Oct 7, 2015
SkinnyWeasel New P90DL is 240 or 241 depending on the day at 90%. 320 miles on the car.�
Oct 7, 2015
roblab My 90D sits at about 252 every morning, 90%.�
Oct 7, 2015
Stoneymonster 85D, March 2015 with 5000 miles is at 242 or 243 depending on the day.�
Oct 7, 2015
prasad 85S, 13 months with 15K miles. Always charged @ 90% and 100% only 3 times
0-2 months = 240 miles
3-8 months = 237 miles
9-12 months = 235 miles
@ 13th month looking at 232 miles
�
Oct 7, 2015
cinergi Now that I have my 90D ... It charges to 256 @90% ... < 500 miles on the odo. I think 100% was 282.�
Oct 8, 2015
blackscraper My 90D sits at 414KM�
Oct 8, 2015
mknox There are a number of threads discussing this, some even with graphs showing data on cars of all ages and mileage. Plug In America has done some surveying and has some good data here. I think that most see a relatively big drop in the first year, then the degradation curve levels off. I've seen about 9% after 2.5 years / 60,000 miles, but most of that occurred near the end of the first year.�
Oct 8, 2015
gregincal As mknox alluded to, I wouldn't worry about it. I wouldn't be surprised if you are above 230 after another year.�
Oct 9, 2015
Jool 90D delivered in late August with about 3,900 miles on it. Full charge this morning only went to 276 miles :frown:
Hoping that this weekend's road trip will balance out my miles.�
Oct 9, 2015
slevit1md 85D, typically charge to 80% but been charging to 90% for this thread.
Checked a couple days ago and it was 241 miles at 90%, this morning was 242 at 90%. The car has about 2300 miles.�
Oct 9, 2015
AmpedRealtor Has any brave soul kept their car charged to 100% for several days? A post in a thread regarding battery degradation at TM Forums over a year ago, or it could have been here, indicated that their local service center suggested keeping the car charged to 100% for a week in order to work its magic balancing trick. I'm curious if anyone has done that, either intentionally or by accident, and what impact, if any, it had on your range estimate?�
Oct 9, 2015
Sogorman I have only let mine balance to 100% twice and then drove it within 30 minutes. On a side note I picked up a P85 loaner (vin P05xxx) from the Service Center and it was charged to 100% (no idea how long) and it had a rated range of 268 miles! Don't know if it's a referb pack or not but I wish mine had that capacity.�
Oct 9, 2015
AmpedRealtor Yes, I asked service about why their older loaners still show 265 miles or more at 100%. The answer was that there is a super secret way to "reset" the range estimate and force the system to recalibrate. When I asked if they could do that to my car, he said no. The car at the Tesla Gallery is always kept constantly charged to 100% day in and day out, and it also shows full range with no degradation.�
Oct 9, 2015
Sogorman Good salesmanship I guess.�
Oct 9, 2015
liuping My "new" 90D (an inventory car with 800 miles range when I got it last weekend), with Range Mode enabled, is getting 257 so far.�
Oct 9, 2015
Candleflame somehow i doubt that.�
Oct 9, 2015
apacheguy the more I think about it, the less I think it has anything to do with balancing. It's all about voltage mapping and how the charge curve is non-linear, thus making extrapolation from lower SOC more difficult. By keeping your pack at > 90% for longer periods you are simply training the range estimate to better recognize this non-linearity and more closely match the true SOC. This is evident when you charge to 100% and the car reaches "100%", but the cell voltages are still substantially lower than 4.2 V and the car continues to charge at 40 amps. Thus, the car anticipated 100% prematurely.�
Oct 9, 2015
JenniferQ 50 miles on the odo and shows 246 at 90%. No idea what to make of this at this point and I am accelerating quite a bit at the moment when I can since that's the fun part!�
Oct 9, 2015
Pete90D Congrats on your new car!
