teslamotorclub: Model X Update Email 11/18/2014 part 2

Just received, emphasis mine

Dear Model X reservation holders,

Thank you for your continued patience in the Model X reservation process. We are making steady progress towards delivering a phenomenal car that defies comparison.

With Model S, we made a point of delivering a product that was even better than the show car, and we are extending that philosophy to Model X. In fact, every element of Model X � from the interior to the falcon wing doors � either lives up to or surpasses the prototype we initially unveiled.

In October, we announced dual motor all-wheel drive and Autopilot. These were important leaps forward for Model S, but we�re pleased to confirm that they will also be central to Model X. The dual motor propulsion system of Model S 85D will be the same system that powers Model X, delivering uncompromised range and control of traction. But this is not simply a scaled-up Model S � every detail of this car has been optimized for the unique mission of Model X.

Model X demand has been intense and orders are continuing to come in at a rapid rate. We�ll be spending much of 2015 building and testing production-intent prototypes before delivering the first cars to customers in North America in the third quarter. While we�ll be working through all orders as fast as possible, anyone ordering the car today should not expect delivery until well into 2016.

In the meantime, we are building beta vehicles in the factory right now, and we�ll be using them for crash testing in the near future. We�ve tested the car�s aerodynamic qualities in the wind tunnel and have achieved an unprecedented level of aerodynamic efficiency for any car of this size and carrying capacity, allowing us to maximize range potential.

We can also reveal that Model X will be the first electric vehicle with towing capability. The optional tow hitch will support accessories and racks to transport skis and bikes with the minimum effect on aerodynamics. We're also working with the best rack and accessory companies in the world to have elegant carrying solutions ready for Model X customers next year.

Thank you once again for your continued support and confidence. You are helping to accelerate the world�s transition to sustainable transport, and you will love your Model X.

Tesla Motors
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And though I didn't bold it, they also mention at the end that they're still working on a rack solution (for those worried about the doors -- of which there was no mention).

Not much new there, but glad to have the communication.
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Initial takeaways from this email:

1. Falcon wing doors aren't going anywhere.
2. No roof-rack solution will be available, but hitch-mounted storage will be used instead.

I'm glad they finally got something out to address Model X directly. Too bad they didn't give a hint as to when they'll be ready to show the beta.
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Interesting that it appears that Tesla won't be offering the P85D equivalent Model X, just the 85D drivetrain. That will leave the Porsche Cayenne S/GTS/Turbo as the fastest SUV in the market. An "XP85D" would leave them all behind.

The tow-instead-of-roof approach makes a lot of sense. (a) It solves the problem of how both falcon doors can be open at the same time; (b) it creates less drag than roof-mounted gear; (c) it's easier to access; the Model X is a tall vehicle; and (d) no risk of shearing your bicycles off when you drive into your garage without realizing they're up there!
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'The dual motor system of the 85D'

Is this their way of saying no 60 pack for the X???
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hingisfan said: ?

'The dual motor system of the 85D'

Is this their way of saying no 60 pack for the X???
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I think it is and that's good however, i do not feel it says no performance model! but maybe we are creeping closer to a larger capacity battery...... just maybe..
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I think that 60kWh and PD versions of the X are ruled out by this communique. Although there's just enough ambiguity that I can't be sure.

But we can continue to speculate about a 1nn kWh battery pack option. :biggrin:
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timf said: ?

2. No roof-rack solution will be available, but hitch-mounted storage will be used instead.
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I took this part of the email to mean they WERE working on a rack solution:

We're also working with the best rack and accessory companies in the world to have elegant carrying solutions ready for Model X customers next year.
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hingisfan said: ?

'The dual motor system of the 85D'

Is this their way of saying no 60 pack for the X???
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They said of the Model S 85D -- which is right since there's no 60D on the Model S. I won't write off the possibility of there being no 60 pack on the X (though I think it's unlikely it'll be a 85 car only -- they'd have to bring out something above it IMO), but I think if there's a 60, there'll have to be a 60D on the X since it's touted as being standard.
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AnOutsider said: ?

...but I think if there's a 60, there'll have to be a 60D on the X since it's touted as being standard.
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Right, which is what leads me to conclude there won't be a 60X: adding configuration complexity back into the recently streamlined assembly process would be counterproductive.
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stevezzzz said: ?

I think that 60kWh and PD versions of the X are ruled out by this communique. Although there's just enough ambiguity that I can't be sure.

