Oct 27, 2013
RainmakerJL Test drove the p85+ today... Really like the tesla a lot. Questions abound. How many miles should I expect on a set of tires? Do the fronts and backs wear equally? How is it in stop and go traffic with the creep/regenerative breaking (I commute to Manhattan daily). How much charge will I get at a supercharger in 20 mins.. I was already in the market to buy in this range.. Panamera vs Tesla p85+.... Any thoughts or advice?�
Oct 27, 2013
jerry33 Tire life depends on the tires, the alignment, maintaining tire pressure, and the amount of fun you have. The rear tires do most of the work, so they will most likely wear quicker than the front.
Stop and go traffic is a breeze in the Model S. It's so much more an extension of your body than any other car.
Supercharging is really only for trips. Normally you just charge at home where charging time--meaning the time you have to wait--is practically zero. Superchargers taper off as the battery becomes full, so the actual amount you get depends on what the charge level was when you started. Best case is about 50% in 20 minutes.�
Oct 27, 2013
Zaxxon TexEx in 3... 2... 1...�
Oct 27, 2013
RainmakerJL I travel to Toronto from New york a lot in our mini-van was hoping to find a way to do it in the tesla but if we are only getting 150 miles in 20 minutes. that is 3 stops... thats a bit crazy... i am assuming the 50% in 20 minutes is if you are near empty right? what if you already are at half way? Also, how is it in the winter with winter tires?�
Oct 27, 2013
GaryREM I think at this point, you don't have SuperChargers in place to support a New York to Toronto run. You need to wait until the ones in NY state are in place. Then you can see how many stops and where. Also, no one said you had to stop charging after 20 minutes. And you should be starting out on a full charge.
To really calculate this, you need to find out where you're going to be recharging.�
Oct 27, 2013
jerry33 Let's say below 50%. It's the 80% to 100% which is very slow.
Toronto to NYC is about 500 miles (800 km). In winter during very bad conditions, you'll get 180 miles (290 km) with no problems. In better conditions you'll get over 200--you don't want to drive on the last three electrons in the same way that you don't want to drive on the last three ounces of fuel. It's about a 7.5 hour drive, so two pit stops and a lunch stop are pretty normal. You won't really be stopped any longer than in an old fashioned car. (Unlike my trips to Nebraska where there aren't any Superchargers so I charge at RV parks.) My take is that a 20-30 minute stop every 150 miles will contribute more to highway safety than just about anything else.
The posts from last winter indicating that the Model S is fine in winter when equipped with four proper studless winter tires such as Nokian R2, Michelin X Ice, Bridgestone Blizzak, etc. You'll really want to get a set of 19" wheels and tires for this because the very low profile 21" tires and wheels are sensitive to potholes and don't have real winter tires available anyway. The lower the profile, the worse the winter traction because the contact area doesn't conform to the irregular surfaces found in winter driving. The Model S has traction control and vehicle stability control, both of which do wonders in slippery conditions.�
Oct 27, 2013
ckessel 500 miles is probably 2 stops, depending on where they're located. Start out full, go ~200 miles, recharge and go ~150, repeat one more time. Call it 1 hour of charging, 8 hours of driving. However, that will very much depend on where the SCs are. In the midst of winter, add another 30 minutes of charging to account for needing more range with cold weather.�
Oct 27, 2013
texex91 Sorry late to this one.
Have owned three 911's and the P85+ blows them away period.
Tires, well the tires on the + are much sportier than Pan--and hold the car to the ground like cement.
The Pan is nice, but the torque and drive of + are really no comparison if you ask me. I've driven all Panamera , and nothing (maybe Turbo) comes close--and that's a BIG maybe.
There are plenty of ex-Porsche owners here, and most are in P+.
And trust me--TRUST ME, you will get more looks in a P+ than ANY Panamera.
Get the P+--recommendation of a (ex) Porsche guy.�
Oct 27, 2013
RainmakerJL So we test drove today and my wife said that while we were on the interstate a guy pulled up beside us and stared as long as he could keep up (not long).
I thinking my test drive the car was limited to 80mph. i don't know for sure but i hit 80 and stayed at 80 (for a second i thought it was KMS because it got there so fast and i am canadian).... Is that possible?
how long do your back tires las t and how long do the front?�
Oct 27, 2013
texex91 Yes demo cars are limited to 80. Can do 130'ish.
Tires can vary as you know--probably 7500'ish miles.