246 is what I had at 90% as well. You should see ~273 at 100%�
Oct 9, 2015
JenniferQ Great to hear! Planning a few trips later in the year and trying to see where I can get to safely. Thanks for the info. So weird, still, to pass gas stations and think, "Meh."�
Oct 10, 2015
Pete90D I haven't had time to gather more data points, but here's a drive I did to get a ballpark estimate of what could be done if I needed to watch my Wh/mi. 208mi using ~80% charge
P90D Range Data�
Oct 10, 2015
Polly Wog My 19 month old standard 85 with ~22.5k miles, 90% is 239 and 100% is 264.�
Oct 10, 2015
gg_got_a_tesla Almost 10-month-old P85D at just over 10,000 miles. Lost a mile very recently and am at 225 miles at 90%.�
Oct 10, 2015
AmpedRealtor I think you're right. For a couple of weeks, I charged only to 70%. After those two weeks, charging to 90% resulted in a loss of 5 miles of range. Charging to 100% showed the same 5 mile loss (253 down to 248). On a whim I decided to charge to 100% three days in a row when I had errands to run. First day it charged to 248 miles. Second day it went to 250 miles. Third day I'm back to 253. In this example, I did not need to drive the car down to single digits to recalibrate, it did so all by itself simply by charging to 100% a few times in a row regardless of how many miles I actually drove.�
Oct 10, 2015
Ugliest1 I'll go one step further and mention my overall "strategic" plan. Based on the odd 100% charge, if memory serves my 21-month-old S85 shows about 250-255 miles, so about 4-5% degradation. If I assume the absolute worst, like, after 15 years a 20% degradation, that still gives me 210+ miles of range (though, Roadster experience after 8 years I believe nearly all of them are still at or above 90% -- haven't checked the threads lately). Couple that with the increased supercharger routing over the same time (can anyone say "Trans-Canada"?????), it should meet my range requirements very nicely even on long trips. So I no longer obsess about the numbers (especially since, all we can trust is that calibrated-or-not range estimate -- high precision low accuracy).
I post this for those who don't really want to worry about the battery life. And, if 210+ miles isn't enough, I (will) have the option to purchase a new battery for about the same as a motor-and-transmission job in an ICE (using my special ballpark estimation analysis). So for me it's a wash. Well, except for the FAR MORE ENJOYMENT I get driving the S than I would any ICE.�
Oct 10, 2015
Pete90D To clarify, you have to let it sit until it says charge is complete. Even when it hits 100% it will continue to charge very slowly for a while (30min+ sometimes)�
Oct 11, 2015
hipringles 2013 P85+ 29k miles.
234 on the most recent, was down to 229, but did a few 100%--> 15% roadtrips (seemed to help)�
Oct 11, 2015
Sogorman I had charged to between 70% and 80% for about the first 11,000 miles and was seeing about a 6% rated range degradation. For the last couple of weeks I started charging to 90% and have seen the rated range go from 228 to 332 which now represents a 2.4% rated range degradation. It does appear that the BMS looses track of the rated range the further you keep it from 90% despite the fact that the battery will probably last longer in the long run. I'm going to back my charging back down to 85% (I only use about 50 rated miles a day) and will give it another 10,000 miles.�
Oct 12, 2015
CleanPower My new 90D - 90% charge varies between 257 and 261 miles. This morning it is at 258 miles. Range mode is off. I have never turned it on.
�
Oct 12, 2015
Rifleman My 60 is down to 173 on a 90%. 25k miles on it. I am starting to get concerned. My wife's 60 is holding strong at 188 at 90%, with 35k miles on it.�
Oct 12, 2015
AmpedRealtor Charge to 100% a few times in a row and see if you get a bump.�
Oct 12, 2015
liuping Have you done a 100% charge yet? I did this weekend and it was 283. Not quite the 286 it would have ideally, but I don't know how it was charged during the 800 miles it was used as a demo car.