But we can continue to speculate about a 1nn kWh battery pack option. :biggrin:
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I agree about the 60, but no performance? That seems like crazy talk to me. It's their biggest money maker. Also, not including it would contradict the earlier statement from the same email that the production car will 'live up to or surpass the prototype we initially unveiled.' There's either a P variant, or the standard will be faster than a 911. Which do you think is more likely?
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Sorry, finally lost optimism after the massive delay and took this email into blabla-decrypter:

"We won't show you the beta this year!"

and

"Only signature reservation holders may eventually get their car in late 2015!"
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Robert.Boston said: ?

Interesting that it appears that Tesla won't be offering the P85D equivalent Model X, just the 85D drivetrain. That will leave the Porsche Cayenne S/GTS/Turbo as the fastest SUV in the market. An "XP85D" would leave them all behind.
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C'mon, we all know that Elon is a bit of a showman at heart. He wouldn't want to take away from the big reveal of the XP85D at the roll out exhibition. Look at what he just did with the "D" rollout. He'll have a similar setup to what he did there and at the initial "S" roll out. He'll have a bunch of cars and drivers to ferry customers around the track and he'll get to say that the Model X Performance with dual motors will do 0-60 in 3.5 seconds or whatever it will do. He'll get to show off all the special features they've come up with in the last two years since the initial reveal.

You just know it's going to happen.
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I'm sitting here imagining Tesla employees reading this thread & saying, 'wow, I had no idea they'd interpret it THAT way!'.

... Just my way of saying 'be careful not to overthink and find hidden meaning in an email'.
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Doesn't the website make it clear that they will offer a Performance X with Dual Motors? Model X | Tesla Motors as well as say the 60 kWh battery will be an option? I know Tesla can change their mind at anytime, but until they make changes to the bottom of the Model X detail page, I'm assuming that they will have the options available.

That being said, the version I'd go for would be the Performance X with Dual Motors and an 85kWh (Or larger battery).
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Of course there will be a Performance Dual Motor X. Just like of course there will be Falcon Wing doors despite a multitude of posts saying there won't be.
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I'm excited that there will be a factory trailer hitch as an option.
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I know it wasn't stated but since the 85D propulsion system will be used for the Model X, will the P85D propulsion system then be used on the Model X Performance?
Thanks AnOutsider for showing this. Keep'em coming.
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I sure wish they would show us the cars BEFORE they crash them! Having said that, it looks like they are progressing well. I still have faith!
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stevezzzz said: ?

Right, which is what leads me to conclude there won't be a 60X: adding configuration complexity back into the recently streamlined assembly process would be counterproductive.
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There's not really much complexity there since the X will be AWD only. It wouldn't be too much to say S60 for RWD, X60D for AWD. The real reason not to offer an X60D would be if the X's price premium over the S is very high.

The towing thing actually has me wondering. I presume they mention the skis and bicycles to say "yes, we know the falcon doors mean you can't put them on the roof so we've designed an alternative". Maybe they're saving the tow rating for the reveal.
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I viewed today's email as a positive. I appreciate Tesla reaching out to the reservation holders, giving a status and ending the conjecture that the Falcon Door are gone. The email says the S85D drive will be "central" to the X. I would interpret as "Standard". We will have to wait and see if the P85D makes sense for the Model X -- it depends on the additional weight and height handling dynamics. Recognizing the prior announcement of the dual motor only available in the 85KW configuration, it already seemed unlikely that the 60KW AWD would be part of the X.

Thanks TESLA for sending some real information. I was tiring of speculation, rumor, and inaccuracies on the forums and in the media. GREAT that Tesla provided some accuracy and information. I am grateful that crash testing the Beta's is paramount to the production of the Model X. I would prefer TELSA Crash test the Beta's rather than me--maintaining the TESLA safety record.

Although it was a little late coming --- Glad Tesla stepped up the communications. Hope they continue the "throw us a bone" ever so often.
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Has anyone noticed the incredible thinness of the falcon wing doors in the email versus on the website. It seems they been dramatically thinned down. I for one am excited to compare when we see the full production compared to the prototype. The original is going to look so OLD!

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Sorry guys, tried to upload photos from my iPhone. This website wouldn't be less mobile friendly. Sad really.
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Tapatalk is a great mobile interface to this and other fora.
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Zaxxon said: ?

Tapatalk is a great mobile interface to this and other fora.
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There are other fora?
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Rumored to be.
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Here's the image, for those who didn't get the email:

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Tim Alguire said: ?

