Jan 31, 2016
Fiebrudo Question for Tesla engineers: How can it be so hard to allow the owner to set when she/he wants the car fully charge?
even Porsche allows the owner to set this up.
Easy:
Owner wants car ready to go at 7am with a FULL 90% charge
Owner therefore selects in the same screen where the option for the start charging time is located, a time she/he would like to have the car ready to go.
Tesla charges normally, might be done by 3am and self monitors, gives a boost to have the car ready at the desired 90% charge by 7am...."SIMPLE"
Parasitic losses makes the car loss 7'or more miles if the car is not driven for a day, precious miles particularly in the winter.
This subject has been touched in the past to no avail, what's wrong with Tesla? Hello, anybody home? Sims like an easy project for one of the "interns" currently rotating through the company to solve in one afternoon.
By the away, I believe the model S to be the best 4 door sedan available, no contest. Keep the good work, listen to you customers.�
Jan 31, 2016
sorka +1 The current setup is not very good for those with TOU rates or those that want their battery charged right before they leave so it's warmed up.
I could care or less about setting the charge start time. I want to set the charge end time.
Even better, I'd like to enter my entire TOU schedule and let Tesla decide intelligently when to charge.
I've submitted both as feature requests more than once.�
Jan 31, 2016
CHG-ON Sorka: "Even better, I'd like to enter my entire TOU schedule and let Tesla decide intelligently when to charge"
Now THAT is the answer.�
Jan 31, 2016
AWDtsla There's a video of a Tesla engineer commenting about this feature many years ago. Why isn't it here? I have no idea. I wonder the same thing about many, many features.�
Jan 31, 2016
eye.surgeon I agree it would be a nice feature, one that no doubt will eventually be enabled. In the mean time it takes about 15 seconds of mental effort to do this on your own. I know my L2 charger puts on about 15% per hr. The math isn't hard to set the start time.�
Jan 31, 2016
green1 Elon was asked about this at an event one time, his answer was that he agreed completely that this is exactly how it should work.
Given that I'm somewhat surprised it hasn't appeared yet.�
Jan 31, 2016
gordo I actually built the capability to charge to an end time myself with some basic shell scripts that run on my home router. I can set a weekday and weekend schedule individually, and it calculates the start time based on my TOU rates. It also checks the charging cable every night and alerts me when it's unplugged. I'd commercialize it if i thought there was actually a business doing this, but figure Tesla will eventually get around to putting me out of business. ;-)�
Jan 31, 2016
AWDtsla VisibleTesla will also do this for you, should you not be programmatically inclined.�
Feb 1, 2016
AmpedRealtor The reason is because Tesla's software team's priorities are all screwed up. They are focused on things like Autopilot, summoning, and whatever else will grab a media headline, but have absolutely zero interest in adding (or even finishing) features that are useful, that exist in other vehicles, but that don't write headlines. Tesla is banking on customers either assuming those features exist, then giving Tesla a pass once they have the car, or not even caring. The software team's mandates come from higher up the executive chain, it's not too difficult to connect the dots to know who is setting those priorities. It's time for us to push back because Tesla is completely ignoring the basics.
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Elon's priority is to go to Mars, Tesla has become a distraction for him.�
Feb 1, 2016
sorka I do the math and I'm usually pretty close but my wife simply is not capable of it.
But even when I do the math, it means I have to change the start charge time just about every single time I pull into the garage.�
Feb 1, 2016
Gizmotoy I have to say, I spend an disappointing amount of time calculating when and at what rate I should charge to make sure I'm full by the time I want to drive it next. It's worse when I'm going to 100% and want to account for top-balancing. I really should be able to specify a charge level, and the time I want it complete, and have the car figure out the rest. If I have TOU meters, it should take that into account as well. Based on comments made when I purchased, I had no idea it'd be two and a half years later and the car would still lack this feature.
I do think a lot of resources that are assigned to headline-grabbing features of largely minimal value to owners would be better put towards fixing the car's current deficiencies. For example, I suspect this feature plus things like the lacking media subsystem get far more owner use than summon. They're so far down the backlog, though, it's unlikely we'll see any movement on them.