But if you are interested in Porsche or P+ you will want the best tires, and so wear shouldn't matter if you can afford it.�
Oct 27, 2013
Shumdit
It was likely limited to 80 MPH, not KMH. Drove the Panamera and really liked it, but the back seat was a little too claustrophobic and the cent console a little high and busy with all of the buttons. That being said, I did like the way it drove. Then I drove the Tesla and LOVED the way it drove. Easy decision for me.�
Oct 27, 2013
RainmakerJL Test drive was in NY so it was definitely MPH... i am just saying as a canadian who is custom to getting to 80KM/H quickly, when i saw 80 that quickly it just was a little muscle memory until i turned to the sales person and said... did i just get to 80mph? She nicely said, yes.. thats 80 mph... btw. Someone was saying that there was a 70AMP charging station in both albany and syracuse at a best western. how long does charging take at a 70 amp station? is it similar to a home charging station?�
Oct 27, 2013
Duckjybe I have over 20,000 km on my 21" continental tires and still have lots of life in them and they are wearing evenly...and I floor it at every light! So much fun!!!!!�
Oct 27, 2013
Mayhemm 70-amp chargers are the next best thing to a full-power Tesla HPWC (80-amp). They'll charge around 56 mph (90 kph). Not Supercharger quick by any means, but still nicer than most public chargers *cough*chargepoint*cough*.
Note: You must have twin chargers installed in your Model S to charge with greater than 40 Amps. The stations above will still work with a single charger, albeit at a slower rate.�
Oct 27, 2013
SFOTurtle Take a look at the Supercharger map. Looks to me like they'll have Superchargers between Toronto and NYC sometime next year. May not be until the end of the year, but if you're planning to keep the car for a while, you should be able to take advantage of these in the not too distant future.
Caveat for the following: I confess I have a serious Tesla bias. But I confess that the one car that really makes no sense to me, I mean no sense, for someone who might be in the market for a Model S, is the Panamera. I've driven one, and been driven in one, and every time I see one on the road I can only think: "Tesla wannabe." Seriously, I look at the Panamera and wonder why would anyone ever buy that car over a Model S? The Model S is so far superior in almost every way, and then you add the cost of premium fuel over the Panamera's lifetime, and the economics become a no brainer too.
But again, I admit I'm seriously biased in favor of the Model S. So while I really hope you decide to buy the MS, if you do opt for the Panamera, I'd be curious why. As others have said before, on an 8 hour drive, you're probably stopping for a total of an hour and a half tops for charging. Seems totally reasonable for me for those times you're making a longer roadtrip.�
Oct 27, 2013
brianman TCO on tires also depends on whether you get Plus or not.�
Oct 27, 2013
Vger Adjusting to road-tripping with a Model S and SuperChargers is really easy. Just pad your schedule a little bit, and plan to eat healthier than fast food. If you are not a workaholic, talk to your wife. If you are a workaholic, write 15 emails while you charge. The time often disappears really fast. Remember, your are not standing there in the cold holding onto a freezing pump handle, you are sitting in a climate-controlled cabin, with a great sound system, very comfy seats, and fabulous sound insulation.
I have done 10's of 1,000 of kms road-tripping in the ten months we have had the car, and loved all of it.
Just do it!�
Oct 27, 2013
Citizen-T Yeah, don't get hung up on the charging thing. You shouldn't just add the time that it takes to charge onto your typical trip time. If you eat and use the restroom (things you'd need to do anyway) at the Superchargers then I think you'll find that charging adds very little extra to your travel time.
That said it might take some extra time, so the next thing I'd do is figure out the net time, then consider cost of fuel for the Panamera to do that trip. Superchargers are free, so in dollars per hour, how much does that extra 20, 30, 60 mins (whatever you figure your net is) cost you if you do the trip in a Panamera? Then you can just make a time/money trade off decision.
BTW, hopefully some day battery swapping will be an option. If you haven't seen this, you should check it out: Official Tesla battery swap demo - HD - YouTube�
Oct 28, 2013
RainmakerJL thanks for all the feedback. i have been staring at that supercharger map all week.. I am sure you all laugh about newbies like me worrying about charge stations etc... I totally get that once you know what you are dealing with you plan accordingly. We have two small kids and 2 small dogs so stopping for 20 minutes 2 or 3 times on that trip is pretty common and going from 20 to 40 minutes or whatever is no big deal... it is a long drive so we do like to not dilly dally too much as it makes the drive a little longer.. perhaps in such a great car (vs mini-van) it wont feel so long. A couple of new questions... I am really looking at just the P85+ at this point. The kids seats in the back trunk. If i choose NOT to go with this option is the trunk a little bigger (i.e the space where the seats store is now freed up...)? For any of the "winter" folks like me in the north east... Do i just go right to the 19" tires front and back for the winter once we start to see snow on the ground and run those till march/april?