I sure wish they would show us the cars BEFORE they crash them! Having said that, it looks like they are progressing well. I still have faith!
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Unlikely. If you recall on the Model S Beta the FIRST thing they talked about was the safety of the car and showed clips of their own crash testing. They will very likely send the first few off to be crash tested immediately so if there is any glaring issues they can reinforce the car as needed. When they talked about the S safety they said they crashed the S to make sure it was solid, and then looked for other potential flaws to make those areas even better (like the rear bumper... which I don't think is ever crash tested "normally").

Assuming that everything checks out as intended from the crash test then I would expect the reveal to be shortly thereafter. If they are building them now, I would optimistically place a reveal in January if they go REALLY fast... March if they go REALLY slow.

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JimmyB said: ?

Here's the image, for those who didn't get the email:

View attachment 63950
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I hope those aren't TOO thin... what about side impact? If those pass as that thin it will be really cool because the current look did seem a little thick to me.
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From the image it looks like they are using standard mirrors, seems like the speculation about getting the camera based mirrors pushed through is put to bed for the initial launch.
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still has rear view mirrors in the photo. But I'm betting they'll be gone.
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chickensevil said: ?

I hope those aren't TOO thin... what about side impact? If those pass as that thin it will be really cool because the current look did seem a little thick to me.
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Remember that in a side impact, chassis integrity combined with airbag performance is most determinative in occupant protection. There's little to no side crush zone in any vehicle.

Model X has the same skateboard platform as Model S, which greatly reinforces the integrity of the passenger cell during a side hit.

What you probably want to look for is the strength of the B and C pillars, as well as the strength of the reinforcement bars inside the doors. Those will prevent cabin intrusion. The airbags take care of the rest.
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wow they pretty much showed the entire vehicle in the photo.

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My favorite part about that photo? There's no 3" from the top of the 17" screen protruding over the dash. I hope that's a sign.
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Great job with the image! Starting to look good!
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cool pic !! the car looks to be a little bit more squared off too compared to the "orb shaped" vehicle on the website; the thin doors look fantastic - they are likely very light
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I'm actually surprised at how similar it looks to the prototype. Wonder what's going on with the nose. Is it just masked in the photo or are they taking it in a new direction.

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Much more square roof line than expected... Thanks for the edit!
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We can also reveal that Model X will be the first electric vehicle with towing capability. The optional tow hitch will support accessories and racks to transport skis and bikes with the minimum effect on aerodynamics. We're also working with the best rack and accessory companies in the world to have elegant carrying solutions ready for Model X customers next year.
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That sounds like a "carry" hitch rather than a "tow" hitch.
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Canuck said: ?

That sounds like a "carry" hitch rather than a "tow" hitch.
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It sounds like both a carry hitch AND a tow hitch (or they would not have said the Model X will have towing capability).
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timf said: ?

2. No roof-rack solution will be available, but hitch-mounted storage will be used instead.
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This was my read too. I'm surprised because their head of product had said very clearly they had a roof rack workaround, but maybe he just meant there was an alternative to using a roof rack, not an alternative way of using one. Excited to see what they have in mind for people who are used to roof-mounting skis, cargo, kayaks, etc.
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JimmyB said: ?

Here's the image, for those who didn't get the email:

View attachment 63950
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Are we sure that this a completely accurate rendering. This picture seems specifically stylized to look like the Tesla T logo.
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@earlian:

I didn't read it that way at all. My interpretation is that they will start delivering in 3rdQ and with the faster ramp-up they have been talking about should deliver all of the sig's and a substantial number of production reservations in the 3rdQ. Of course given their track record that could slip again. BTW, I did not get the email.
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If they wanted to stylize it to look like the Tesla T logo than they would have lite the scene differently. This is a 3D rendering so they would have had total control of the image if that is what they were going for. I think this is accurate and not stylized.
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gpetti said: ?

Are we sure that this a completely accurate rendering. This picture seems specifically stylized to look like the Tesla T logo.
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This is definitely a new rendering, and not the same prototype we've been seeing all along. I'd say this is the first official teaser photo of the production Model X design.
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sjoshuaj said: ?

