Dec 31, 2012
Doug_G UPDATE: "We are no longer charging Ranger fees for due bill items."
When I picked up my car in Toronto they didn't have the tool for setting up the TPMS for the winter wheels. Apparently the tool had gone to Montreal for that delivery event and the replacement hadn't arrived. I was told, "No problem (my ranger) will drop by and fix that on his way to Montreal." He did so last night.
Today I got a $100 invoice from Tesla for Ranger service. I complained on the following basis:
I got the following response:
I'm okay with this given that they'll deduct it from the service plan price, but IMHO it's bad form (a) to charge for fixing something on the due bill at delivery, especially when it was caused solely by logistical problems at Tesla, and (b) not to inform me of the policy at the time.�
Dec 31, 2012
nrcooled You're a better man then me. I would have fought that tooth and nail.�
Dec 31, 2012
mnx At least us forum go-ers now know what to expect...
�
Dec 31, 2012
mknox Being so close to the Service Center, this is less of an issue for me, however, I agree this is bad form and further believe you should not be charged the $100 Ranger Fee regardless of whether you intend to buy the Plan or not. Your car was delivered with a "problem" that should have been dealt with on or before delivery and the customer shouldn't be made to pay for the follow-up that was only required due to this issue.
This reminds me of how Zapped had his car dropped off like a FedEx package in Edmonton and had to unwrap it himself in spite of having paid $990 for Personal Delivery and $180 for Inspection and Prep. Now I believe Zapped didn't seem to mind, but that kinda seems like bad form to me as well.�
Dec 31, 2012
Ditpixs I would not accept that, as it should have been resolved upon delivery.
Just for reference, after I got my car home from the factory I discovered the A/C wasn't working. Tesla picked the car up from my office the following week, took it to Menlo Park and brought it back to me the next day repaired (bad O-Ring). There was no charge for this service, as it was a factory defect which should have been caught before I picked it up.
It probably helps that I am 40 miles from the factory, but you should be treated the same way.
Aaron�
Dec 31, 2012
montgom626 I second your comment.�
Dec 31, 2012
Ceilidh I also agree. I wonder if that ranger didn't know what to do and made something up on the spot to collect the fee in case he got in trouble for not collecting it or something. You should not have had to pay that and I would have been pretty aggro about it given the circumstances. We should never pay for a mistake or lack of equipment on Tesla's part.
Cheers.�
Dec 31, 2012
AnOutsider This is not the Tesla service we've all been told to expect. Reminds me of the whole $35 for the HPWC shipping since it wasn't available at the time the car came. Well, is that our fault? Is $35 or $100 worth the satisfaction of customers who have put up with a lot in these early days?�
Dec 31, 2012
rlpm I certainly hope things like this get resolved by the time I take delivery several months from now. I'm about equidistant from the Denver service center and the to-be-opened Phoenix service center.�
Dec 31, 2012
bonnie Unacceptable. They were basically completing one of the last manufacturing steps that wasn't done due to no fault of yours, inconveniencing you (your car had to be there, right?). They also note that they'll do it 'on the way to Montreal', so you accommodated their schedule.
The decision to charge you was a mistake. I can see it if it was a Ranger visit that would normally be covered under warranty, saying if you bought the plan later, the money would be deducted. But this was a required step to deliver the car 'whole' to you. There should be no charge.
Someone misinterpreted the directive, I'm sure. Push back!�
Dec 31, 2012
Jkam Once again, another "communication" problem for Tesla. Since when was that policy ever relayed to its customers? You can't place the policy in effect after the fact. If Tesla expects me to pay a single cent for any of my due bill items, they have another thing coming.
I understand that Tesla probably needs to see some cash flow in the service area since it is opening up many service centers which no doubt costs money, but to charge $100 for a due bill item is preposterous. And then after being challenged, coming up with the $100-will-be-deducted-from-your-service-plan answer is dubious at best. If that is indeed the policy, why weren't customers informed of it beforehand?
The car is wonderful. There are some quirks, but nothing unbearable. The unbearable is continually seeing how Tesla screws up customer service. It is a disturbing trend, and it appears to be Tesla's Achilles Heel. Time and again we find out about absolutely horrid Tesla service stories - situations most people wouldn't put up with from any car manufacturer especially at the luxury end of the spectrum.�
Dec 31, 2012
mattjn So, is this a new different car company? Sounds like all the other companies out there, nickel and dime.�
Dec 31, 2012
bonnie Ummm, time and time again we also hear about spectacular service stories. Let's keep this in perspective. That's why I recommended that Doug push back. It makes total sense for Tesla to charge for routine Ranger visits right now and then deduct monies paid if the plan is purchased. I believe this was a misinterpretation of a directive. Let's not damn Tesla quite yet.�
Dec 31, 2012
mattjn It makes sense to charge for something that should be done before the car is even delivered? This isn't something that broke and needs fixing, this is like not putting seats in and charging you for them later.