(Nice color BTW�
Oct 12, 2015
golfski I am right there with you. I am at 172, I have been as low as 168 @ 90%. I lost a few miles in chunks after driving from 90% down to 15-20% or so on a couple of day trips. It consistently works its way back up to 172/173..but 100% is only 191 - 194
When new it was 191 at 90%, I have about 32,000 miles on my car.�
Oct 13, 2015
yobigd20 
Built Feb 2013. 87k miles. 90% is 226.�
Oct 13, 2015
mknox My big drop came after a summer of charging to 70% and ending the day around 30%. I noticed it when I had to charge up to 90 or 100 for a trip. Those miles seem to have been lost to me forever. No amount of deep discharge / fully charging or any of the other "tricks" mentioned here did anything more than a mile or two for me. I have heard that these batteries will show degradation more quickly at the beginning, then it will taper off quite a bit. I've been at around 220 @ 90% (245 @ 100%) for about a year now.�
Oct 13, 2015
JohnQ Yup, same boat as you. I charged to a lower % for a while since I never needed the full range during regular driving. Then when I needed 90% it wouldn't hit the same number. Nothing has changed with repeated 90% and occasional 100% charges, I remain at 219-221 for 90% charges.�
Oct 13, 2015
AmpedRealtor Try charging to 100% 3-5 times in a row, I think you'll see your estimate rise.�
Oct 13, 2015
Sogorman This thread has scared me into setting my S85 at 90% and not worrying about it. It seems like people that set it and forget it have the least amount of degradation then those who like me try and baby the batteries. I'm going to go with a 2:00am charge at 36A (dropped the amperage on my UMC so it does not melt) to 90% and not worry about it anymore.�
Oct 13, 2015
nolngrgrsngslde P02336, 57K miles. Delivered early Jan 2013.
90% 226 miles.�
Oct 13, 2015
apacheguy
This is unnerving to me as I'm seeing range loss while following similar charging habits, but it was my understanding that the range would be restored after repeated 90% charges. It wasn't reassuring to me that I didn't regain miles after my road trip this past weekend which included a couple 100% charges.
Who wants to be the guinea pig here? I have an idea to restore your range:
1. Access fuse box in frunk.
2. Pull yellow touchscreen fuse.
3. Pull BMS green fuse.
4. Wait 5-10 min.
5. Insert fuses in reverse order.�
Oct 14, 2015
shadowinstallz 90% -85d 14.5k miles range mode on 239....gained 1 mile after changing my habits to 90% daily instead of 70-80%.�
Oct 14, 2015
shadowinstallz I would test this out if my miles were much lower.....maybe after the winter if I don't see it go back up to 243-245 after doing multiple 100% complete charges�
Oct 14, 2015
taurusking apacheguy::: What will this do to restore range? Any caveats while doing this?�
Oct 14, 2015
AmpedRealtor I've done this and reported my findings upthread. No effect. I pulled both fuses for 20 minutes. No change to displayed range. I contacted service regarding this procedure, the service advisor asked all of the techs at the shop and said this process does nothing.�
Oct 14, 2015
apacheguy It should reset the range algo.
Interesting. I can attest to this working under a previous firmware with a previous battery. No idea if it still holds with newer rev. packs. I guess it really depends on whether or not the memory on the BMS is volatile.�
Oct 15, 2015
mknox Done, and nope.�
Oct 15, 2015
gtimbers 247 new, 244 at 5000 miles. I regularly charge to 90%. I have only done 100% twice. I also don't run it down very far. 90 miles left is as low as I have ever done.�
Oct 17, 2015
msnow Since the 7.0 update my 90% went from 256/257 to 254, why? The car is just 30 days old.�
Oct 17, 2015
Deagle I've had my S90D for 2 weeks. 90% pretty steady at 252�
Oct 17, 2015
msnow Thanks but I wonder what accounts for the variation between new identical cars.�
Oct 17, 2015
SeminoleFSU mknox, I'm convinced you must have some dead cells... Generally speaking, I've noticed most folks with A packs have better degradation #'s than some of the later revision packs. I think you have an A pack right? Also, folks in colder climates generally do better, although not as consistently (at least by my perception)... you're in Canada where avg temps stay colder than most American owners..... between those two things, I would expect you to be a lot better off than most in terms of degradation #'s, and you're not.... therefore dead cells? Just a theory...�
Oct 17, 2015
Notacarguy S60 getting a bit frustrated. Now at 308 w/m average with about 20 k on the car and only getting about 169 at 90%
When I got the car it was getting 185 at 90%. Even as my avg w/m has gone down my rated range has also gone down
Teska looked at it twice and keeps telling me there's no issue with the battery. Full charge I only get 189 now.�
Oct 17, 2015
apacheguy Would be interested to see @mknox diag screens as dead cells should be visible in comparing module voltages. Perhaps with the soon to be released @disharmony jailbreak?�
Oct 18, 2015
Fabio I have a 2013 60Kw (30,500 miles) and am getting 169 at 90%, like notacarguy.