�
Oct 28, 2013
stevezzzz Good thread; thanks for starting it, Rainmaker. The rear-facing seats fold away into the footwell when not in use, leaving the rest of the cavernous (and flat) rear cargo area free. Then there's the front trunk (sometimes called the 'frunk', though Tesla now discourages the use of the term). Space is really not an issue; but if you do need the extra space the footwell provides, don't get the rear-facing seats. By the way, you can't add the rear-facing seats aftermarket: Tesla builds in additional structure during manufacturing, for passenger safety, when you order the rear-facing seat option.
I'd put it on 19"s + snows before December 1: you don't want to ding the 21"s and you'll need the traction the snows provide in those northeast winters. Speaking of 21"s and tire life, read the last couple of pages of this thread: alignment (particularly rear toe) is crucial to tire life in the Model S.�
Oct 28, 2013
ModelS8794 Assuming you have a charge at your destination in Toronto, the Westchester to Toronto trip out would necessitate starting with a full range charge from your home and then either:
1) a stop in Syracuse for a meal (45-60 minutes) and then a 5-10 minute pitstop in Buffalo, or
2) A 15-20 minute stop in Syracuse, and another 15-20 minute stop in Buffalo, if you usually travel this route without stopping to eat on the 8 hour drive and don't want to change that habit
Similarly, the return trip you'd want to start with a full rang charge and then short stop in buffalo (5-10 minutes just to add ~30-50 miles of range) and then a meal stop in Syracuse to fill back up to full.
This assumes the Supercharger map noting Syracuse and Buffalo as Supercharger locations in 2014 is accurate.
I wouldn't want to rely on a Model S for a 1000 mile roadtrip without Superchargers in place.�
Oct 28, 2013
TylerCA The interior of the Pannie is more plush with amenities. The P85+ will have more space especially with the rear seats being a bench setting whereas the Pannie can only fit two in the rear. All comes down to what you're looking for.�
Oct 28, 2013
RainmakerJL I'm "hoping" that tesla hits their targets on superchargers +6 months. I.E. those winter 2013 goals are hit by end of 2014 . If that happens i should be good. Here's my typical drive to "Toronto" which is actually about 2 hours north east of Toronto.
We take the 87 north to Albany and then the 90 west towards Syracuse. North on the 81 towards Watertown, cross into Canada at "Gannanoque/1000 Islands" and then 401 towards Port Hope and up to our summer home (about 80 miles north of Port Hope). We'll have the charging plug in that home.
It looks to me like superchargers are going in at Albany and somewhere between Watertown New York and Toronto along the 401 (two of them actually). The key one might end up being Syracuse. It looks awfully bare between Albany and Buffalo in early 2014... Either way this is a long term purchase not a short term one.. I'm leaning towards getting the kids seats because it adds some flexibility if we want to take inlaws with us to somewhere for dinner.. I think the kids would get a treat out of sitting in the back seat once in a while... Anyone with kids care to share experience on those back seats and age appropriateness range?�
Oct 28, 2013
ModelS8794 The kids seats are a fun novelty for kids under 9 (technically under 80 pounds i believe... the deal is pretty much if your kid needs to be in a booster, the rear seats will do, and if your kid is big enough not to need the booster seat, then probably too big for the rear facing seats too...). My kids liked 'em at first, and then got sick of riding backwards, especially on longer trips (like over 20 minutes LOL) cause they would complain about upset stomachs. I suspect the real problem was the lack of HVAC in the back and I didn't have tinting at first... now it's fall and I have Photosynch tinting on there, so it's fine back there but the damage is done to their psyche and they've decided they don't like it anymore if we go longer than errands around town sort of thing...
I wouldn't get the model S relying on having the +2 as a necessity, but if it's an occasional 7-passenger need and at least 2 kids are in booster seats, then it's more than adequate.
As to your road trip, I was looking at the Route 17/I-81 route north through Binghamton. If you go via Albany, then that'll add to you trip (and that far north of New Hope is obv longer than i had estimated too.) Sounds like a ~550 mile trip rather than 500 miles. So yeah, 3 stops to fill, Albany, Syracuse, and New Hope Superchargers. Syracuse still will need the longer stop since it's 210 miles there to the New Hope-ish supercharger area (estimate of course), so you're stuck there to get up to 90%-minimum charge level regardless and you'll probably feel range anxiety and spend even longer to 100% full the first 2-3 times you do the trip. On the other hand that means both Albany and New Hope really are 15-minute or less stops, so the cadence of the trip (stretch the legs in Albany, meal for 75-90 minutes in Syracuse, stretch the legs in new Hope) shouldn't feel too much out of the norm with what you might expect to do on a 9-hour trip in the minivan.