I know there are a ton of Tesla cheerleaders on this forum, but we consistently heard about how Tesla was going to be different and not be the same as other car companies, so far I haven't seen any proof of that.�
Dec 31, 2012
Jkam He did push back after he was wrongly charged for a due bill item. Then he got the we'll-deduct-it-out-of-your-service-plan answer. How much more force does he need to push back with? He shouldn't have to push back with anything further. It is just wrong.�
Dec 31, 2012
montgom626 Yes, you are right.�
Dec 31, 2012
bonnie Yes, I believe I already stated it was wrong. I'm questioning damning the entire company, one with a great customer service record, over what may be a misunderstanding by the person who responded to Doug.
Stating "time and again we find out about absolutely horrid Tesla service stories" without mentioning the other end of the spectrum seemed a bit unnecessarily dramatic. (Oh hey, we have a thread on actual service stories: http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/10137-Actual-Service-Experiences-with-Tesla . Let's start there.)�
Dec 31, 2012
qwk This is preposterous. He paid for dealer prep, received what to any reasonable human being would be an unprepped vehicle, and to top it off is being charged again for what?? Lol
I'm sorry, the truth is that while Tesla created an unprescendented car, they seem to have hired a bunch of ex-walmart greeters for their bean counting and marketing department.�
Dec 31, 2012
bonnie I think you misread my response. I did not say I thought he should be charged.�
Dec 31, 2012
kevincwelch Looks like Tesla is going to nickel and dime customers, but no more than any other automobile company. You just have to go to any automobile website and see what is extra. (I went through Porsche's website last night and everything is extra.) In this case, however, the charge is simply infuriating. Tesla falls short and charges customer! Nice philosophy.�
Dec 31, 2012
markwj At the risk of bring slammed, what would other manufacturers in USA / Canada do in this case?
Here in HK, they generally don't have ranger service, so we would have to take the car to them for warranty / missing items work. Closest equivalent I had was a factory recall for that brake issue on my old Prius. I was told that I could bring the car in and get the work done for free, or they could send someone to pickup and drop off the car for me, but I would have to pay US$120 for that.
The issue I see is that without the dealer network, Tesla counters with the convenience of ranger service, but needs to ensure that is monetized.
But, at the core is the problem that Tesla is now shipping thousands of these cars without fundamental things like the prepaid service plan, 3G data plan, or even all offered+purchased options, finalized and available. That is what is causing the confusion here, and until that is finalized, Tesla should eat the costs (with the subsequent problem that it is going to be hard to start charging for something that you've been giving away for free).�
Dec 31, 2012
walla2 I am guessing close to 70% of Sig customers and a large percentage of P customers have some item still due after delivery. The HPWC, parcel shelf, cubby, spoiler, detail, moisture in a light, wipers, panel, etc. I would not and most others should not expect or demand that Tesla provide free ranger service for every one of these due items. While I agree the item is due, travelling out to every single location with a ranger would not be something that Tesla could afford or likely do right now. They are in the midst of ramping production, ramping delivery, ramping communication, and ramping service; no division is fully functional. The $100 charge I suspect is due to not being ready for the problem the OP had here and not truly knowing how to handle it. It's the effect of not being quite ready for any of this (Trying to make, sell, and service a mass production global vehicle). My spoiler can wait until I either need ranger service for a critical need or schedule service at a service center. I'm not interested in bankrupting my only possible car service provider by having them come out and buff my car because it arrived dirty when delivered. Granted, that's not what the OP had done, but I think its a bit much to demand ranger service for every due item at this stage of the game. At some point, sure. At this point, I see growing pains.�
Dec 31, 2012
qwk Tesla has no clue whether a customer will choose any service plan. Charge for something he was already charged for first and sort it out later is horrible From a customer service point of view.�
Dec 31, 2012
bonnie And if you had quoted my entire post instead of taking words out of context, it was clear that I didn't feel Doug_G's experience fit within a normal ranger visit:
�
Dec 31, 2012
FlasherZ Some of the new rangers / servicepeople don't know that they have the authority to waive that on a visit.