Tesla has checked my pack and assured me the pack is fine, not happy with the degradation�
Oct 18, 2015
urbanscribe P90D not ludi
september to october range (235-240) weather dependent�
Oct 18, 2015
FlasherZ My experience is that the trips app does not count all power usage by the car. No one has explained what is or is not included, and my experience has been that occasionally that app becomes a bit "sticky" and seems to miss both some mileage and power usage on "since last charge" in certain conditions (especially road trips).
- - - Updated - - -
I have, but it didn't seem to have any impact. Then again, my car hasn't lost any range with over 43,000 miles on my replacement pack.�
Oct 18, 2015
dennisayre Dec 2012 S85, 32k miles, 90% gets me to 226. I just set it to 90% and ignore the fluctuations. I average 350 w/m since my purchase. I suppose if I wanted my 10% back I could just adjust my driving habits down to the 300-320 area most of your guys seems to use.�
Oct 19, 2015
mknox Yes, A-Pack and I live in Southern Ontario which has a climate similar to, say, Chicago.
I asked my Service Center about this a year or so ago when the big dip occurred. They told me that they ran some diagnostics and didn't find any problems with the battery. I didn't get any kind of report other than a note on the Service Order saying "operating as designed" or something like that and the conversation I had with them at the time.
I actually "planned" for this level of degradation when I ordered the car (prior to first deliveries in 2012) so it is not like I can't make trips or anything. It is a little odd to see the variations between owners, though. A while back, I set my displays to show % rather than Rated Miles and it has reduced my anxiety about it significantly :smile:�
Oct 19, 2015
Notacarguy Well Tesla came back and they admit on my service report that my capacity has gone down 10% and faster than average but they still say its normal and should "average" out as fleet averages catch up, whatever that means. Not sure how I plan any trips now if my distance between supercharges is more than 189 miles. Love the car, but this is worrisome.�
Oct 19, 2015
apacheguy Down 10% in less than 1 year? Normal? Hardly.�
Oct 19, 2015
Notacarguy I agree. But for now they are telling me they will continue to monitor even as I see on my Tesla App that the car hit a new low of 167 miles at 90% while they had the car for inspection.�
Oct 20, 2015
badgerlake Was told the same by my SC. I'm not convinced that my battery is "operating as designed". I just keep hoping they find something as they look at my car's logs every so often. (A pack, 85kWh, 18k miles, 210 rated miles at 90%, on 7.0)�
Oct 20, 2015
apacheguy Ouch. 210 at 90%? Is that the worst we've seen for an 85 kWh? What are your charging habits?
Ah, got it.
This worries me as charge to 80% on most days but lower my charge limit due to excessive heat. I've noticed this causes a loss of rated range upon returning to my normal 80%. It does not seem to restore or improve despite repeatedly charging to 80%.