If they wanted to stylize it to look like the Tesla T logo than they would have lite the scene differently. This is a 3D rendering so they would have had total control of the image if that is what they were going for. I think this is accurate and not stylized.
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I thought that was exactly how they lit it. I've never noticed the T logo before in pictures until this one. People have had to photo shop it dramatically to make it visible.
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Good catch
and now there are people at Tesla reading this thread thinking "hey! The car looks like the logo. Who knew?!"
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Yes, the X with opened falcons looks like the Tesla Logo.

To make it nuts: Light the rim of the doors (At the right spots) with a high quality LED and you get a huge glowing Tesla-Logo on the streets at night.

What if tesla goes for that?

Ps. Fortunately there are no cup holders in that doors and they are still sharp like a blade. (for those who know the bicycle/horse thread)
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efusco said: ?

still has rear view mirrors in the photo. But I'm betting they'll be gone.
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Take a deeper Look at sjoshuaj's photo-mod: the mirrors are still there, but the holding arm is so thin, you can imagine to replace a camera there.

So, still hoping for a later retrofit, while I think the side cameras are also essential to improve the autopilot, for example when faster cars coming from behind, or night vision etc.

Greetings Earl
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I wonder how they decided who to send the email to. I've not received one, have other X reservation holders gotten one?
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RDoc said: ?

I wonder how they decided who to send the email to. I've not received one, have other X reservation holders gotten one?
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I finally got an email yesterday. After missing a few emails, I finally contacted Tesla via the website contact form to find out why. It appeared I opt'd out at some point, so they put me back in. Note: the send me Tesla updates checkbox on your TM profile didn't work to opt back in. So even if that's checked, it doesn't seem to be in sync with their marketing email tool.
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You have to think after the long production delay and advances with the battery pack since the advent of the S that they will offer an extended version for the X; my prediction is an X100 with at least the same or faster charging capabilities than the S85 and 500km+ range. With the timing of deliveries looking more likely into 2016, I'm aiming for a 50'th birthday present in spring 2017. That'll do, that'll do.
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FourBucks said: ?

You have to think after the long production delay and advances with the battery pack since the advent of the S that they will offer an extended version for the X; my prediction is an X100 with at least the same or faster charging capabilities than the S85 and 500km+ range. With the timing of deliveries looking more likely into 2016, I'm aiming for a 50'th birthday present in spring 2017. That'll do, that'll do.
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The first question is, "How much more are you willing to pay for that?", and the followup question is, "How often would you use that 500km+ range?".

People with 60kWh packs are driving cross-country now. There are some, because of their specific location, who could benefit from a longer range pack - but very few.
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bonnie said: ?

The first question is, "How much more are you willing to pay for that?", and the followup question is, "How often would you use that 500km+ range?".

People with 60kWh packs are driving cross-country now. There are some, because of their specific location, who could benefit from a longer range pack - but very few.
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in Canada the supercharger network is not very well extended and with the greater speeds and therefore faster depletion of the battery packs in europe a larger pack would be VERY welcome for the X but even for the S so ones an get to where one wants and keeping up with the local traffic at the same time.

edit

I would be willing to pay a good deal more for that autonomy
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bonnie said: ?

The first question is, "How much more are you willing to pay for that?", and the followup question is, "How often would you use that 500km+ range?".

People with 60kWh packs are driving cross-country now. There are some, because of their specific location, who could benefit from a longer range pack - but very few.
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Hey Bonnie, for me I would use that 500+ range on a weekly basis in the summer to get to and from our cottage on Georgian Bay (413km round trip. I can plug it into a 120V over the weekend to trickle charge so I won't have to stop for a SC in Barrie, which will hopefully be open before 2017! As for how much more I would be willing to spend...I was told by the Toronto store that "the Model S and X would be similarly priced, it just depends on which vehicle suits your needs more". Not holding my breath on that one...I expect a premium of high single digit precentage over the S for the X. There is hope though that with advances at the Gigafactory will bring those costs down but might not be in time for the X.
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FourBucks said: ?

Hey Bonnie, for me I would use that 500+ range on a weekly basis in the summer to get to and from our cottage on Georgian Bay (413km round trip. I can plug it into a 120V over the weekend to trickle charge so I won't have to stop for a SC in Barrie, which will hopefully be open before 2017! As for how much more I would be willing to spend...I was told by the Toronto store that "the Model S and X would be similarly priced, it just depends on which vehicle suits your needs more". Not holding my breath on that one...I expect a premium of high single digit precentage over the S for the X. There is hope though that with advances at the Gigafactory will bring those costs down but might not be in time for the X.
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They will be 'similarly priced for similar options'. And of course, we're talking dual-option AWD 'D' version. So if you wish for a larger battery capacity, it will likely cost more.
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It wouldn't surprise me if Tesla came with a 100-105 kWh battery at the price of the 85 kWh, got rid of the 60 kWh and dropped the price of the 85 kWh. But it may be that we won't see something like this happen until the Gigafactory is up and running.