Honestly, the focus on grabbing headlines over all else concerns me greatly. Are they doing that because they're in serious financial trouble, or see trouble looming? If it's considered advertising, why is advertising coming at the expense of other features owners want more?�
Feb 1, 2016
scaesare Are you sure?
I run VT, and I've never seen anything other than start-time capability.
I'm running the 50.mumble.08 version of VT I believe...�
Feb 1, 2016
Cottonwood I agree that Tesla should add this feature, but a little mental math is good for mind and soul. :biggrin:�
Feb 1, 2016
AWDtsla Well, it won't do the charge time calculation for you, but you can set different scheduled charge times with much finer granularity than what Tesla provides.
Can probably implement the current SoC to calculate start of charge time in an afternoon of work. Not rocket surgery.�
Feb 1, 2016
ChrisPDX As a ToU user, I would love this feature. Get the battery as warm as possible before my rates go up. I'm just glad Tesla has at least made some improvements. Those old enough to remember pre-4.5 versions? You plugged the car in and it started charging. No scheduling features at all! Many people wired timers into their 14-50 outlet to get it to start at certain times. Thankfully I wasn't using a ToU rate plan back then. You also could only pick between 90% or 100% charge.
Also, not given Tesla enough credit on is the location awareness for the scheduler. Not something you think about until you use another car without it. Whenever I use a public charger in my Fiat 500e, I have to remember to go into it's settings and disable the schedule before plugging in. And if I forget and close the door, the option goes away and you have to restart the car to get to the option again.�
Feb 1, 2016
scaesare So for clarification, VT does NOT do what the OP is referring to.
Are you inferring there's a way to do this without programming then?�
Feb 1, 2016
Fiebrudo There is no need for advanced mental math to be applied, and I appreciate the advice of our friend the good ophthalmologist.
The car achieves its full charge as always, then starts to slowly loose charge, if the software is made aware of time the car will hit the road, then restarts charging perhaps an hour earlier or 30 min earlier depending on the level of charge and brings it back to the desired full state.�
Feb 1, 2016
kirkbauer Hah! I have exactly the same setup! It also turns on climate control at the end of the work day for me.
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For me I want it to end as close as possible to my departure time so the battery didn't sit at full charge and is already warm when I get in.�
Feb 1, 2016
Barry Soon...�
Feb 1, 2016
ITSELE My first EV was a Nissan Leaf and it had the ability to choose your charging end time with v1.0 of their software, so DUH TESLA. Until Tesla adds this feature here is the "easy way" with only subtraction needed.
1. Plug in and start charging your car at the amperage you want to use with NO A/C or heat on (will affect time displayed)
2. After you start charging, the car will show you "Hours and Minutes Remaining"
3. Subtract the time remaining from your end time and set your timer to that time.
As an example, I plugged in and it told me 3 hours 30 minutes remaining. I want to leave at 7AM. I set my timer for 3:30AM.
I'm not sure if the above was simply obvious but no one mentioned it so I chimed in.
Does anyone think that maybe it is a patented feature and that is why we don't see it? Probably not since Porsche and Nissan are using it.�
Feb 1, 2016
CLLACAB My Volt is even easier. You have the option for all seven days of the week to say what time you want the charge completed. It knows when to start to finish on time.�
Feb 2, 2016
kirkbauer I like that!�
Feb 2, 2016
ThosEM They supposedly implemented (in beta) a smart pre-conditioning feature, but though I've enabled it, I've never seen it work. Maybe since they couldn't get that working, they gave up?
In any case, most commuting days require about the same amount of charging so you can just do what is recommended below once and preset it for your typical day. Then just start it just before bed when you have more than the usual amount of charging to do. Finish up the charging in the morning when you do the pre-conditioning that never happens by itself ;=)
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Feb 2, 2016
tomas Ironic, I've got an eGolf where you can ONLY specify departure time (not charge start time), and a Model S where you can ONLY specify charge start time (not departure time). Given the two models, I'd say that I far prefer the Tesla one. I start charging off peak at midnight, and complete off peak early AM sometime, regardless of whether I'm adding 10% or 90%. If I decide to depart earlier than normal, no problem. Put another way, if I have an early appointment and I forgot to change my departure time, no problem. In terms of making the charging completely transparent, I like the Tesla model. All I sacrifice is a couple of miles per day of vampire loss. At off peak costs, maybe 25 cents? I hope Tesla adds departure time to satisfy those of you who want it - but it is certainly way down on my priority list, and I pray that they don't eliminate the option to use start time.�
Feb 2, 2016
AmpedRealtor It sounds like any one of us might be better qualified than whoever it is at Tesla making these decisions.�
Feb 2, 2016
kirkbauer If I could design it it would work this way: if scheduled charging is enabled the user must enter a desired charging complete time (ideally by day of week). The user could also (optionally) configure a "not before" time.