I was told the same thing when I called for my due bill items (GPS receiver, etc.) and I called the regional service manager and dropped a note to the DS, territory service manager, and territory delivery manager. I was assured that for any problems at delivery, the ranger fee would be waived. I didn't much care, because I planned to buy the service contract anyway, but it was a matter of principle. You can't charge for a problem that wasn't resolved prior to delivery.
The Ranger insisted he was told to collect it upon EVERY delivery, then later told me he had a conversation with the TSM.
I also dropped a note to Joost to ensure he knew what was going on.�
Dec 31, 2012
swegman Walla2, I respectfully disagree with you. The OP paid a fee for delivery and prep of the car. The car was delivered but not properly prepped. Other people received their cars with items missing, such as the shelf,roof shade, etc. Tesla should not be charging a ranger charge for what should have been delivered with the car. Tesla delivered cars without all items in an effort to boost deliveries. They could have delayed delivery of the cars until everything was in order, but chose not to. Tesla should bear the ranger cost for coorrecting their mistakes (missing items, etc.).
What all this has convinced me is that I will take delivery at the store so that I do not have to prepay for the car before inspection. Should anything be missing or require repair, I will reject acceptance until everything is in order, or tesla puts in writing that the omissions/problems will be corrected with no additional charge (ranger charge, shipping (ala HWPC shipping charge just because tesla is unable to delivery them with the car at the present time), etc. to me.�
Dec 31, 2012
montgom626
Hmmm, failure to plan on TESLA'S part does not make it my problem ($$$$). How they complete the MS and other issues is their problem. I am with the group that feels I paid for delivery of a complete car. If I pay for each missing part, then I am "enabling" their behavior of not getting it done right the first time.
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So,if I take delivery at the TESLA store, I do not have to prepay????? I did not know that. I only have to prepay when the car is delivered outside of the TESLA store? With this information, I too will travel to the TESLA store in Oakbrook, Ill. for my final inspection before delivery.�
Dec 31, 2012
William13 +1 FlasherZ, I have had wonderful service on the Model S. The Rangers were probably told to charge the $100 to minimize low priority trips. If there is no cost, people will tend towards infinite demand. I fully plan on going to the service center and paying for the TPMS reset every spring and arranging for the yearly checkup in the fall when changing to winter tires.
However the OP was wrongly treated. I assume his charge will be written off after talking with someone higher up. On the other hand no one else will come to my house to service anything for less than around $100. The dollar figure was correctly chosen. Just not correctly applied.�
Dec 31, 2012
montgom626 If TESLA eats the costs, they will be highly motivated to correct any delivery deficiencies before delivery.�
Dec 31, 2012
walla2 I respectfully agree with you. I'm not justifing the charge or condoning it. Tesla shouldn't charge anything. I was simply pointing at that at this point it is unlikely that the ranger service is ready to handle all of us for all of our needs. They clearly don't even have protocols in place to handle us. You can check my past posts. I'm no cheerleader. The reality is that deliveries have been occurring since day one, and I suspect that most cars are not complete and have due items. The ranger service will eventually ramp up to handle this. In the meantime, people affected should complain here and complain to Tesla. The rest of us should understand they aren't ready (they were under/unprepared for every aspect) but don't be outraged or feel the need to cancel/reject your car by what happened in one situation.
I am in a group that paid more than you for a complete car. I feel that a complete car is due as well. All of us feel that way. All of us paid the same delivery fee. You just feel that attaching your spoiler or TPMS correction is more important than rangers providing critical repairs when they are stretched too thin. Tesla needs more service people and needs to train more rangers. Due bill items will be fulfilled, but critical things need to be served first for Roadster and the Model S owners, and I sincerely doubt service is ready to come to the house or business of every owner to add one due bill item at a time as they become available. Don't get me wrong, the $100 charge is wrong, but it's not a sign that Tesla doesn't care about us. It's just another indication of not being ready.�
Dec 31, 2012
Brian H Yes, I think the ramp-up is spinning off these "due bill" items and glitch corrections at a rate that wasn't properly planned or provided for. I hope it's not too serious a case of "biting off more than you can chew." The ramp-up (which seems to be proceeding famously, =>600 cars/wk?) has costs. Those costs must be met from the added margin the volume provides; that's part of the deal.�
Jan 1, 2013
Jkam I don't know if Tesla has a "great customer service record." There are certainly people that get good service. It seems that you are one of them. And then there are others that get less than acceptable service, me being one. So I suppose our experiences are different. However while you point out the thread with good experiences, there is at least one thread with many poor experiences (Delivery Issues and Concerns) and I've read random posts in different threads that leave me to believe that there are more people like me that have bad experiences than there should be. More than enough to question whether Tesla has a "great customer service record." Certainly Tesla has done some good, but I think at best its service record could be considered spotty.