Why is it that some folks claim to gradually gain range back and others don't?�
Oct 20, 2015
badgerlake Well, I did increase from 206 to 210 by charging to 90% regularly (or maybe it's the new firmware updates or some recent trips that exercised more of the battery for calculations or ...). @Sparrow and I have similar #'s, but I believe we are the worst of the 85's.�
Oct 20, 2015
Benjamin Brooks What's this you speak of?�
Oct 20, 2015
ZBB My 60 is at just over 42k miles and is almost 29 months old... 90% is has been between 167 and 170 recently -- it bottomed out a few weeks ago and has been going up slowly since. Was 170 this morning...�
Oct 20, 2015
apacheguy Hacking v7
Right, forgot about sparrow. Seems like you guys might be going in for a module replacement sometime in the near future. Keep us posted.�
Oct 21, 2015
AmpedRealtor I hate you!�
Oct 21, 2015
apacheguy @Amped - When did you lose most of your range? Was it after repeatedly charging <80%? Have you been able to regain any lost range?�
Oct 21, 2015
Sparrow I got mine up from 205 at 90% to 211 sometimes 212, by driving the car down to 17 miles left and then charging to 90% regularly for the last few weeks. It does not appear to want to go past 212 though. I was doing the same thing of charging to only 60 or 70% and then only driving 10 to 20 miles a day. I have not taken the car on any out of town trips in over a year so until I drove it down to 17 miles it had not been below 90 rated miles in all that time either.�
Oct 22, 2015
AmpedRealtor My car is 26 months old with around 34,000 miles. My 90% used to be 228-230 miles for a long time. A few weeks ago, I charged only to about 70% that week. Afterward, my 90% charge dropped to 223 miles. After doing a couple of back-to-back 100% charges, my 90% charge is back up to 227, but still not at the 228-230 where it was a few weeks ago before I decided to drop to 70%. Just one month ago, my 100% charge during a road trip to San Diego was 255 miles. Now it is 252 miles.
I'm jelly of those who have the same or higher mileage as I do, but who have not lost any range after driving the same or more miles as I have. Maybe those cars or packs aren't as old as mine and that might have something to do with it.�
Oct 22, 2015
apacheguy Ok good to know. I'm waiting until some real winter time temps hit SoCal and then I won't worry about charging up to 90% each day so I can restore some range. We had a hot summer so I decided to reduce charge level to 70% - and boy did my range drop like a hot potato. It's odd that some can recover this lost range while others cannot.�
Oct 22, 2015
travwill 70D Update: 3 Months later, 50% charging daily, have had a couple range charges, back to 50% and it is still right at 119 (but not 120 anymore). We'll see...
Wandering if it is still good to charge to just 50% as really all I need? Maybe take it down to 35%-40% most days. Thinking of doing 60-75% here in Winter (or more if need). Still opinions that it is better to keep a lower SOC if only needed versus always 90% for longevity?�
Oct 23, 2015
shadowinstallz I've been doing 70% daily charges for the first 8-10k miles....and 90% range dropped from 244-245, down to 238-239.....ive been doing 90% the past couple months....haven't really done a full 100% complete charge...always been 99.9%.....hoping to gain back some range this winter doing 100% charges. Seems like charging to 90% daily instead of anything lower seems to be best for range displayed numbers... But I hope this doesn't indicate a battery degradation.�
Oct 23, 2015
CAS I've had my car (S 85) for 32 months and have driven it 51,000 miles. I normally charge to 80% daily and my rated range lately has been 185. Last night I charged to 90% and my rated range was 205. My last 100% charge was in August and it charged to 239.�
Oct 23, 2015
jerry33 At ~60k miles and 2y 8m, 90% is 222 and 100 is 236 Rated. 259/285 Ideal. So I have 95% capacity, but no idea of how much of that is imbalance as I normally charge to 80%. (note that the two calculations give different results. I'm pretty sure the Ideal is more accurate)�
Oct 23, 2015
apacheguy Theory tells us that it is better for the life cycle of the battery compared to daily 90% charges. As to why that doesn't translate and owners don't see their numbers bounce back, well the jury's still out on that.