So if I say I want it fully charged at 7AM and it needs 2 hours of charging then it would start at 5AM. But if it needs 10 hours of charging and I said not to start charging earlier than 11PM then it would start at 11PM and not be fully charged at 7AM. Now at that point it is debatable if it should stop charging or continue (or if that should also be configurable).�
Feb 2, 2016
tomas disagree. I like their approach on this one.�
Feb 3, 2016
AndY1 That's the third option the Volt has had since beginning (Rate & Departure time):
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Feb 3, 2016
kirkbauer Wow, it really puts Tesla's interface to shame, and you'd think this would be a core feature to Tesla that they'd focus on.
On the plus side I'm very happy to have an API that I can use to do this manually for now, I'm guessing no other vehicles offer that.�
Feb 3, 2016
brkaus The techies aside, simple is probably better. The more complicated the options the more the masses will be confused (even if they don't need the options).�
Feb 3, 2016
GasKilla The location charging time is great but they need to add more than just one start time. On weekends my TOU rates don't apply so I can charge at anytime, it would be very nice to have a separate timer for the weekend plus a "finish charging by" time for the northern folks.
We have a fiat 500e aslo and overriding the charging timer is a pain, but very easy on the Leaf because it was a dedicated button ... I don't miss buttons�
Feb 4, 2016
tomas I'm a techie, and I totally agree with you. Adds little value and has potential to add much confusion.
Now, having said that, timed pre-conditioning would be great. But that does not need to be linked to charging completion. I think a lot of posters here are conflating the two.
I believe the reason that Tesla has not implemented the same myriad options as Volt, my eGolf, etc. is this: they are trying really hard to design the car so it doesn't scream "hey I'm electric, I'm different from what you've driven your whole life, and you need to learn all kinds of new things!" I believe that is behind some of the instrument cluster changes as well. This forum - by and large - seems populated by people who are technically oriented and want all of the controls. The lions share of the market not only doesn't value that - they don't want it. Tesla wants big market penetration and minimal EV-phobia, so that's how they are building their car, this forum be damned... and I think that is right decision.�
Feb 5, 2016
Bluespark So what most people here are saying is that every little thing another company comes up with, Tesla should have it to. Ok, then pop on over to those companies respective sites or call the companies directly and tell them their cars should have everything the MS has.
Is it really difficult to do some basic math. you need 90 miles added to get to 90% by 7 am? Start the charging at 4 am. Problem solved.�
Feb 5, 2016
sorka It's just not optimal for range OR battery longevity.
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Agreed, but oversimplified on the other side of the spectrum is even worse because it leaves the consumer powerless to make the product function as it should.�
Feb 5, 2016
kirkbauer The MS really needs to have an "Advanced Mode" to enable more customization and options for those of us who want it while keeping it simple for the average person.
A huge chunk of MS owners are techies and otherwise people who can handle complexity and would prefer more control.�
Feb 5, 2016
AmpedRealtor You mean the approach of limiting features and not adding features which owners are asking for? That approach?
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Because there is a better way that others have figured out. Why must Tesla reinvent the wheel with every little thing instead of looking around at the useful features in other vehicles and adopting those? It would give owners a lot more of what they are asking for, reduce the amount of work for Tesla because they could "get it right" the first time, and it would add immensely to owner satisfaction. Seems a little difficult for Tesla to grasp this concept.�
Feb 6, 2016
David_Cary
Obviously it is not difficult to do basic math. But it also isn't difficult to turn on your own headlights, turn on your own wipers, hit the button to open your garage door. And it isn't the math, it is the changing the timer.