The thing is negative experiences usually weigh more than positive experiences. Average is what is expected. Positive is not expected, but a pleasant surprise. Negative is usually not average or acceptable. So when you have a negative experience, it stands out more due to the lack of acceptability.
For instance, I asked to get my Slacker id/password over two weeks ago. Tesla responded that an Ownership Experience rep would push the information to me soon. Well, two weeks later, still no sign of it with no follow up or explanation why I didn't get my Slacker account activated or when I may expect it. My DS even mentioned at delivery that he would get it to me soon which was over a month ago. Spin it any way you want, that's poor customer service. And I know I'm not the only one.
This whole situation with paying for a due bill item is just completely asinine. Again, spin it any way you want it, but bottom line it is bad. In fact if I were part of Tesla I would be completely embarrassed by it. Maybe I have high standards, but to me talk is cheap. Actions speak louder than words. This is an example of nickel and diming.�
Jan 1, 2013
dsm363 Missing the boat twice to Hawaii (being told why it missed the boat) doesn't classify as horrible customer experience in my mind. It sucks you didn't get your car sooner but delivering the car in California or Washington is much easier then getting the car on a boat to Hawaii. I understand your delivery did not go smoothly and that still upsets you but so many more have had a good delivery experience (even if there were production delays). Have they had numerous issues with deliveries? Sure but wouldn't say they have 'horrible customer service'. I again called the ownership team yesterday about something and got a person on the phone within 20 seconds.
Are they still in the phase you have to bug them about things like your slacker password? Have you called them to ask for it? Maybe but overall their customer service is good, especially the service Rangers. Doug_G should not have been charged the $100 and I'm sure that will be addressed.�
Jan 1, 2013
AnOutsider Maybe the roadster owners get preferential treatment (apparently not so in Doug's case), but I'm still waiting on my clear bra install (probably useless by the time it actually goes on), and a response to multiple inquiries to ownership, service and my DS over the last few weeks.
Sadly, I'd have to throw my hat in the ring that tesla's service thus far is average at best, but more on the side of sub par. Definitely not the experience I was expecting. Perhaps things will pick up now that they're not in "deliver as many cars before jan 1st so we look good for Q4" mode. We shall see.�
Jan 1, 2013
FlasherZ *shrug*
This seems to be the case of a ranger who does not know the policy on charging the fees. The ranger has discretion -- in the name of customer service -- to waive the ranger fee under special circumstances like this.
That said, Tesla also has to balance out the load here. Do I expect them to make the 500-mile round trip run from Chicago just to peel off the tape on the spoiler and stick it to my car, leaving the child seats on the list to address with another trip? Incredible waste of money. I would expect, though, that once all due bill items are ready, they schedule a single trip to patch it all up -- and that trip is at no cost to me.�
Jan 1, 2013
kevincwelch I suspect that they want to treat their Roadster owners the best as well, since they have been Tesla's most loyal customers for the longest. Nothing worse than pissing off your base. I think the service issues now and the number of due bill items is because of the ridiculous ramp up to get cars out FY2012. Hopefully, production will slow down this year and Tesla can take a step back and identify production line problems, glitches, etc.
I hope the problems with service are simply due to manpower. I don't know how many people have been charged for ranger visits for early failures/glitches or for items that should have been delivered with the car, but something like this should end promptly. It's a huge PR blunder and really does paint the company as a malignant nickel and dimer.�
Jan 1, 2013
dsm363 I tried to get my annual service done on the Roadster in early December but was told I would have to wait as they had directed the Rangers to take care of Model S customers until the end of the year. I did finally get it done at the end of the year.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G Just for the record, I didn't start this to trigger a whine-fest. I posted this for a few reasons:
- I wanted to warn others that Due Bill items got charged Ranger service. I was not advised of this beforehand.
- I was also not advised beforehand that these Ranger charges would get subtracted from the "anywhere" service plan price when you purchased it. I though others would want to know this as well. I was a lot less annoyed when told that... nevertheless,
- I believe the policy is a mistake and I want Tesla to be aware of that.