I am in the Philadelphia area, and our long vacation trip is to hilton head, SC. I don't expect we'd do it in a model S, not because of fueling issues, but just because 5 passengers and a week's worth of luggage means the minivan is more sensible. If/when we toss the minivan for a Model X, i expect this sort of trip will feel totally normal, because we are used to stopping for 15 minutes or more every 2 hours on these trips for young children bathroom breaks, meals, etc. Traveling with kids is jst that way, i find.�
Oct 28, 2013
ToddRLockwood 1. Tires: With the 21" Michelin PS2's which are standard on the P85+ you should expect about 12K-15K out of a set, depending on your driving style. The rear tires are wider on the plus so they cannot be rotated with the front tires. The rears will probably wear more quickly than the front due to the added toe-in for handling. You will most certainly want to run Tesla's 19" wheels in the winter, with a decent high performance snow tire. In winter, you'll run the same size on all four wheels.
2. The regenerative braking is absolutely fantastic in traffic. You'll use your brake pedal about one-tenth as often as you used to.
3. I doubt if you'll need to charge on the road at all. The Westchester/Manhattan commute will be well within the range of the car, even if you're stopped in traffic some of the time. You'll do 99% of your charging in your own garage at night. The Superchargers will be useful for a weekend trip, but they won't be necessary for your commute.�
Oct 28, 2013
RainmakerJL thanks for the feedback! Going for another test drive this week (a little longer then the first) to seal the deal....�
Oct 28, 2013
Kipernicus For your commute to Manhattan, have a look at yobigd20's posts. Some are here in a thread about charging in NYC, but I seem to remember some other ones when he was talking about the money and time savings of driving the Model S vs taking the train. (sorry can't find the link at the moment)�
Oct 28, 2013
neroden I'm told the 21" tires wear out extremely frequently. The 19" tires last for years.
Excellent. Electric drive is perfect for stop-and-go traffic, internal combustion engine sucks for stop-and-go traffic.
Well, personally, I think P85+ is just silly unless you're taking the car on the track. The standard 85 is a dream car for a commute, and with the money saved from not getting P85+, you can load up the car with all the options and accessories. Of course if you have more money than you know what to do with and were going to buy the car fully loaded anyway, go ahead, give Tesla the extra money for the P85+, we stockholders appreciate it. :wink:
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Not easy until more faster chargers are built. The best charging along the route right now is Sun Country Highway "90 amp" chargers, present in Albany, Syracuse, and Niagara Falls, which are good for 50-60 miles of driving per hour of charging. Eventually there are supposed to be Superchargers in upstate NY but they don't exist yet.�
Oct 28, 2013
RainmakerJL Since I will be in Canada often Should i get the twin chargers to take advantage of the Sun Country Highway charge stations? Looks like they will fill in nicely if i want to stop for dinner for an hour or so and grab 60-90 extra miles in the process?�
Oct 28, 2013
SFOTurtle Yes. At 80A, you're looking at about 55-60 miles of charge per hour with twin chargers, depending on the voltage.�
Oct 28, 2013
Shumdit how do people say the 19's last for years when the car has barely been out for a year?
Disagree. Never drove the 60 or any 19" wheel option car, but after driving the P85 with the 21's I was hooked. Then I tried the P85+ and it is a whole 'nother level in the handling dept.�
Oct 28, 2013
Mayhemm If you're anywhere near Canada, it would be silly to skip the twin chargers, IMO. The SCH network will continue expanding (this year's goal is 90% national coverage) and it will give you that many more options on where to charge, even when the Supercharger network is up and running. Why wouldn't you maximize your charging options for such a modest fee? And SCH has already started phase 2 of their network, which includes 100-amp chargers, rather than the old 90's. Who knows what the next few years might bring?!�
Oct 28, 2013
brianman Neroden's post is the first time I've heard that said.�
Oct 28, 2013
dennis Well some of us disagree with that sentiment regarding the P85+. Most likely it depends on what you have driven previously and what you are comparing the Model S to. If it is Lexus/Mercedes/Toyota the S85 performance and handling will likely be fine. But if it is Porsche/BMW/Audi you are much more likely to be satisfied with the P85+.�
Oct 28, 2013
brianman I still find it refreshing that we're talking about an EV that has "overkill" performance. And that it doesn't* cost 7 figures.