My situation. Monday - 30 miles. Free charger at work. Tuesday - 80 miles. Wed - 10 miles. Thurs - 70 miles. Fri ??? Sat ??? Sun ???
Every day changing the timer when a simple setting that many other EVs have (dare I say all real EVs?)
The Leaf (ie number 1 selling EV in most areas) has start and end timers, 2 timers - defined by day of week.
I get the KISS but it just isn't optimal and we aren't talking about some mechanical thing that will break or something that needs tweaking once set. Ignoring an end setting hurts efficiency.�
Feb 6, 2016
jcaspar This would be a cool feature but unless I am missing something, it seems it is a feature I would only use a few times a year for long trips. Most days I charge to 80 or 90% and have an EV rate of 0.06$ that runs from 10pm to 4pm in the winter. I just set start time to 10:05pm and never think about it. For the night before a long trip (where I need 100%), I just set it to 90% and then about an hour before I leave I use the app to change it to 100%. This I only need to do 3-4 times a year. On these days it might help though my trip departure times can often vary and it it nice to know I have 90% for sure in the morning and not that the car is waiting till later to start charging.�
Feb 6, 2016
AmpedRealtor The same argument against adding departure time to the app is the same argument against adding Autopilot to the car. Autopilot is as far from KISS as humanly possible, in my opinion. KISS is not a good principle to follow when you have the power of software that can make life so much simpler. It's a good feature to have and Tesla should implement it. It's a basic, simple algorithm that a high school programmer could put together.�
Feb 6, 2016
jcaspar Which still leaves me wondering how this would help me and why I would use it other than the 3-4 times a year when I need a 100% charge at a specific time. The auto open garage feature is certainly much more useful to me as I use that 3-4 times a day, not a year. I suspect Tesla is prioritizing their programers time or is just short on high school programers. :smile:
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Feb 6, 2016
BozieBeMe2 +2
I want it ALL,, (yes, I do have issues with 'power')�
Feb 6, 2016
AmpedRealtor Too bad the auto open/close feature doesn't really work.�
Feb 6, 2016
dpodoll BTW - Tesla out sold leaf (and every other EV or Luxury Sedan) in USA in 2015
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??? works flawlessly for us???�
Feb 7, 2016
David_Cary Sure Tesla outsold Leaf in 2015 but not 2012,2013,2014 or cumulative including 2015. So I still stand by my statement.
I'm with you - the auto open/close works fine.�
Feb 7, 2016
AmpedRealtor Check one of the other software threads, it doesn't work flawlessly for a lot of us
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Feb 8, 2016
3mp_kwh +1 I set the Volt for the entire year, and it changes both time of day, and season, without further input. Most regions with TOU are tight to a schedule, as approved by their DPU, PUC, PSC, etc. This is so basic, especially for a car that can mow through kwh. I wish Tesla would add scheduling.
While Tesla is at it:
Next, my region is to adopt even more complicated Time Varying Rates, possibly with super-peaks. More flexibility needed.
Since it's a BEV, how about an "I'm not charged" alarm, for times an EVSE, a CHAdeMO, or the car fails to charge, and you would have preferred a phone call/text/email, instead of being stranded.�
Feb 8, 2016
David99 This could be done with an external app running. It would monitor the state of charge constantly and using a simple formula (based on the charge power you have available at home) starts the charge process to be ready at a given time. The 'ready time' is usually the same every day so that setting would rarely need to be changed.�
Feb 9, 2016
tomas For whom? See, that to me is the fallacy of making this all about departure time. For people who commute to work, departure time is a pretty routine thing 5 days per week. Much of the working and retired world does not do that (me included). For us: some activities from home... some activities require driving... some require flying/travel. And, there would be nothing worse than getting up for an early 5am airport departure only to find that the car just started charging.
That is why - for me and many others - setting a charging start time (of midnight) is not only sufficient, but better. It is always charging in off-peak rate period, and is always within 1% of desired SOC when I need it - whether that is at 5 am or 10 am, or I don't drive for a whole day. The cost? Max of 1 kWh per day of "vampire drain", which at off-peak is <15 cents.
