from the looks of it.
http://www.nfpa.org/~/media/files/research/nfpa-reports/vehicles/vehiclefires08.pdf?la=en�
Jan 3, 2016
brucet999 I couldn't help noticing the steady decrease in fires from 1980 onward. May correlate with reduction of Volkswagen Beetles on the roads?
I remember seeing many of those that caught fire due to failure of a rubber fuel hose above the engine.�
Jan 3, 2016
lucy SMH
Tesla, even your coverups are classy!�
Jan 3, 2016
wdolson The Ford Pinto fire problem peaked around 1980 too.�
Jan 3, 2016
ohmman OK, you mentioned it. I have to post this "Top Secret" clip.
�
Jan 3, 2016
McHoffa Hoping it's a problem that has nothing to do with the car or the media will have a field day...
Nice name :smile:�
Jan 3, 2016
EarlyAdopter In case people missed it, we have a whole thread over here dedicated to the dangers of gas stations:
Gas stations are dangerous!
Warning: some of these are a bit graphic and disturbing.�
Jan 3, 2016
Canuck The odds of kids being hit by a car and injured in the parking lot are astronomically higher than being burned in the car. So if safety is the concern, leave them in the car.�
Jan 4, 2016
freeewilly I'm not drawing final conclusion here, but in this case, it's more likely Tesla is at fault, this accident is not on public street or someone's garage, it's a Model S charging at a Tesla Super Charging Station.
Anyway, my question is, who will pay for the damage of the burned Model S?�
Jan 4, 2016
tom66 Tesla, the warranty covers all accidental fire damage. I wouldn't be surprised if Tesla are taking very good care of the driver to keep them from saying too much to the press. That being said the press reaction has been surprisingly muted.�
Jan 4, 2016
S4WRXTTCS But, in this case the driver isn't the owner.
So Tesla gets to take care of TWO people.
What I find fascinating is how various Tesla related User Groups are handling it. The local Northwest Tesla Owners Facebook group seems to have opted to delete all posts related to it. Apparently they're of the belief that hiding it under the bed somehow does anyone any good.
Sometimes bad things happen when transporting large amounts of energy. That's just how it is pretty much regardless of the energy source.
All we can do is try to make it as a safe as possible, and what to do in the event that it happens.
Like with the Tesla it's critical to understand that the rear doors are electromechanical and each one has an emergency release latch in the carpet. That you need to use the latch to open the door in this kind of event. The same thing is true with a modern corvette for it's doors.�
Jan 4, 2016
EarlyAdopter Perhaps because a car catching fire at a filling station is so common it's hardly news worthy?
A police car caught fire in November while filling up:
Temple University police car catches fire at North Philadelphia gas station | 6abc.com
A Ferrari caught fire in October while filling up:
Ferrari Catches Fire, Rolls Away On Its Own From Gas Station in Martinez | NBC Bay Area
I could go on and on, month after month, without end...
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I wonder if there's more to this story than it seems. This quote from a Quora posting last year is interesting:
How do cars catch on fire? - Quora
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Jan 4, 2016
fredag The supercharger at Sundebru / Brokelandsheia has been closed since this incident happened on January 1st. But the supercharger is still visible in the nav in the car and in Teslas web map of superchargers, without any notes.
I'm sure that Tesla is aware that this supercharger is down. Why don't they update the supercharger map in the car with a note informing drivers that this site is still closed?
The Norwegian Tesla owners club has sent a chademo adapter down to the nearest gas station, so that people who are stranded there at least can charge at 50kW at the chademo charger.�
Jan 4, 2016
Lessmog At least the map at supercharge.info has Sundebru marked as closed. But it would certainly be much better if the Tesla navigator were updated too, so people don't get stranded.�
Jan 4, 2016
frosken I wonder if it has something to do with the air intakes being blocked by snow and thus not providing cooling for the battery.
This is how my car looked when I parked in my garage after a week in the mountains. The intakes were completely blocked by hard snow.
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Jan 4, 2016
Yggdrasill No, if the battery gets too hot, the car will shut down and refuse to charge. This fire likely has nothing to do with the battery.�
Jan 4, 2016
WarpedOne Nor charging.
My bet is on pyrotechnics gone wrong...�
Jan 4, 2016
DjiM Imagine having a seat at the burger joint, and -while feasting on those delicious french fries- semi-automatically checking the car with your smartphone to make sure that it's still charging. And then seeing this...
Better turn on that climate control...�
Jan 4, 2016
lolachampcar Oh, you're bad........
:0�
Jan 4, 2016
Earlian Know, it wasn't for real but, will respond anyway:
The least you want provide to a fire is more oxygen....
"Bioweapon defense mode" might be a solution, if the fire is only inside the car and if this function closes intake and pushs air out of the car?�
Jan 4, 2016
Chickenlittle I have not seen any but as I remember they are guaranteed against fire and if so abroad he should get new car�
Jan 4, 2016
jason.a I found the perfect solution when I was out at the hardware store a few days ago... :biggrin:
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Jan 4, 2016
Yggdrasill The guarantee isn't applicable if we're talking about arson or negligence. The owner should be getting a new car, and depending on the cause of the fire, either Tesla or the insurance company will cover the cost. (Assuming he has insurance that covers fires, and not just basic coverage.)
If the cause of the fire is arson and he doesn't have insurance, he needs to sue the arsonist. If it's negligence and he doesn't have insurance, he's out of luck.�
Jan 4, 2016
MsElectric I too have a feeling that this fire has absolutely nothing to do with the battery and likely neither the charger nor anything to do with Tesla.
The facts will come out.�
Jan 4, 2016
Jaff Also from the nfpa... Fires in the U.S.
In 2014, there were "�193,500 were vehicle fires, causing 345 civilian fire deaths, 1,450 civilian fire injuries, and $1.5 billion in property damage."
Although the number of vehicle fires have decreased, 193,000 vehicle fires in a year (2014) ain't much to crow about imo...still totally unacceptable...
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Jan 4, 2016
dhanson865 Bioweapon defense mode causes positive pressure by bringing in more air than can exit. No it does not directly push air out of the car. No it does not close intakes.
It opens the intakes and ramps fans up to max speed pulling way more air into the car.
*note push/pull are imatterial here because the fans are intake fans it really doesn't matter if they are in front of the filter or behind the filter they'll still increase intake airflow and bring more air into the car.�
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