* Even in China, if measured in US$.�
Oct 29, 2013
DIL I've driven multiple iterations of the MS, and I must say I keep coming back to the P85 with 21's as the Goldilocks: Enough performance, stunning good looks, and relatively easy to live with. Viva Tesla!�
Oct 29, 2013
lolachampcar Rain,
Please find one or more local owners and buy them a cup of coffee. You'll get the whole download. Depending upon which store you've been working with, the owners will likely know much more about the car and you will get significantly more accurate information. If you find yourself in the WPB, Fl area I would be glad to help out. I've had a P85 and we (my wife and I) currently have a P85+ and a coil spring S85.�
Oct 29, 2013
RainmakerJL Great feedback. I know a tesla owner of a P60 out in California and we have talked at length and he loves it and it probably wouldnt hurt to have conversations with more owners... i am considering the p85+. What is the big difference between the two? I want performance and don't mind spending extra on tires/year to have a fun year... this is intended to be my midlife crisis car.. i am planning ahead.�
Oct 29, 2013
lolachampcar now that is a can of worms question....
The factual answer is that the P+ has stiffer suspension bushings in the rear, slightly stiffer damper settings, larger sway bars and 20mm wider rear tires supported on a 1/2" wider rear rim. These rims/tires are the 21" variant. It was enough for me to sell my P85 and buy a P85+.
Now, if I could do it all over again with what I know, I'd approach it slightly differently. Driving my wife's car I realize just how much I like coil springs and how much I do not like that slightly disconnected feel of air. Think E63 versus C63 and you'll get the picture. Better yet, drive the two MS variants side by side. One will speak to you.
My ideal would be a P85 coil spring car with P+ lower a-arms (the only rear bushings that matter for me) and lowered to air suspension ride heights. I would use new upper links to put camber right back were it was with stock coil spring ride height. This combination would free you to pick your own rims and tires with my favorite being Pilot Super Sports on 20" rims. Doing this allows you to bypass the larger sway bars which have significantly more "head snatch" when going over bumps one wheel at a time. The P+ is nice but if you are inclined to make changes to your toys I feel there is a more cost effective approach that would yield better results. The down side is you loose ground clearance and the ability raise the car over obstacles (which is typically not a problem in S. Florida).�
Oct 29, 2013
RainmakerJL Somewhere after the words "my ideal" i pulled a Linda Blair with my eyes and i could see exactly what the back of my skull looked like because i had no clue what that all meant...
What does it "feel like" between the two... I am buying this car to enjoy driving. I love to drive and i drive far and long.. i don't like to light hundred dollar bills on fire so i don't want to change my tires every 5000 miles of balanced driving but i get the sense that is more based on aggressive driving and/or track driving.�
Oct 29, 2013
Pollux It's a helluva mid-life crisis car! :biggrin:
I maxed mine out, knowing full well that I'd never push the limits of what a P85+ can provide for performance. I may get a friend to take me on a test track so that I can see what the car is really capable of doing. But even in ordinary driving, the handling and acceleration are a total thrill!
The set of compromises that were also important for me: being able to carry 5+2 passengers. Ability to configure for large cargo load. Adjustable suspension height for dealing with a wider range of situations. Zero emissions. No apologies (in terms of looks, performance, range, etc.) for an electric car. Reasonable for the wife to drive. Lots of other options in this price range had less appealing trade-offs, e.g., fewer passengers, worse performance characteristics, restricted cargo load. In other words, I needed to balance "mid-life crisis" with "practical family car". Strange to use those phrases in the same sentence.
Re kids -- in my experience, kids LOVE the rear-facing seats! Tinting the hatch and pano have been critical to comfort, though, as the rear-facing seats are poorly ventilated. My 9-year old boy loves being able to configure the seating, pop himself in, close the hatch, strap himself into the four-point belt, and then spend the trip in his own world. I notice that other drivers wind up smiling and waving to him. Other kids love it, too. My wife and I love it because it puts some additional room between us and the kids. The downside of THAT is that when you do need to talk to them, you'll find yourself yelling -- it's a big car! I didn't agree with the comments one poster made about booster seats. The seats are rated up to 77 pounds for each kid, plus you have to take height into account. So I'm guessing that a lot of kids will fit up until 10-11 years of age and/or exceeding the weight. My boy is on the small side, so he may make it to 11 or beyond. And speaking of booster seats, other observers have noted that the car allows three booster seats side-by-side in the regular rear seat!
Re tires -- hell, it's a mid-life crisis car! Get the 21s. If you discover that you really dislike the tire cost, you can always sell the 21s and just rely on the 19s you've bought anyway for the winter. With the 21s, you'll have summer performance tires and then winter tires. If you switch permanently to 19s, you could minimize cost by doing all-seasons or you could compromise with a summer tire and a winter tire.