I just don't get this whole obsession with departure time charging. To save maybe 15 cents per day? And, don't give me that battery life thing... unless you range charge all the time. I DO understand departure time pre-conditioning... but that wouldn't work for many of us in any regard because our schedule varies.�
Feb 9, 2016
AWDtsla Charge scheduling has ZERO impact on vampire drain.�
Feb 9, 2016
scaesare Works like a charm for me.�
Feb 9, 2016
tomas OK, I guess you are right because the range was going to drain... whether before or after the charge. Agreed. So one more reason not to give a hoot about departure time charging. Thanks!�
Feb 9, 2016
scaesare There was some discussion of rolling this in to Visible Tesla, but development on that great little program has been at a standstill for a while.�
Feb 9, 2016
kirkbauer It does a little. If it stops charging right before you get in the car then the range will be exactly what you set it to. But if it stopped charging 4 hours ago then you will have lost some range due to vampire drain. No change in energy use but it changes the SOC when you depart.
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There are two good reasons to use departure-time charging.
1) Minimize amount of time vehicle sits at high SOC therefore reducing battery degradation.
2) Battery is warm when you start driving, reducing the amount of energy used to heat the battery pack on cold days, therefore improving range and reducing energy usage.
For people like me with a super-off-peak charging period and a fairly fixed schedule, I'd prefer the vehicle to start charging at the beginning of the super-off-peak period, then stop when it hits 50% SOC, and then resume at the correct time to hit my target SOC at my departure time. This would keep the SOC closer to 50% for more time while still charging within the least expensive window.�
Feb 9, 2016
tomas I understand why there are some people who give a hoot. I just don't... much prefer start time. And I personally think it is un-necessary anxiety to obsess about SOC unless you are regularly charging above the manufacturer's "daily" charge range. Yes, keeping your average SOC at exactly 50% might improve your longevity or range retention by some minimal amount. Is it worth the anxiety? Not for me.�
Feb 9, 2016
kirkbauer Yes everybody is different. I have had the same electric toothbrush for 15 years because I manage the battery well, where my wife is on her third. When it comes to the $40k battery pack in my P85D I think it is reasonable to expect the vehicle to help minimize degradation especially if it can be done in a "set up and forget" way.
There is also environmental impact -- degrading batteries have to be replaced more often, and wasting electricity to heat your battery up every morning is not an efficient use of our resources.�
Feb 9, 2016
AWDtsla If that tiny bit of loss impacts your drive, you really need to reconsider what you are doing. A small head wind or drop in temperature will easily blow that difference away and you will be getting towed.�
Feb 9, 2016
Camera-Cruiser I think you hit the nail on the head, and you are probably 100 correct. Just goosing it a couple times negates any savings. I'm guessing every engineer at Tesla knows it.
But, and there is always a but, it's not the point at all. Before I got my Tesla, I assumed that I plugged it in at night and set a departure time and it would figure out the rest (being the most advanced internet connected car in the world). I also assumed that the climate control would be running and I would find the car set for me as desired based on a simple calendar schedule. If I didn't open the car within a time window I set, it would go back to sleep, or even send me an alert. Finding this wonderful forum post purchase, it seems that most owners think the same.
This is just like when Apple came out with the iPhone. Despite its wonders, you couldn't copy and paste, and that pissed people off because it affected perceived usability,and made the new owners the but of many jokes for years until Apple finally added that feature to the OS.
To me, this and a variety of other things listed in many other Tesla wish lists, is Tesla's version of copy and paste. It should've been there day one. User profiles by key fob day two, etc.�
Feb 10, 2016
AmpedRealtor That's one. lol�
Feb 10, 2016
MP3Mike There is also the issue of power reliability. If you plug your car in and don't have it start charging until the last minute, what happens if the power goes out? That means you might not have enough of a charge to go about your business for the day. If you charge as soon as you can, and the rates are right, the power going out a few hours before you leave is less likely to be an issue. (Of course I wouldn't expect it to be a problem very often since the grid is fairly reliable, but it is an issue.)�
Feb 10, 2016
green1 Is power reliability really that big an issue in most places?