Note that I've seen ideal as high as 309 miles on a new battery. Based on that, you'd be down more like 8%.�
Oct 23, 2015
jerry33 I'm not convinced that the "extra" is anything more than display inaccuracy, because it goes away in a couple of days. And because SOC is mainly an educated guess, using the nominal values is likely to be as good as anything other than a destructive test.�
Nov 10, 2015
ElectricSingh I've been given a loaner for the week that is a year old and has 15,000 miles on the clock. The 90% appears to be 215 Typical (UK/EU Calculation, Range Mode On), compared to my 4 month old F pack battery at 220 Typical with Range Mode.�
Nov 10, 2015
Jack VIN 1525 85 40K 90% is 226 after 3 years (12/12/12).�
Nov 11, 2015
jdw VIN 91991 @4200 Miles -90% rated is 240 and 100% rated is 265 with range mode off.
I was charging to 90% for the first month or so but lowered it to 70-80% in the summer thinking I was being kind to the battery. My range started to drop, so I did a couple "100% let it sit for a couple hours and run it down to 20% charges" and have been charging to 90% since. I don't always charge every day as I only use 10-12% in a typical day, so I figure I can be "kind" to the battery by letting it sit at lower SOC in between 90% charges. Pic from the last few minutes of my last 100% charge:
�
Nov 11, 2015
bancroftc I took delivery on 10/14 and my 90% was 245.
Day 2 it was 244 and remained there for about a month. Just yesterday I think, I'm at 243.
1% drop in a month, but it sounds like that will stabilize (hopefully) after I drop a couple more miles?�
Nov 11, 2015
Sasmania I'm at 228 on a loaner pack...that started out at 245 at 90% on July 28th. This was towards the beginning of my road trip...almost 20,000 miles ago with mostly SuperCharging of course. But a pretty big 17 mile loss if you ask me for 3 months and 20K.
My original is getting fixed so we will see where that one is at when I get it back. Did just get back from the service center today and once again, GREAT service.�
Nov 13, 2015
badgerlake So after reading what wk057 had to say about balancing happening once the battery hits ~93%, I did a charge to 95% and then drove it over a few days until I got to around 50 rated miles left. Then I did a 90% charge. I did regain some miles -- went from 211 to 214 rated at 90% (but was at 206 not too long ago). Can't tell you how much was balancing vs recalibration but did gain some miles. I would love to get to 230+ but i'm not sure i'll ever get there w/ this battery.�
Nov 13, 2015
Sparrow I did the same thing that badgerlake did, which is to do some 95% charges, but mostly just 90% charging and I have now moved up from 205 2 months ago to 214 on a 90% charge.�
Nov 17, 2015
Todd Burch So I tested a few theories the last few weeks. Background: I typically do 5-10 range charges a year and normally charge to 90%, even on weekends if I don't drive the car much or at all.
My car has been at around 234-235 miles at 90% lately.
To determine the theory that running your battery down to a low SOC helps calibrate it, and to test the theory that charging to 100% (or >93%) helps balance the pack, I ran my car down to about 15 miles remaining one evening, then charged it up to 100% the next two days shortly before my 35 mile morning commute. Both days I let the charge finish completely (in case there was balancing at the end of the charge cycle).
The end result?
Before the test, my 100% charge was stopping at 260 rated miles.
The morning of my first 100% charge (after running it down to 15 mi remaining the night before), my car charged again to 260 rated miles. However, the number didn't start dropping until 4.5 miles later.This is equivalent to what I saw months ago.
The next day, my car again charged to 260 rated miles @ 100%. But this time, the range started dropping within about half a mile.
Now, a week later, my 90% charge stops at: 234 miles (probably the low end, it seems).
So not only did this not seem to improve the pack, it seemed to get a tad worse.
Conclusion? The confusion continues, as does the silence regarding an official word from Tesla about the range calculation.�
Nov 17, 2015
apacheguy Hmm. So if you charge to 90% daily it seems like there is little error in the range algo and also the pack seems to keep in balance.
I'm one of those who charged to much less during our hot summer, like 60-70% and saw a corresponding decline of rated miles. I wonder if repeating the test in my case would improve my numbers. Unfortunately this would have to wait until I road trip.