The policy seems to arise from the idea that some customers would claim that they were going to buy the "anywhere" package and then not do it. That's just plain silly. We're not in kindergarten.�
Jan 1, 2013
Lloyd If you want to escalate this you could file a complaint with the division of automotive repair in California. That would get some attention.
1. They charged you for warrenty repair
2. No agreement and consumer disclosure before repairs.
3. No written estimate of cost.�
Jan 1, 2013
dsm363 They simply need to start selling the service plan, I agree. I was told the same thing but I'm getting that plan so he said he'd simply hold off on the charge until I got it.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G I'm in CA as in Canada, not CA as in California...�
Jan 1, 2013
Lloyd Yes, but the company dispatched the repair from California, and the company does business here. I'm sure you have similair consumer protection laws in Canada also.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G That would be a lot more sensible. Treating us like schoolchildren over the possibility we might stiff them on a $100 fee after buying a $100,000 car is ludicrous. But I still think they shouldn't charge Ranger fees for due bill items in the first place.
Once they get past us "early adopter" types, Tesla is going to be competing head-to-head with BMW, Mercedes, Audi, etc. If they want to show that their service model is better, then they have to provide the best customer satisfaction possible. Heck even Infiniti gave me a free loaner (a nice Infiniti not a crap rental car) whenever I had to leave my car - excellent service.
- - - Updated - - -
I wouldn't be so sure. There are no lemon laws anywhere in Canada. The car companies know this and don't hesitate to stiff people. See Getting Squeezed - Marketplace�
Jan 1, 2013
Velo1 Me too. I would ask them why their problem should now be my problem? Poor decision on their part, IMHO.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G I didn't say I'd stopped... I'm just not going to beat up on the local team over something outside their control.�
Jan 1, 2013
spleen I'll chime in here as well and feel that Tesla should not be charging ranger service to address due bill items. It's Tesla's responsibility to deliver the car as agreed upon by contract - why should the owners have to pay more to get the car that they were promised? Having said that, being practical, I agree with Flasher Z that it doesn't make sense for Tesla to keep sending out rangers for one due bill item at a time. Maybe an option to have the ranger come out free of charge to address all due bill items in one visit or for the owner to visit a service center to address single items? Also would depend on how delayed some due bill items get. The long delay in the child seats is worrying me that it may be a LONG time for those to get delivered/installed.�
Jan 1, 2013
Electric1 Bottom line here seems that TM was selling a bit of parts/accessories/service that they didn't quite have (sort of like solidifying vaporware) to those of us who are taking a higher level of risk in buying from them as opposed to a more established manufacturer. While they might not owe us (legally at least) anything beyond what we paid for,common sense would suggest that it would certainly make great sense for them - and be in their best long term interest - to give us their most stellar service (ie: kiss up to us).
Yes, it is expensive to keep sending rangers long distances (not "on his way", which does sort of imply "for free" and to everyone's convenience), but in any event, it makes me a bit nervous about their viability if they cannot afford to throw the early adopters a few bones.
That having been said, perhaps it was just one poor decision by one knucklehead which was supported by his equally un-astute co-worker.�
Jan 1, 2013
Sparrow Forgive me if someone already expressed this, but is it possible that Tesla views the Winter tire setup as something seperate from the initial purchase? In other words a not included option, that they allowed you to purchase at the same time as your car. That might make this transaction a service item seperate from what they feel they owe you for the new car. I know when I ordered my car, they did not even allow me to order any additional wheels. Anyways in this case, I'm assuming your car came with 21" wheels and you want to put your extra 19" (Winter) wheels on in their place. Of course being in the South where I don't use Winter tires at all, I haven't paid much attention to what is necessary to change out wheels of various sizes.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G He did literally stop by on his way back home to Toronto.
No, the guys here are NOT knuckleheads. They are wonderful people. This was a directive from above.�
Jan 1, 2013
Electric1 That then is disapointing�
Jan 1, 2013
brianman @Doug_G - While "knuckleheads" is a bit strong, I think the suggestion was that there might have been a subtlety and or details to the directives from above AND that there was a lossyness to the communication down the org chart. Happens a lot in human endeavors at scale.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G I do not believe this was a communications issue. The exact quote was, "We have been directed to collect the fee from everyone regardless of the situation." That's pretty clear.�
Jan 1, 2013
William13 Sparrow, you are correct. The car must first be delivered as ordered, then they will change the tires for you at the service center. There is a charge for this which is separate and paid for to the service center, not part of the purchase agreement.