The last time I had a power outage at home was several years ago, it lasted less than 5 minutes. The longest outage I have ever had at home was about an hour�
Feb 10, 2016
Gizmotoy It's too bad, actually. It's a very useful tool. I'd be tossing around the idea of creating an open-source native Mac OS version, but haven't had a ton of time lately. I wish I had knowledge of or interest in Java to pick up and work on what's there, but I just don't.
A lot of owners have great ideas for new features, as this example shows.�
Feb 10, 2016
tomas Sorry, but this "miss" is just not near the equivalent of cut and paste. The problem with this type of UI critique is that everybody has their own subjective list of misses, and unless Tesla had shipped with 100% of what is on everybody's list, there'd still be moaning. I own 4 cars right now. My Model S on day 1 in December 2012 had more UI functionality than any of the others... and it has continued to improve - which the others have not! Yes, I even have my own list of wanna have's and critiques, but each time I get in one of my other cars - the Tesla UI shortcomings fade away in comparison.�
Feb 10, 2016
trond.strom I believe that the Android App Mebot https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.lelimit.mt
can set charging timers as well as HVAC timers.
It is rather costly, but then we all have 100k cars so if another 20 dollars can enhance your functionality i dont really see the problem.�
Feb 11, 2016
scaesare It is a very useful tool.
I'm not a big Java fan either... of course I'd prefer a Win native flavor...�
Feb 11, 2016
green1 It's good to see someone finally write a Tesla app for Android, but $20 is an awful lot for what it provides.�
Feb 11, 2016
Soolim It appears that the charge timer is to set start time, NOT end time, so it does not meet OP intent.�
Feb 12, 2016
trond.strom It appears so, I bought it to test. Climate scheduling is a nice option on the phone though.
from the developer website it seems that version 1.7 will support end time charging
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Feb 12, 2016
jcaspar You might want to work on the set point. I had to adjust mine once and it is now 100% both in and out. Very cool!!
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Feb 20, 2016
Andyw2100 It's amazing to me how frequently people on TMC will say "I wouldn't use this feature, so I don't think Tesla should offer it." I honestly don't get it.
No one is suggesting that Tesla offer end-time scheduled charging at the expense of giving up start-time scheduled charging. It's not either or. And you don't have to choose only one, and use that one exclusively. That's the beauty of having options.
When I see software options and requests being discussed on TMC I ask myself if what's being discussed makes sense for enough people that I think Tesla should offer it. Whether I'd personally make use of the functionality or not is irrelevant to how I'll weigh in.
In general, more options are better. I recognize the concern about the interface becoming too complicated for the masses, and I agree that the answer to that is to just add an expert mode if and when it becomes a problem. Don't dumb down the capability of the system to what you think the lowest common denominator wants. That's just silly.
As for the specifics of why end-time scheduling is so important for charging, as has been stated up thread, it's all about the battery temperature. I notice a lot of people who live in California stating a lack of need for this feature, or a lack of understanding as to why it is needed. You clearly have not had to drive out into -5 degree F temperatures in a car that sat in a 30 degree F garage all night and finished charging two hours before you wound up leaving. It's only partially about the energy savings in not having to reheat the pack. For me it's about having a consistent experience with respect to regenerative braking. I would prefer to never have a regenerative braking limit, or to have one for as little time as possible. But owning a dual drive Model S, I also want to maximize my car's efficiency, which means driving with range mode on. Driving with range mode on means the battery is not going to heat at all on its own. The only heat to the battery will be the heat generated from driving. In very cold weather, starting with a very cold pack, it can take a very, VERY long time for the regen limit to go away.
My wife leaves for work at different times every day. Based on the weather, she arrives home with varying states of charge every day. I used to just have the car start charging at 1:00 or 2:00 AM, to get the benefit of the lower night rate, and not worry about anything else. But this winter I've been trying to see how much I can improve things by trying to have the car finish charging just before she leaves for work. So to accomplish this, (since she doesn't really give a hoot) I need to find out what time she'll be leaving in the morning, check what rated range the car has left, and then figure out what time to start the charge. I've discovered that with temperatures about 25 to 30 degrees F or higher, and charging at 56 amps for at least three hours (her commute is over 50 miles each way), if she leaves within a few minutes of when the charge completes there is a good chance she won't have a regen limit. I am about to start playing with charging at a higher amp setting (probably 72), which will generate more heat, to see if that does an even better job of eliminating the regen limit more consistently, and at lower temperatures.