The only thing I wouldn't repeat from my purchase configuration would be the Tesla Paint Armor. While I have come to be a big believer in paint protection film, the Tesla Paint Armor ultimately looked to me as poor in total coverage; didn't like the visible bra line across the hood; and there seemed to be some application issues (pointed out by my detailer). So I'd take the money I put into the Tesla paint armor and put it into a good third-party detailer, using Xpel or something like that.
One other thing -- the high-power wall charger and the twin chargers are a debatable investment for a lot of people. For me, I liked the convenience of the wall charger rather than fumbling the included charging cable into/out of the trunk. And I'm running extra amps into my house so I can drive the HPWC at full 80A power, for minimum charging times. The twin chargers are definitely helpful on the road, when you find higher-powered (but non Supercharger) chargers. Over time, it's a good bet that the number of 70A & 80A chargers out there will increase, so I view the twin chargers as a good investment. The HPWC is arguably more about convenience.
Enjoy!
�
Oct 29, 2013
dennis IMO opinion the P85 "feels" more like a Lexus - more softly sprung, a bit floaty when making freeway speed lane changes, understeers too much. The P85+ feels more like a BMW (in particular the M5) - goes where you point it, invites you to take corners faster, only does what you tell it to do with the steering wheel input and no more. So pick your handling benchmark car (it was the M5 in my case) and that should point you to the right choice for you.
As far as tire wear goes, there are 3 major factors:
1) The treadwear rating of the tire itself. The 21" PS2's have a lower treadwear rating than the 21" Continentals, which in turn have a lower treadwear rating than the 19" Michelins. So they will wear out faster, which is the price you pay for the softer rubber compound that gives you more grip and better handling.
2) How aggressively you drive. No need for explanation.
3) Correct alignment and tire pressures. Some owners are experiencing excessive wear on the inside edges of their rear tires because Tesla did not align their suspensions correctly. Even with correctly spec'd alignment, the rear inside edges will wear somewhat faster because of the rear suspension geometry. If you have a P85 you can get some extra wear by rotating the tires, but you can't do this on the P85+ because the front and rear tires have different sizes.�
Oct 29, 2013
lolachampcar dennis,
If you had the option, would you have gone with Tesla's 21s or aftermarket 20s and the more cost effective (and stickier) PSS'?
Oh, and Rain, I tend to have that effect on people; mostly women.�
Oct 29, 2013
RainmakerJL Pollux. Can you point to or post pix of your green P85+... I love green but was worried about how the color would look. How do you feel now about that color choice vs the more popular dark silver and/or blue etc...�
Oct 29, 2013
dennis I would have gone with the aftermarket 20's in order to get the Pilot Super Sports, which appear to be a better all around tire than the already great PS2's.�
Oct 29, 2013
Pollux @RainmakerJL,
My wife picked the colors (green/tan), after explaining at length how it was my car and my choice. Classic move. Heh. She chose the dark green because it reminded her a lot of the British Racing Green on the Jaguars of her youth. Many people initially mistake the car's color for black, even during the day. I have come to love the color! I would have defaulted to black. But the dark green isn't flashy or garish at all yet (IMHO) is more subtle, richer and interesting than the black. I'll try to remember to take a pic this afternoon and send it along.
I might think twice about the tan interior. It looks fantastic, especially with the dark green exterior, but it does show every smudge. I wonder how the black interior would look with the dark green exterior.
�
Oct 29, 2013
RainmakerJL i have tan seats in my black Infiniti M56 and let me tell you it is awful. I wear jeans and so does my seats. Definitely going with black seats... I love those old classic racing green cars starting with the old Porsche and Jaguars so classic..... I just thought that maybe the green might get "old" over time and i would start to regret it... Does the color feel timeless if you know what i mean or does it feel more novelty...�
Oct 29, 2013
DIL Great thread. Every time I absolutely definitively make up my mind about what to order, one of you guys gushes about the +. Pollux and Dennis, this time I have you two to blame.
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PS. if this is a 40th birthday gift to myself, does that qualify as a midlife crisis car?�
Oct 29, 2013
ModelS8794 Personally I find it too practical to really qualify for a mid-life crisis car. I told my wife I was gonna sell our S in 2015, and get a Roadster along with the X... THAT will be a mid-life crisis move.�
Oct 29, 2013
RainmakerJL I was all set to buy the Panamera for my 40th birthday (3 years ago) and then i got real practical and didnt.. I have 2 young kids so i am going practical a little bit but spending 40-50k over what you need to spend for a nice family car is something that is a splurge and very much a midlife crisis car. Its looking very likely that deposit is going in tomorrow...�
Oct 29, 2013
Pollux Hope I'm doing this right. In theory, here are the pix. There are supposed to be three pictures, but so far I'm only seeing two in this "post quick reply" window after having supposedly uploaded 3. Hmph.