Agree that Tesla needs to come out with something. Owners are asking questions and getting confused. Their silence is frustrating.�
Nov 17, 2015
msnow Also, one of the top things people want/need to have confidence in, rated range can't be trusted.�
Nov 17, 2015
Todd Burch Except that I went 4.5 miles the first day before the rated range started going down.
I think I give up�
Nov 17, 2015
Canuck It's my understanding that doing this doesn't actually increase battery capacity. In fact, charging to 100% accelerates degradation as does letting the battery go really low. Both are hard on the cathode. So, assuming the algorithm is correct, you should see less range after doing this -- maybe not noticeable though if only done twice and you drive/charge right after doing it -- but it definitely won't increase range. It will only give you a higher reading if the algorithm was off. So I take from what you have done that the 85 algorithm is pretty good at estimating capacity.�
Nov 17, 2015
FlasherZ (EDIT: See Displayed Range and Seasonality for more data points and information.)
So I posted this in the 90D thread as well, but I spent some time today pulling the 90% range which appears to be seasonal... Here is my 90% charge taken from random days each month from January 2014 to today:
You'll see that the 90% tends to vary in a seasonal pattern - colder temperatures tend to result in less range, but I get it back in March and April.
In the middle of each month, I pulled the maximum 90% charge over a span of 2-3 days. I don't have time to correlate the temperature over those days (or look at software updates, or looked at in proximity to the last range charge for rebalancing), but you can see how the number varies seasonally. Note that the peak occurs in the spring, around Mar-Apr. This is the range data reported by the car via the API.
Keep in mind these are based on single samples from each month, so the data is very "noisy". If I were better skilled in MongoDB, I could pull every sample that was at 90% and graph it. But I'm horrible with it, and especially the nested document work that has to be done from TeslaMS.
EDIT: The range jump in Feb, 2014 was due to my battery pack replacement after contactors failed.
In addition, the high June, 2014 number was immediately after a week of range charging every day while on vacation, probably at the best balance the pack's had in a while. So there are other factors in play, but it appears to be cyclic with seasons here.
- - - Updated - - -
For what it's worth, I've had my car at full charge for a few days at a time and my battery pack still charges to 266 miles on a range charge in the warmer parts of the year (262-263 in winter). The displayed range usually tends to go up after I've exercised the battery (balancing high, or taking it down and recharging).�
Nov 17, 2015
apacheguy It may if the cells are out of balance. That represents true loss of capacity storage. Also, Todd was testing the range algo itself by following that procedure. In his case, the test indicated that the range algo was completely in check and the battery was perfectly in balance. The only loose end was the 4.5 miles he drove w/o seeing the range decrease.�
Nov 17, 2015
Canuck Really? I thought "true loss of capacity" is when the cathode degrades since there's no bringing that back. I thought balancing the cells is bringing back temporary loss, but not true loss, and in the long run causes damage to the cathode. But I'm no expert on battery issues.�
Nov 18, 2015
apacheguy Well, the cells need to balance in order to restore that capacity. You need to charge to 100% in order to do this. Ergo, range charging does in some cases bring back actual useable range. In the below quote, I assumed this represented range charging and I was merely pointing out the benefit.
�
Nov 18, 2015
JohnQ Great data and thanks for sharing. I'm jealous of your 90% charge after 3 years. I'm 2.5 years in and my 100% is only 2 miles more than your 90%�
Nov 18, 2015
badgerlake Well that was short lived -- charged to 90% last night and only got 209 rated miles.�
Nov 30, 2015
NuclearPowered
Have you contacted service about this? What have they said?�
Nov 30, 2015
JohnQ I haven't. It has been in line with some others who are at the "losing" end of the degradation bell curve. I'll discuss at my 3 year service in a few months along with my increasingly noisy motor.�
Dec 1, 2015
hanl1 I took my 85D in September and it dropped from 245 to 242 in about 2 months and has stayed at 242 since.