My point is the steps I am taking are a bit of a pain. I'm pretty sure if my wife could simply enter her departure time when she arrived home, she'd do that. She just doesn't want to be bothered with more than that, since I'm already asking her to take a photo of the trip meter and send it to me, along with the amount of rated range she used, the weather conditions, the wind speed, etc. (I track her trips.) She's putting up with enough, and she doesn't feel like also doing the mental math to figure out when she should start charging. Now that I'm going to be messing with the charging amperage as well, she'd be even less likely to want to do it.
This would be a simple function for the car to handle. Tesla could even have an optional tie in with pre-conditioning of the cabin. You could check a box that indicates that you want the cabin pre-heated or pre-cooled at the same departure time, and now they'd really be giving us additional functionality.
I understand some people wouldn't use this. That's fine. Many of us would, and that's why Tesla should make it happen.�
Feb 21, 2016
darthy001 Exactly. Getting so tired of people arguing against nice and _simple _ features because they dont think they would personally need/use them! Many people obviously would like this extremely simple option. So why spend so much time arguing against it? As Ampedrealtor writes this could be done by someone who just graduated from hello world-apps. No one is asking Tesla to remove todays option as that would be moronic.......
This winter I have wanted this setting each and every single day. Not for power-cost, but for having a warm battery with full power and a bit of regen when driving away in the morning. Setting the starttime every day both gets old very fast and I routinley forget it.. End effect is that I start of many mornings with no regen and limited power
In the summer I actually want the standard start-time option. Go figure! It is possible to want both options�
Feb 21, 2016
jerry33 I use that function on the Leaf. I would use it on the Tesla if it was available. The only concern would be how "precise" it tries to be. For example, you set it to end at 05:00 for an 05:30 leave time, but the power degrades to 30 amps due to some fluctuation which can't be predicted, and the charge ends up taking an hour longer. This wouldn't be a problem for me because of the daily distance I typically travel (50-75 miles), but I could see how it might be a problem for some.�
Feb 21, 2016
tezzla This is my routine and probably wouldn't work for most people, but I thought I'd share it: I usually drive my car about 50-100 miles a day (but still charge to 90%�
Feb 21, 2016
AWDtsla This is why you NEVER design something by committee. It's slightly worse here because you throw apologists and rationalizers into the mix, who can only work backwards from "it's perfect, why would you want to change it"�
Feb 21, 2016
Kickin This^^. My daily mileage is less, so I set the charge limit to 70% in winter, 60% in summer and always start @ 4:15am, depart at 7am on a 30A EVSE. I also miss the end time the leaf has though.�
Feb 21, 2016
Andyw2100 I've considered this issue.
This gets even closer to the possible need for the "Expert" settings, but one additional option selection--prioritize completion time or prioritize charge-level--would pretty much solve this problem. For those who selected "prioritize charge-level" the algorithm would build in more wiggle room, and would very often finish much earlier than necessary, to account for the possibility of power degradation during charging. For those who prioritize completion time, the charge would end very close to the set time, and if there was any power degradation the charge level would just be below what it was supposed to be (it would not have actually completed.)
I think that pretty much solves the problem.
Edit: Make the algorithm really smart, allow it to adjust the amperage within a set range, and it could do an even better job. If you've prioritized charge level, and it is clear that it will reach the charge level early, because there was no power degradation, it could lower the power on its own near the end. Similarly, to build in some safety net, it could generally charge at a slightly lower than the max amps you've said you'd allow, and then if there is an issue at some point during charging that eventually goes away, that might be able to be compensated for by charging at the higher level for some time. There are very smart people working for Tesla. They could do this, and do it well, if they so desired.�
Feb 21, 2016
jcaspar I don't think anyone has said this. Several of us had said we wouldn't use this feature and are simply trying to understand why it is necessary but I haven't heard anyone say "I don't think Tesla should offer it".�
Feb 21, 2016
andrewknight +1 This is the only feature that my Nissan LEAF did better than my Tesla. My TOU rate ends at 7am so would simply set it to 6:45 every day. It worked great! As for cluttering up the UI it is a simple start/end time toggle switch.�
Feb 21, 2016
Ampster I have had three cars that didn't do this well. My solution was a timer on the EVSE. It turns on and off when my super off peak starts and ends. I have an overdue switch for weekends and other times. That way both of my cars are ready for any demand charging at free charging spots in my little beach town.�
Feb 21, 2016
Andyw2100 I don't know that it went that far in this particular thread, and I don't believe I actually claimed that it did. It definitely gets to that point often in other threads.