OK, the pictures are all there. **And you can see the dust on the hood!**. I hang my head in shame!!
�
Oct 29, 2013
dennis My mid-life crisis car purchase came much later and therefore got less practical and more expensive. This was my 65th birthday present to myself last year...
�
Oct 29, 2013
RainmakerJL Pollux, thanks for posting the pics. they look awesome and the color looks black to me so its that dark green i like a lot... I didn't see any dust and went back to look more after you said it... I did notice your gas free lawnmower though
Dennis.. @jealous... such a nice looking car. but its not green so you will be docked points.. How has your tire wear been so far?�
Oct 29, 2013
dennis 11K miles including one track day at Laguna Seca and still lots of tread left. The Pirelli P Zero's are amazingly durable for a performance tire.�
Oct 30, 2013
lolachampcar show off......
are you really going to make me post pics??????
All kidding aside, that is one very very pretty car.�
Oct 30, 2013
texex91 Now THAT is a sweet ride!�
Oct 30, 2013
Citizen-T Sorry if you already said this, but did you decide whether or not you are gonna pull the trigger yet?�
Oct 30, 2013
RainmakerJL Extended test drive this afternoon.. stay tuned...�
Oct 30, 2013
DIL May I suggest?
- back to back with a regular P so you can really feel the difference
- take note of the tire roar on different surfaces at cruising speed
- drive her HARD. don't be afraid to push it
- consider doing a back-to-back test drive with the regular P. That often convinces people that plus is absolutely worth it
have fun and definitely let us know how it goes�
Oct 30, 2013
lolachampcar Include a P with coil springs if possible.�
Oct 30, 2013
DIL YES. I should have said that. I'm sold on P with coils....and maybe some mods by lolachampcar once he's got his personal retrofit kit available.
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...Also: What a GORGEOUS machine. Congrats on your mid-life crisis! I don't think this thing rides on air suspension.�
Oct 30, 2013
Gizmotoy Nope. No performance cars I can think of off the top of my head do. What it does have, however, is absolutely fascinating. The pressure rise in the shock on the outside during a turn is used to prevent compression of the shock on the inside. The transfer of this fluid strengthens an anti-roll bar, creating a truly adjustable roll bar. You can read more here, it's an amazing machine. http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/track-tests/2012-mclaren-mp4-12c-suspension-walkaround.html�
Oct 30, 2013
DIL OMG. Achingly beautiful engineering. Those McLaren guys are amazing. Wouldn't that be a sweet merger? Tesla and McLaren?
Funny, my 2003 Toyota 4Runner has the poor man's version of the adjustable roll bar:
What makes a very big difference, however, is the X-REAS suspension that�s standard on the Sport trim level (optional on base SR5 and high-zoot Limited). X-REAS stands for Diagonally Linked Relative Absorber System�the X stands for �cross-linked,� the RE is �relative� and of course, AS translates as �absorber system.� Basically, in X-REAS the shock absorbers are linked diagonally. As the 4Runner leans in a corner, the shock fluid is transferred from the front shock absorber chamber that�s being compressed as the truck leans to the opposite diagonal rear shock absorber that is trying to expand, but into the top of the shock. This acts against the rear shock from expanding and the front shock from compressing. If the technical aspects of that don�t make sense, believe us that the overall result is that 4Runner Sport corners with less SUV lean. It�s not an active system�no electronic controls and no hydraulic pumping is going on�but it works and it�s a lot less expensive. (http://www.examiner.com/article/road-test-2009-toyota-4runner-sport-urban-runner-car-review-the-sports-car-of-suvs)
�
Oct 30, 2013
lolachampcar NOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Please No.
Tesla works and the CEO has some modesty to go with all that genius. Please do not let Ron Dennis near Tesla.�
Oct 30, 2013
vfx Elon loves McLaren and literally asked his engineers to make the MS handle like one.
No doubt the next gen Roadster will use McLaren as the benchmark to beat.
To the OP. Porsche owners fall the hardest.�
Oct 30, 2013
SFOTurtle I'm hoping the test drive went well. Please don't report back that you decided to buy a Panamera because the MS doesn't have enough cupholders or didn't have a handle above the door on the inside.�
Oct 30, 2013
Zaxxon Perhaps he's negotiating a sale of the test vehicle?�
Oct 30, 2013
DIL Yeah, it's already after 5 in New York, and since he hasn't reported back to us eager beavers, Rainmaker is probably already out driving/enjoying his low mileage +.