The Model X could certainly use the larger battery, it will definitely have a larger aerodynamic frontal area, and lower range, especially at higher speeds. Coming with a larger battery pack would compensate for that. Good for towing, as well.
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bonnie said: ?

The first question is, "How much more are you willing to pay for that?", and the followup question is, "How often would you use that 500km+ range?".

People with 60kWh packs are driving cross-country now. There are some, because of their specific location, who could benefit from a longer range pack - but very few.
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I have stated this elsewhere but it bares repeating. The longer range isn't necessarily about going a longer distance. The longer range helps improve the recharge times. If they are only able to sustain a 135kW charge rate on the pack for the first 30-40% then they would be able to sustain that rate much longer on a bigger pack. This would drop the recharge time of say, 20 minutes for a 50% charge down to something closer to 10-15 minutes for the same number of miles returned (132). This puts you back on the road faster and brings us closer to that sweet spot for charge times to make it more reasonable. I don't think we *need* a 5 minute recharge time, but 20-30 minutes is still a bit long.

132 miles is a nice sweet spot to space out the superchargers since that has you on the road for about 2 hours at a time. So getting that core time down would be helpful, because you don't need a 30 minute break every 2 hours of driving. More like every 4 or 6 hours would you really want to stop for food or something, the other stops tend to be quick in and out bathroom breaks or whatever.

So it isn't necessarily about getting to 500 miles of range or some such, but more about getting your stops down to a slightly more reasonable number. I know you would just be happy with not having to stop for 4 hours at a time in your Roadster, and 20 or 30 minutes would be a godsend for you, but it still isn't quite at that sweet spot of time which I estimate to be around 10-15 minutes for a half charge (134 miles).
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FourBucks said: ?

Hey Bonnie, for me I would use that 500+ range on a weekly basis in the summer to get to and from our cottage on Georgian Bay (413km round trip. I can plug it into a 120V over the weekend to trickle charge so I won't have to stop for a SC in Barrie, which will hopefully be open before 2017! As for how much more I would be willing to spend...I was told by the Toronto store that "the Model S and X would be similarly priced, it just depends on which vehicle suits your needs more". Not holding my breath on that one...I expect a premium of high single digit precentage over the S for the X. There is hope though that with advances at the Gigafactory will bring those costs down but might not be in time for the X.
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Have you thought of a 24) volt electric clothes dryer outlet at the cabin. ? That's what I did at my Lakehouse. , cost only $120 .Easy to install for local electricians unused to NEMA 1450. I know nothing about Canadian electrical standards
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Not sure if this is the case, but wondering if some are confusing the 500km stated with 500miles? 500km is just over 300 miles, and I think that's more than reasonable. I know personally I'd use it, and even if I didn't regularly, I'd like to have that buffer.
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AnOutsider said: ?

Not sure if this is the case, but wondering if some are confusing the 500km stated with 500miles? 500km is just over 300 miles, and I think that's more than reasonable. I know personally I'd use it, and even if I didn't regularly, I'd like to have that buffer.
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I'm a Canuk so I only speak SI :tongue: (although I'm also an engineer so fluent in stone, feet, inches, miles and pounds)

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bevguy said: ?

Have you thought of a 24) volt electric clothes dryer outlet at the cabin. ? That's what I did at my Lakehouse. , cost only $120 .Easy to install for local electricians unused to NEMA 1450. I know nothing about Canadian electrical standards
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Similar standards here, although I'd be parking the car at a private residence on a First Nations Reserve and then taking a boat about 9km to our cottage (that's a long extension cord!). The owner has said I can plug in to the 120V socket but not sure if they'd be open to installing a dedicated 1450. Will have to test the drive a few times first.
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FourBucks said: ?

I'm a Canuk so I only speak SI :tongue: (although I'm also an engineer so fluent in stone, feet, inches, miles and pounds)
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haha, ya I saw that, did the conversion and sat here like "what's the big deal? 300 real world miles isn't too far off from what the Model S originally promised anyway"
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AnOutsider said: ?