�
Dec 2, 2015
CLLACAB I feel pretty good about our CPO that we picked up two weeks ago. At 90%, we are consistently seeing 234 miles.�
Dec 3, 2015
mmccord 4 months later, just rolled over 21k and am getting 233.�
Dec 3, 2015
smsprague I was at 229 on my 85 RWD with 22,000 miles. After a road trip where I range charged twice I am now at 233.�
Dec 3, 2015
sorka Before my trip to Arizona a few weeks ago, I did a 100% charge and then my 90% went from 226 to 227 (same as it was when new).
But in the last week, it suddenly decreased from 227 to 225. It's been much colder so maybe the actual temperature of the battery matters.
Maybe adding the 1600 miles I just did on my trip aged it enough to drop more. I don't know. It's a small enough amount that's in the noise so non of it probably means anything. I'm sure the battery has degraded far more than that in the last 9 months / 14K miles but that it just doesn't show up.
Still able to pull 415KW at 90% if the battery is warm, so the internal resistance hasn't increased.�
Dec 7, 2015
Ugliest1 Thought I'd add another data point; cross-posted from "Canada - How is your Wh/km?"
S85 RWD; 23 months (Dec 2013 build), 53,000km, 209 Wh/km (32,500mi, 336 Wh/mi)
A few months ago, last 100% charge netted 403km rated (250mi) 5% loss; 90% charge regularly shows 360-362km (224mi).�
Dec 8, 2015
yobigd20 95k miles and my 90% is ~222/223/224 and my 100% is ~248/249/250. varies day by day.
built feb 2013 P85�
Dec 8, 2015
Discoducky Don't see many 60kWh's posting, but Belle is currently 167 on latest FW with nearly 47K miles and nearly 3 years of driving�
Dec 8, 2015
AWDtsla 236, then 238, then 239. Hmmm. Maybe it will keep going up...�
Dec 9, 2015
Todd Burch My charging and driving habits have been consistent for months (90% charge every day). In the last 2 months my 90% charge has dropped from 235 to 232. I think the colder average pack temperature does seem to have an effect on the indicated miles remaining. I'm expecting much of this to come back up as we go into the Spring months.�
Dec 9, 2015
glhs272 182-183 still @63.5K miles.�
Dec 9, 2015
Screwbal Probably not useful data here... Picked up my model s yesterday morning. At delivery charged to 90% the car sat with 240 miles range when I got it. After driving (and charging) the car yesterday and today both days at home I've shown 245. Will see with time if that number moves up or down and how long it takes to do so.�
Dec 9, 2015
msnow 245 @90% is good. That would project to about 272 @100%. Congrats.�
Dec 10, 2015
Old Man Mike Interesting. My new P90D was delivered today with 11 miles on it and a high 80's charge. After sitting in the garage a couple of hours playing with controls and display, I topping it off at 90%. It also showed 240 mile range. Maybe 240 is just the starting point for new batteries until some real usage data is collected.�
Dec 10, 2015
davidc18 214 @ 90% 9800 miles -�
Dec 10, 2015
travwill Aw man, I'm at 211 on my 70D with just 4000 miles.�
Dec 10, 2015
dweeks S85, just under a year old, 14,750 miles.
90% = 230 rated miles.�
Dec 10, 2015
AmpedRealtor my 90% has dropped substantially in the last few weeks from upwards of 230 miles to now 225 miles.�
Dec 10, 2015
apacheguy I think we should start comparing peak power at 90% rather than rated miles. It is a much better indicator of resistance growth. Anyone want to start a new thread?�
Dec 10, 2015
thegruf my 90% on new 11/2015 85D is only 227 miles.
Quite concerned really. Only marginally better than a 70D.
If this drops from here as new batteries typically do, then it will very soon make several of my typical journeys marginal, that should have been okay which could severely impact the convenience of the vehicle to me.�
Dec 10, 2015
David99 63k miles on my car delivered in March 14. 90% is 224/225 miles. Last time I charged 100% was 250, but when I do I can usually drive a few miles before it starts to drop. So it's all a little fuzzy.�
Dec 11, 2015
jbcarioca As of today my P85D, produces Dec 20, 2014 had 14,000 miles:
my 90% today is 227 miles rated.mIt was 225 when I took delivery.�
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