That said, they should not have charged for service visit when it was their fault without warning. I plan to exchange my summer and winter tires and drive around with a warning light until I can stop by the service center for a reset. Since my tires sit a few feet away from the car I wonder what will happen with the warning light.�
Jan 1, 2013
brianman Well that's pretty crisp. Thanks for the follow-up. Hm.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G I drove home 400 km with the summer tires in the back and never got a warning. Once I unloaded them I got the warning. They're not stored in my garage, but I've had amusing results when I had my Roadster wheels stored in the garage. Occasionally it would report that two of my tires were low, then TPMS fail after I left the garage...�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G Situation has been resolved. Tesla will NOT be charging Ranger fees for due bill items!�
Jan 1, 2013
bonnie I'm shocked! -big grin-
Thanks for the update.
�
Jan 1, 2013
dsm363 Thanks for working this out for all of us. Great news.�
Jan 1, 2013
AnOutsider *puts pitchfork away*
Until next time.�
Jan 1, 2013
dsm363
That reminds me of...:smile:
�
Jan 1, 2013
brianman Doug, if you're able to provide more details on the resolution (some new quotes for us?) that would be lovely.
If not, no worries. Glad you got it resolved.�
Jan 1, 2013
bonnie If I were to hazard a guess, I'd say that someone 'higher higher up' corrected the edict of the 'higher up', after seeing what was going on. (Good for Doug_G for not over or under stating the issue.) Charging for something like that is just not how Tesla has historically conducted their business.
Glad it all worked out.�
Jan 1, 2013
Doug_G What Bonnie said.�
Jan 1, 2013
aronth5 As I watched this thread play out why am I not surprised this was addressed on a holiday, and a major holiday at that.
Of course knowing Tesla's past history it really isn't a surprise at all. Problems and mistakes will always come up and there will be many more along
the way. This is after all a never ending journey. It is how a company deals with problems and adversity that is important.�
Jan 1, 2013
stevezzzz Don't forget, that scene ended with the witch saying, "It's a fair cop." :wink:�
Jan 1, 2013
rlpm This is great to hear for those of us >400 miles from a service center!�
Jan 1, 2013
Electric1 Deep down I knew that someone up there at TM would do the right thing. We (i) must all give them some space in which to grow. Disappointment was short-lived, thankfully. Congrats, Doug�
Jan 2, 2013
tezco Agree. Although the situation as described in the initial post is somewhat different, what other car company will deliver a backordered item to your door? I usually have to drive to the dealership. Same thing if they "forget" to finish the repair, or put the car back together again because the part is backordered.
In some ways Tesla is setting a new and much higher level of service...and there will be some things that need sorting out along the way. Great to hear that Tesla is paying attention to the customer and is able to make changes to their policy so quickly.�
Jan 2, 2013
mknox While this issue has been resolved, and I hate putting too fine a point on it... I think this was a bit different. It wasn't a backordered part or a return repair visit, it was the incomplete delivery of a brand new vehicle. Tesla doesn't have a dealer network and relies on their Rangers. In this case, a visit was required as a follow-up to the new vehicle delivery process to handle something that was supposed to have been taken care of at or before the new car was delivered.�
Jan 2, 2013
harry Doug_G
I know this has been resolved, but I thought you might be interested to know that I was charged the $100 fee for the Ranger visit for a warranty repair when my Sig was at your place last month. As with your case and others, they said they would subtract that fee from the cost of the service plan when they finally get that plan offered. While it didn't seem to track with what we were told earlier about ranger service for warranty repairs, I let it go since I'll be buying the four year service plan anyway.�
Jan 2, 2013
mknox So warranty costs are only covered if you can get to a Service Center, otherwise you have to pay for the "Service Center" to come to you?? I'm glad I live about 4 miles from the Toronto Service Center... it'll simplify many things for me.�
Jan 2, 2013
dsm363 Yeah. Roadster owners were not charged for warranty work with the Ranger fee but that was also at the old $1/mile rate. Now that they have the flat fee, they charge for each Ranger visit which is fair I think. Makes the unlimited Ranger plan worth it if you don't live in a city with a service center.�
Jan 2, 2013
Doug_G Certainly, I can see how that sort of logic would influence their thinking. It sounds totally reasonable, especially if you are responsible for the service department budget.
Unfortunately Tesla cannot use conventional thinking. The situations are NOT the same. Tesla has a huge disadvantage that could be a total blocker for sales outside of a few major cities: they have a tiny fraction of the service depots that their competition have. Most cities have no service depot.