Not sure if this is the case, but wondering if some are confusing the 500km stated with 500miles? 500km is just over 300 miles, and I think that's more than reasonable. I know personally I'd use it, and even if I didn't regularly, I'd like to have that buffer.
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No confusion here.
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AnOutsider said: ?

haha, ya I saw that, did the conversion and sat here like "what's the big deal? 300 real world miles isn't too far off from what the Model S originally promised anyway"
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300 miles is ideal rated range (at 55 MPH), however, I have to consider that I'll have 4-5 adults, AC on a hot August day, 40 litres of gas (for the boat!), a cooler of food and overnight bags amounting to about another 250lbs of cargo and so there's no way I'd achieve 300m range. I'm thinking more like about 200 miles max (333km) which would get me one way (206km trip) very comfortably.
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Perhaps the larger battery pack discussion that popped up here merits its own thread (actually, probably already exist a few times over), but, for me as a consumer, bigger battery? yes please! I'd jump at +25 kWh for the $8K it cost to go from 60 kWh to 85 kWh on the Model S (backing out the SuperCharger $2K value that comes with upgrading to an 85 kWh S... though, I'd happily pay the full $10K for a 110 battery upgrade). I see this delivering a battery I can drive 250+ miles in January, at real highway speeds, and not waiting at SuperChargers for the last far slower 20% of a charge.

That's just me individually as a consumer. Of course, I've not done market research on this... but I've thought about it as an investor. From reading the forums (but nothing directly from Tesla) I believe Model S orders have been roughly 80% 85 kWh, 20% 60 kWh, and when Tesla nixed the 40, I seem to remember them saying under 5% of orders had been for the 40. Moreover, while definitely anecdotal, I've seen multiple 60 owners say they'd get the 85 if they could do it over again, I've never seen an 85 owner say they wished they'd gotten a 60. To me it seems short of an engineering challenge, rolling out a larger battery is a very good bet for Tesla.
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bonnie said: ?

No confusion here.
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Then, not sure why you would think that 300 miles of real world range would be hard, expensive or unneeded? I'm about 120 miles away from NYC, and head there often for business and family. No SC on the way (even if there was, I'm not going to make a 2 hour drive worse by stopping). 300 mile real world range would work for me 2-3 times per month (though in my case, 250 would also work, but 300 is better for the weather buffer). I'm sure the same would be true for many others.

Given that the S has received a bump in range (as reported by tesla) with the D and weight savings, I don't think seeing real world 300 mile range is that far out of the realm of possibility for the near future.

FourBucks said: ?

300 miles is ideal rated range (at 55 MPH), however, I have to consider that I'll have 4-5 adults, AC on a hot August day, 40 litres of gas (for the boat!), a cooler of food and overnight bags amounting to about another 250lbs of cargo and so there's no way I'd achieve 300m range. I'm thinking more like about 200 miles max (333km) which would get me one way (206km trip) very comfortably.
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Right, that's why I mentioned 300m real world range. When the weather is nice, I can probably count on somewhere in the area of 210. Being able to count on 300 in nice weather, and say 210 when it's bad out would be a welcome change.

SteveG3 said: ?

Moreover, while definitely anecdotal, I've seen multiple 60 owners say they'd get the 85 if they could do it over again, I've never seen an 85 owner say they wished they'd gotten a 60. To me it seems short of an engineering challenge, rolling out a larger battery is a very good bet for Tesla.
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Agreed. There's no harm in a buffer, especially to bring you up to the round-trip ranges that are far more common today than decades ago with sprawling. If the price was right, I'd be all over it.
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AnOutsider said: ?

Then, not sure why you would think that 300 miles of real world range would be hard, expensive or unneeded? I'm about 120 miles away from NYC, and head there often for business and family. No SC on the way (even if there was, I'm not going to make a 2 hour drive worse by stopping). 300 mile real world range would work for me 2-3 times per month (though in my case, 250 would also work, but 300 is better for the weather buffer). I'm sure the same would be true for many others.

Given that the S has received a bump in range (as reported by tesla) with the D and weight savings, I don't think seeing real world 300 mile range is that far out of the realm of possibility for the near future.
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I did mention that there were some people, because of location, that DID need additional range. Obviously people with trips who exceed the current range (even if by only a few miles) with no supercharger option and no option to charge at the destination, would fall into that category. Like you.