As for the people saying simply "I wouldn't use it" it seems like often the "so I don't think Tesla should offer it" is implied. If that isn't the intended implication, why not just ask, "How would this be useful?"�
Feb 23, 2016
tomas OK, let me be clear in my post then. I wouldn't use it. I also think Tesla should not offer it. Why? I do not think Tesla should strive for a complicated, thousands of options, "everything for everybody" interface. I think they have to make choices. I believe that for the vast majority of owners, start time is sufficient. I feel, in a lot of ways, it is better. When software calculates when to start charging based on a departure time, it has to assume a certain rate of charging. Any fluctuations can throw of the departure time. I have departure time on my eGolf - with no ability to set start time. Have seen situations where it is still charging at departure time. I much prefer the Tesla approach.�
Feb 23, 2016
jerry33 They've already wrecked the interface with v7. one more thing won't matter. (although this is something I use on the Leaf and would use on the Tesla).�
Feb 23, 2016
Andyw2100 Well, luckily for those of us that want and need the feature, it would seem you are in the minority.
Below is an image of the most requested features, as voted on by members of TMC, discussed in the article linked to in this post, from that thread: Vote on software features/bugs to fix in 7.1 and beyond - Page 11
The ability to set a departure time was the fifth most requested feature.�
Feb 23, 2016
Canuck But we all know on-line polls can be deceptive since they only sample like minded individuals, at least when it comes to using this Tesla forum. To be clear, I'm not saying we all think alike, except to the extent that we all have thought very much alike when it comes to coming here, registering, and participating in the poll you have referenced. Looking at it from that angle, the poll participants are a very tiny minority when it comes to Tesla owners and they are also, perhaps, the type of people that like to be able to control things, including the ability to set a departure time, whereas the vast majority of Tesla owners perhaps couldn't care less about it.
A true poll on this issue would be a random sample of Tesla owners, just large enough to give a reasonable margin of error. Maybe it would still be the 5th most requested feature, but maybe not. One thing is for certain though, citing an on-line poll as something that applies to the vast majority of Tesla owners is not proving your point.�
Feb 23, 2016
Andyw2100 Fair enough.
But without any other information available would you agree that it's fair to say that it appears to be a feature that many owners want?�
Feb 23, 2016
Az_Rael Sorry for being a newbie here (and I haven't read all 9 pages of thread), but am I getting this straight that you can't set TOU times or "charge complete by X" times with a Tesla?
My Volt has this capability (which I use all the time to stay within my "super-off peak rates") so I am surprised to read that Tesla doesn't offer this?�
Feb 23, 2016
jerry33 Right now the only thing you can set is the start time. I don't doubt that some future firmware upgrade will add this feature, but there's no telling when it might appear. Having said that, it's pretty easy to know how long your charging takes and to set the timer appropriately so that it ends within the best TOU. It helps if you have an HPWC because you can charge at 80 amps.�
Feb 23, 2016
Petra Eh, the Leaf has has start timers in addition to departure timers since day one... it is a bit odd that Tesla doesn't have departure timers or manually configurable preconditioning timers (another thing that the Leaf has). I mean, the smart preconditioning is there but it's pretty useless.
Either way, I never made use of the departure timers in the Leaf so I'm not complaining. It would be nice to have a manually configurable preconditioning timer, like the Leaf, though.�
Feb 23, 2016
tomas Agree. Statistically inconclusive. The members of this forum are a decidedly tech-biased group, many of which have prior EV experience. I believe the people who frequent here are more likely to want broader options and controls, and option to do it the way they did in their leaf or volt or whatever.
- - - Updated - - -
I think I'm the lucky one here, because the feature is not there, and I'm perfectly happy to not have it.�
Feb 23, 2016
Andyw2100 Touche!�
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