Tesla's solution to that is the Ranger service. This is an attempt to turn a disadvantage into an advantage. It only works, though, if customers are satisfied with the service. That means "doing the right thing" to meet customers' expectations.
Once you try to break the mold, you do have to actually break it.
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Well my main beef was that this was a "due bill" item.
If it was a post-delivery service visit, I would have been okay with that policy - silly though it is - had I been advised about that beforehand. I wasn't.
The policy is pretty silly if you think about it. If you require Ranger service you'd have to be absolutely crazy not to buy the "anywhere" service plan. The "risk" that they'd get stiffed $100 simply doesn't exist. Treating customers like potential thieves is not making a good impression.�
Jan 2, 2013
Robert.Boston If you buy the $2400 winter wheel and tire package from Tesla, it includes installation (including TPMS calibration). And a car wash. Just got mine done today, and there was no paperwork, let alone payment.�
Jan 2, 2013
ChadS Tesla charged me extra for installation of the tire and wheel package. I asked about it because I thought I'd heard it was included, and they "checked", and said it was definitely extra. I just looked at Tesla's site where they sell wheels online (HERE), and the price drop down - while not listing a price now because they are sold out - does say "installed". I guess I need to call them again.
I also got paperwork and had to give them a credit card. And they didn't wash my car, but they rarely do at my service center.
Back in early October I said I wanted to buy the service agreement (including Ranger service); they told me they would contact me for payment "as soon as they were able to process it." I've been wondering how they would handle issues in the mean time; this thread has been good for that.�
Jan 2, 2013
Norbert An odd paragraph in an odd thread. So this all "happened" between Dec 31st and Jan 1st? Did this require actual convincing, or just clarification, at the higher levels, of whether the "directives" were really meant to apply to due bill items (as well as 'everything' else) ?
Happy new year everyone...�
Jan 2, 2013
FlasherZ Clarification... I had been through this with my ranger visit. The policy had to be clarified then, too.�
Jan 22, 2013
neroden Without Ranger service -- or, of course, a service center in Ithaca or Syracuse -- I would have had to not buy the car. I expect warranty service to be free, as it would be if there was a dealership in Ithaca or Syracuse. (Non-warranty service, I'll pay for, as I would if there was a local dealership.)
Yep. And this sort of nickel and diming gives Tesla a serious reputational problem, which is bad for the top line -- every piece of bad press on something like this drives away someone who might spend $100K on a car. And for what, $100? This needs to be dealt with by treating the warranty like a real warranty -- anything which goes wrong which is Tesla's fault, they pay for.�
Jan 22, 2013
Robert.Boston Surely you wouldn't expect the Honda dealership in Syracuse to send a repairman out to do warranty work and absorb the cost? I've never met a dealer who would do that.
You are buying a car from Tesla. You know where the Tesla service centers are, and you know what Tesla's policies are regarding Ranger service. On what basis can you "expect" something other than what they've announced? If you don't like the service plan and fee schedule, don't buy the car. Tesla doesn't have a monopoly on cars, or even electric cars; no one's forcing you to deal with the company. But you don't get to dictate the terms and conditions.�
Jan 22, 2013
dsm363 You seriously need to rethink getting a Tesla unless you are just looking for a long battle with the company. It does not seem like a good fit for you from the headliner issues to threats of warranty violations.....etc
Warranty service was free for Roadster owners but that was when my closest service center was 1,000 miles away. Now I am within 100 miles of one. And the only Ranger service was $1/mile so flat $100 much better. I wouldn't expect them to continue free warranty Ranger visits anyway.�
Jan 22, 2013
4sevens.com I'm bummed that my $100k S is short of a $20 frunk net and mats for rear passengers (I guess they weren't counting on me having kids in the back?!?!).