�
Oct 30, 2013
Pollux @RainmakerJL - yup, I'm in the Boston suburbs. Tire wear appears to be OK so far, but that's by eyeballing and not by measuring. When I take the tires off in 3 weeks to swap in some third-party 19" rims and Nokiian snows, I'll measure and note the wear and mileage on the 21s. I currently have something like 3500 miles since August 7.
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Oct 30, 2013
dennis I had not seen that aspect of Elon's personality.
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Almost. There are no sway bars at all. Instead, the active hydraulic suspension continuously adjusts the roll stiffness when cornering based on the g-forces. So when the car is going straight there is no "connection" side to side as you would have with sway bars. This was originally developed by McLaren for Formula One but was later banned by the FIA, just like the brake steer that brakes the inside rear wheel to cause the rear to rotate when understeer is detected. It was all this F1 derived technology that caused my initial interest in the car. Once I did a test drive, it was game over.:biggrin:�
Oct 30, 2013
RainmakerJL You guys still talking about me? Well. things went well at the test drive. Drove the P85+ again. Drove it hard and was able to drive on some of my usual routes I take weekly to the gym. A set of side roads with lots of curves and an interstate with light traffic. This was great to push handling, passing, light drifting etc.. I plunked down my deposit and went with the P85+ with pretty much everything except the alacantara ceiling, (got the pano), no nappa leather trim (went black, no need) no parcel shelf or paint armor (going aftermarket)... once i "press commit" they say i'll have it in 4-6 weeks tops. I am leaning towards Green Metallic Black Nappa and Carbon Fibre accents.... 30% chance i go with the blue... Also went with the Grey rims.......�
Oct 30, 2013
Shumdit Excellent choice. The grey wheels would look great with the blue or green. I dont love the CF with the tan interior, but it would look good with black interior and i would get the matching rear spoiler too. Are you getting the sport seats with the red piping? Not sure how that would look with the green exterior. I am a blue kinda guy myself, but the green is going to be more uncommon like the brown. That being said, a model S is pretty much a rarity in these parts, regardless of color!�
Oct 30, 2013
RainmakerJL I am going with black nappa seats not sport with red piping (don't like the suede accents and the piping doesn't go well with either blue or green exterior IMHO)�
Oct 30, 2013
Shumdit Yes I think you are right about the piping. The red piping would be bad with green and especially brown. With blue it would be patriotic!!
I actually like the suede inserts myself, but I think having to get the red piping on a car without a complimetary exterior color and paying the upcharge since its no longer standard on the P85 or P85+ is a hard sell.�
Oct 30, 2013
RainmakerJL i think it looks great, potentially awesome on a Black Car. Nice on a Red Car.. Otherwise i think its a little tacky. but thats just my personal opinion.... which these options are all about anyway..�
Oct 30, 2013
Shumdit it looks good on the grey, and to a lesser extent on the normal white and the silver. The MC white or Signature red I would not care for it on. You are right though, it's just opinions. One other benefit of the grey wheels besides looks is that they don't show grime or brake dust as much as they silver.�
Oct 30, 2013
brianman Perhaps someone with good photo manipulation skills could put together a mock-up of the "Laurent blue" (if I'm remembering his name right) with the white Signature seats with the red Performance piping. I'd love to see a decent quality rendering of that.�
Oct 30, 2013
Shumdit Is Laurent blue what the blue on Telsa is officially called or does it even have a name?�
Oct 30, 2013
DIL Hey! Congratulations. This is awesome. You went from asking a bunch of questions to ordering today?!?! Nice.�
Oct 30, 2013
brianman The standard Model S blue color is called "Metallic Blue". IIRC, back in the beta days they had fancier names like "Evening Breeze Blue" or whatever. I've forgotten the names, I think many others probably have too.
With "Laurent blue" I was referring to a specific vehicle that got a custom color. I'll try to dig up a post with a screenshot to clarify.
Update - Here are some pictures of the vehicle and color I was referencing:
First Model S to get a custom color after delivery?! - Page 2
I'm not 100% certain (as I'd have to see the car in person) but I think it's not as "deep" as the Sig Red. Other than the depth issue though, I think it's my second favorite color (I really like my Sig Red) for Model S so far.�
Oct 30, 2013
doctrewho That's why I went with the Performance seats on mine. The Black with the Red goes quite well together. Grats on the order!�
Nov 3, 2013
RainmakerJL Pressed Confirm...�
Nov 3, 2013
doctrewho Grats RainmakerJL!�
Nov 3, 2013
lolachampcar Rain,
Yipeeeeeeeeeee!
Doc,
My daughter is going to hear about your handle�
Feb 29, 2016
AB4EJ Rotating tires front to back could extend tire life (or does Model S have different tire sizes in front & back like a number of sports cars??)...�
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