The post I was responding to was talking about getting a larger battery and was planning on getting a Model X 'similar in price' to a Model S. My point is that additional features bump up costs. It is no longer 'similar in price' when you have a larger capacity battery. And then of course, you need to assume that it will be similar in price to S85D, as a base. Plus the battery. Etc.

None of this stuff is going to be free.
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Regarding price ... seeing how people jump on fully spec'd P85D, there is no question really.
Offer it and people will gladly pay. And PxxxD will be even faster than P85D. No doubt 'bout that.
It is not about need, it is about want.
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View attachment 63952 [/QUOTE]

The head rests are also unlike the prototype and the current Model S integrated rests. They appear to have more of an A frame than the vertical prototypical ones.

Also, +1 on the squared off roofline. It is really dramatic when you look at where the roof starts again after the door opening. Maybe this was the issue with the lateral instability of the doors during driving, and squaring it off helped to add stability to the corner interfaces?
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Twiddler said: ?

View attachment 63952
Click to expand...

The head rests are also unlike the prototype and the current Model S integrated rests. They appear to have more of an A frame than the vertical prototypical ones.

Also, +1 on the squared off roofline. It is really dramatic when you look at where the roof starts again after the door opening. Maybe this was the issue with the lateral instability of the doors during driving, and squaring it off helped to add stability to the corner interfaces?[/QUOTE]

I don't see any headrests in any of the posted pictures. Can you indicate what you are referring to please ?
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Twiddler said: ?

Also, +1 on the squared off roofline. It is really dramatic when you look at where the roof starts again after the door opening. Maybe this was the issue with the lateral instability of the doors during driving, and squaring it off helped to add stability to the corner interfaces?
Click to expand...

Hm, I didn't notice it too much at first, but when you focus, it definitely is very squared. It's possible that the doors will soften/round out the corners a bit (at least on the side there) though.

Kevin Harney said: ?

I don't see any headrests in any of the posted pictures. Can you indicate what you are referring to please ?
Click to expand...

You can VAGUELY see them in the edited pic.
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Looks like there might be some kind of covered storage in the lower part of the doors. Maybe the covers even fold out as cup holders.

I guess a problem with cup holders in the falcon wing doors is that you might forget you have a drink in there and then open the door.
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favo said: ?

Looks like there might be some kind of covered storage in the lower part of the doors. Maybe the covers even fold out as cup holders.

I guess a problem with cup holders in the falcon wing doors is that you might forget you have a drink in there and then open the door.
Click to expand...

Cup holders in falcon wing doors would be a design flaw, imo.
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bonnie said: ?

Cup holders in falcon wing doors would be a design flaw, imo.
Click to expand...

LOL!

Looking closer at new pic (Beta) vs old pic (prototype), some thoughts:
The doors:
The doors have much better clearance to walk in/up to the car then the old.
The only thing that the door can have are speakers - (besides a handle/buttons to open and un/lock)
The door does seem to stop higher then the prototype - maybe my scaling is off. But any sensors that would be needed can be in the handle assembly, which minimizes wiring and other complexity with having additional sensors.
Overall the doors looks much cleaner then the old ones.

The cabin:
The headrests look way better.
The dashboard does not stick out for the center console screen.
To me, looks/feels spacious.

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bonnie said: ?

Cup holders in falcon wing doors would be a design flaw, imo.
Click to expand...

No cup holders at all would be a serious design flaw. Maybe Tesla will surprise you with gimbal mount cup holders in the falcon wing doors.

(Sheesh, nobody has any imagination anymore....)
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NigelM said: ?

No cup holders at all would be a serious design flaw. Maybe Tesla will surprise you with gimbal mount cup holders in the falcon wing doors.

(Sheesh, nobody has any imagination anymore....)
Click to expand...

Who said anything about 'no cup holders'????

(Sheesh, really? Gimbal? Overthinking. Just .... overthinking. One more thing to break. There is elegance in simplicity...)

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NigelM said: ?

No cup holders at all would be a serious design flaw. Maybe Tesla will surprise you with gimbal mount cup holders in the falcon wing doors.

(Sheesh, nobody has any imagination anymore....)
Click to expand...

As long as the second row cup holders are not the same as the post production ones for the S I am OK with gimbal; slide out cup holders in the second row captain's chair arms......:biggrin:

Also, I would be shocked to see a bigger battery initially and no 'P' version and would not be shocked to see an '85' only option for battery size
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Tesla's electric SUV delayed until late 2015 | Ars Technica
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Doug_G said: ?