I'll probably order them at some point but it's a seriously short sighted.�
Jan 22, 2013
bonnie Before this thread derails into 'a car of this price should include this, this, and this', a gentle reminder that this thread is about ranger service charges for due bill items.�
Jan 23, 2013
jbherman Mods feel free to move if not in the appropriate thread:
Now that the Ranger Service payment issue on due items has reportedly been resolved, can anyone please share their experience on how long they had to wait for delivery of their spoiler after taking delivery of the car? I can't seem to get anyone at TM to provide me with a time estimate. I'm not complaining that they delivered my car quickly (actually, I'm thrilled!), but I had actually asked them to make sure the car was complete prior to shipping given that I live far from the nearest service center and was trying to avoid problems such as this. Also, is the spoiler an item that can be self installed (I'm not the handiest guy on the planet) or does it require a ranger?�
Jan 23, 2013
Trnsl8r I don't have a performance, but I sure would opt for professional installation vs. the risk of seeing fly away down the highway in your rearview mirror...�
Jan 23, 2013
Lloyd I waited three weeks for my spoiler. I had a ranger install it for me. You could do it yourself, the issue is to stick it in the right place. Once stuck it is there and can't be removed without damaging the adhesive. The ranger taped guides onto the car with blue painters tape. When he was sure that it was centered and in the proper position, he remove the adhesive from one corner leaving the adhesive covering extending from underneath the spoiler. This allows you to stabilize the free end and remove the rest of the adhesive covering without lifting the spoiler. Once all of the adhesive covering is removed some firm pressure over the length of the spoiler will seat it in place. If you follow this you can install it yourself.�
Jan 23, 2013
ChadS It apparently does include installation now; but that has not always been true.
I was charged $200 extra for installation last October (the site now says installation is included; at the time prices were not posted, but people here had indicated that installation was included, and I emailed my local service guy asking "correct me if I am mistaken - wheels and Eagle tires, tmps and installation for $2,300" and he responded with several options including "wheels, all-season tires and sensors for $2,300". I didn't notice he hadn't said "installation").
I tried sending Tesla email asking about this charge 2-3 weeks ago, but as usual did not hear back. So I called today, and was told that while they "very recently" decided to include installation, it was originally not included, so they were correct to have billed me for it.
And no, I didn't get a car wash either. I have only gotten a car wash once when I brought the car in (well twice, if you count the second time I asked them for it because I was taking it straight to an auto show). I guess that varies by service department, or perhaps by how busy they are.�
Jan 23, 2013
contaygious My spoiler date is feb 1. I received my car dec 5. They seem to be pretty far back ordered.�
Jan 24, 2013
jbherman Thanks. The response I received back from Tesla yesterday stated that they could not give me a time estimate.�
Jan 25, 2013
jbherman FWIW: I just received an email from Tesla service that I would be charged a ranger fee for installation of my spoiler (due bill item). I thought this had been resolved such that Tesla would not charge service fees on due bill items. Perhaps the appropriate directives haven't made it out to the hinterlands in the Midwest. It would be great if everyone could get on the same page. I've forwarded the email on to ownership experience, with a polite, though slightly peeved response. Communication remains a bit of a problem and continues to result in unnecessary owner angst.�
Jan 26, 2013
contaygious I was told there is a ranger fee if you didn't sign up for ranger service even for due items. I'm kinda bummed the service centers are not open weekends because I was planning in skipping ranger and taking it then, but its tough to get off work for a half a day now to go to service.�
Jan 26, 2013
Doug_G You should respond back that Tesla does not charge Ranger Fees for Due Bill items, and that if they don't believe this they should talk to Joost De Vries or George Blankenship.�
Jan 27, 2013
mrjohnlnguyen
Same her, picked up my car on Friday to try to avoid the $990 fee but no dice.�
Feb 3, 2013
Frankrb Paying for Ranger Service to COMPLETE Due Bill items is total nonsense!
This needs to be elevated all the way to the top.
GB needs to get his arms around this now!�
Feb 4, 2013
AnOutsider Did you miss the "resolved" bit?�
Feb 4, 2013
jbherman AnOutsider:
I'm not sure it's "resolved" yet. I was told by my service manager that I'd have to pay for a visit to install my spoiler when it arrives. I've reached out to both service and ownership, telling them GB said this was supposed to be on Tesla. I haven't received anything verbally or in writing stating that they'll take care of it...just radio silence.�
Feb 4, 2013
AnOutsider Sorry, thought he was responding to Doug_G's issue.�
Feb 4, 2013
Doug_G The resolution was, "We do not charge Ranger fees for Due Bill items." If they give you crap tell them to talk to George or Joost.�
Feb 4, 2013
FlasherZ The only thing that I'll add to Doug's comment (as I think I was one of the first to be hit by the $100 request and reached out to Tesla) is that the above is only true on Tesla's schedule. For example, if you have multiple due bill items and Tesla is waiting for one of them so they can do a group of them at once, and you're insistent that they make multiple trips to you to do one at a time, you may be paying the fee.
From my perspective, as long as the number of trips is less than 24 right now, I don't care either way because it'll be applied toward the service contract when it becomes available.�
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