Tesla's electric SUV delayed until late 2015 | Ars Technica
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Classic example of the headline and actual article completely at odds with each other.

From the article
"Yesterday, Tesla Motors had news for all those waiting for its Model X SUV: be patient, it�s coming. In an e-mail to customers with reservations for Model X, Tesla announced that deliveries won't take place before the third quarter of 2015, but the company said it's hard at work developing and testing the new vehicle."
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Perhaps "the best rack and accessory companies in the world" will come up with something EVEN MORE elegant than this !: Whoa, I saw this guy on the road & when he pulled into the same parking lot, I couldn't resist. Here's to a fine hitch rack solution ! (Once again, I'll be putting my stuff INSIDE) ML
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bonnie said: ?

Cup holders in falcon wing doors would be a design flaw, imo.
Click to expand...

they will never put the cup holders on the falcon wing have to be next to the seats.
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bonnie said: ?

I'm sitting here imagining Tesla employees reading this thread & saying, 'wow, I had no idea they'd interpret it THAT way!'.
.
Click to expand...

And of course the exterior wood paneling will be revealed with the 1xx battery in an event showing the X continues the revolution and isn't just evolution.
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EchoDelta said: ?

And of course the exterior wood paneling will be revealed with the 1xx battery in an event showing the X continues the revolution and isn't just evolution.
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Can't tell if serious... hahaha!
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MikeL said: ?

Perhaps "the best rack and accessory companies in the world" will come up with something EVEN MORE elegant than this !: View attachment 64147 View attachment 64148 Whoa, I saw this guy on the road & when he pulled into the same parking lot, I couldn't resist. Here's to a fine hitch rack solution ! (Once again, I'll be putting my stuff INSIDE) ML
Click to expand...

This looks very illegal, why could they not put that boat on the roof.
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mspisars said: ?

LOL!

Looking closer at new pic (Beta) vs old pic (prototype), some thoughts:
The doors:
The doors have much better clearance to walk in/up to the car then the old.
The only thing that the door can have are speakers - (besides a handle/buttons to open and un/lock)
The door does seem to stop higher then the prototype - maybe my scaling is off. But any sensors that would be needed can be in the handle assembly, which minimizes wiring and other complexity with having additional sensors.
Overall the doors looks much cleaner then the old ones.

The cabin:
The headrests look way better.
The dashboard does not stick out for the center console screen.
To me, looks/feels spacious.

View attachment 63999
Click to expand...

Good observations.

I also note that it appears the hinge mechanism has been revised so that that radius that the door travels in as it pivots upward is smaller.

The gap between the adjacent edges of the roof and door are closer together by quite a bit, resulting in the top of the "vertical" portion of the door (when open) not extending as high. This results in the center-hinge portion of the door having at least a 90-degree angle (if not slightly greater) when open, whereas the old door actually angled downward slightly when open, reducing headroom.

In addition, it appears the bottom of the door is thinner now, increasing the headroom space even more while keeping similar overall height clearance.
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Thinner door... I wonder how that affects side impacts. Just these little observations from a teaser photo show that there have been significant changes that must add time to the delivery estimates.
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You guys make a lot of assumptions based on what is most likely a computer generated image. I'm guessing that Tesla also made it deliberately dark because it's not a "final" photo.
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NigelM said: ?

You guys make a lot of assumptions based on what is most likely a computer generated image. I'm guessing that Tesla also made it deliberately dark because it's not a "final" photo.
Click to expand...

Don't think so. All their promo photo's are "deliberately dark" yet are accurate to the product. (thinking back to the "D" reveal teaser photo).
In this case the doors are accentuated by the light. Drawing attention to the detail.
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mspisars said: ?

Don't think so. All their promo photo's are "deliberately dark" yet are accurate to the product. (thinking back to the "D" reveal teaser photo).
In this case the doors are accentuated by the light. Drawing attention to the detail.
Click to expand...

Once again, I think that the lighting is mostly designed to highlight the Tesla logo effect. I've read other threads (e.g. on Facebook) showing this same picture and people comment on the Tesla logo effect. On this thread naturally we analyze every corner of the picture to squeeze out some new information. Not that I haven't done the same thing elsewhere, just saying.
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The renderings in the new email lack the guide pegs on the Falcon Doors that are present on the renderings on Tesla's website, and on the photos of the prototype.

The Model X that was displayed at the Palo Alto store opening had guide pegs on the doors, and tracks for the pegs in the B and C pillars.

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