Mar 27, 2013
bellwilliam Took delivery of my S today. There were a ton of Tesla (30+) at the service center. They are all to be delivered by end of the week. This is crazy, there are only few people working at Service Center. Quality of delivery is not top notch.
1. my S was not fully charged, it shows ~100 miles range. Where do Tesla think I live ? luckily I live 40 miles away, but I could not of gone to all the places I wanted today.
2. my S was not washed.
3. interior was not clean.
4. paint "armor" was 2nd rate, some were bubbling.
5. passenger door don't latch properly 70% of the time.
my rep was helpful and knowledgeable, but did or couldn't do nothing about 1-5.
*what's up with no rear floor mat, are we back in Yugo era ?
*what's up with no HPWC delivery. If you can't deliver, don't take the money upfront
*firmware still at 4.2. what's up with that ?
*what's up with ghetto Service Center. this is a "luxury car"
*can the web browser be any crappier ?
Mr. Musk: stop the delivery mad dash, stop trying to appease Wall Street. Trying to move all the cars out this week, just means less cars delivered next week. It also doesn't make business sense.�
Mar 27, 2013
carrerascott 4.3 has been put on hold due to some bugs. I still have 4.2. My car was delivered 3/7 with 140mi of range. Some of your complaints may be due to end of qrtr rush but others aren't. I also haven't received HPWC or rear spoiler... Think those are supplier issues. But I'm happy to get my car now and wait for those items, vs waiting for my car until those items could be delivered at the same time...�
Mar 27, 2013
rlpm +1
I expect a few things on my due bill at direct delivery next week. Anything else I notice I'll tell ownership about. So far, they've been very responsive and willing to address my issues. I don't expect post-delivery to be any different.�
Mar 27, 2013
stopcrazypp Your 1-5 points may be quarter related (your particular Service Center having to handle too many deliveries) but the other things (4.2, HPWC, "ghetto Service Center", web browser) have nothing to do with any quarter "dash".
Tesla already had the strategy from the start of delivering cars first and options later. The idea is to get the car into consumer hands rather than having everyone wait until those options can be supplied. I think given the choice most people will take the delivery first. It has nothing to do with any quarterly rush to deliver cars.�
Mar 27, 2013
FredTMC I want TM to succeed and i own the stock. I love my MS (took delivery in Feb and have had no big issues). I believe in TM and Elon. Being a new public company can be very challenging in general. Look at all the challenges a new auto manufacturer faces. There aren't any new successful mfgs making any sizable volume except for TM. And MS is no ordinary car.
Lets all give this new ambitious revolutionary company a little slack... Especially at this critical end of quarter crunch time. There are so many naysayers about the long term prospects for this company (e.g. Huge short %). If TM doesn't meet their guidance, they get slammed by the street since the street only generally cares about quarterly performance (to a large degree).
I have complete confidence that TM will take care of whatever you need regarding your "crunch time" delivery ("maxQ" time in SpaceX lingo). Every delivery they can book matters greatly for Q1. Have some sympathy and don't kick them at their busiest time. Thanks all.�
Mar 27, 2013
Jason S Passenger front, correct? Takes more effort than people seem to want to use?
It works itself out in my experience. Just tell people to close the door harder in the meantime.�
Mar 27, 2013
kendallpb Call re. the bubbles; they'll make good. In my state, paint armor is done by a third party; we noticed a few very tiny bubbles--I was like "well, I had to look really closely to even notice, so it's no big"--and my DS was like "no way, you noticed, we'll get it fixed." It turns out the bubbles were actually specs of dirt causing the bubbles, and the armor had been on for a short enough time the paint armor guy was able to peel, clean, re-apply. When I expressed a little skepticism, Nathan was like, "It's just a piece of plastic, if it doesn't look good, we can remove and put a new piece on--no worries." (I'm paraphrasing; he doesn't talk like that. ;-) ) If you get no satisfaction from "your rep" (you mean your DS?), talk to the service person; if that doesn't do it, call or e-mail ownership.
I don't recall the charge on mine, when I picked it up, but it may have been plugged in at the time (I remember being shown the charging--just not sure if it was actually charging when I picked it up). Still, I find it amusing that you're complaining about something that didn't cause you any problems--you live 40 miles away. Lucky? While a full starting charge is optimal, it sounds like they have a lot of cars and they may have had to pick and choose which to charge, noted you were 40 miles away, and done the most charge they had time for. (shrug) I'm not sure luck had anything to do with it--possibly good planning, though. 100 miles is more than enough for you to go home and right back to the Service Center.
Big heavy doors; push harder and close firmly, IMHO. The browser seems fine to me. I don't have 4.3 yet either, but it's not a major change so I don't care. They roll out slowly, and if they're pausing it while working out some kinks, so much the better! I'd rather get it right than get it quickly. ;-)
The not-washed/not-clean is unfortunate and unprofessional.
I have no idea what you mean by "ghetto Service Center"--never seen it--but it's a Service Center, not a Store. Does it need to be in the ritziest part of town?!
Anyway, congrats on your car! Enjoy!
�
Mar 28, 2013
bellwilliam 1 more gripe I got: poor panel fit. this won't pass Lexus bearing test. upon closer examination, it won't pass Chevy quality control.
on the door not latching well, I meant passenger side front. all other doors are fine.
as for paint armor, it isn't tiny bubbles, it is a 1" bubble.
as for not getting HPWC on time, I am complaining Tesla charging me now. Tesla should charge when they ship.
firmware 4.3 is a big deal for us Southern California Edison customers. We pay ~60 cents / kwh at peak hour, 1/3 of that at off-peak. time charging matters.
I believe Tesla is getting out as many cars as possible before quarter end, then deal with quality issues at a later date. They should of caught many of the issues during QC, if there is such a thing.�
Mar 28, 2013
AMPd I laughed at the ghetto service center remark.
Honestly I laughed at all of your complaints
Do you mind posting pictures of the poor panel fit?�
Mar 28, 2013
K Hall At least he has a service center.:smile:�
Mar 28, 2013
yobigd20 IMO they should really stop using third party vendors for various things, especially for the paint armor. What they need to do is hire some expert XPEL Ultimate installers and put the good stuff on. Self-healing, full hood, all edges wrapped, no lines showing....
same goes for these third party tire warranty things, which I think someone said is also through third party. $700 (or $900) for tire warranty? Doh, that's absurd. I sort of feel like they are taking advantage of "those who don't know any better". If any of you have bought tires elseware and seen the typical road hazard warranties offered, they are usually around $10-25 per tire. That's $40-$100, not $700-$900. Sheeeesh.
http://www.edmunds.com/auto-warranty/understanding-tire-warranties.html "Road hazard warranty prices vary, based on the tire and the vendor, but on average, they range from $10-$20 per tire."�
Mar 28, 2013
GSP Amen to that.
GSP�
Mar 28, 2013
swegman Note that the tire plan covers not just the tires, but also the wheels.�
Mar 28, 2013
Suzieq This is no laughing matter, particularly the comments about the car not being washed, inside and out.
Think about it. This is a very low bar. In fact, it's a minimum.
If I pick up a rental car, and it is not clean, I ask for a different car. It's not like getting on a public bus, where you might understand if it's not clean.
It is an expensive luxury automobile. While I can forgive a new manufacturer certain issues, I cannot forgive a dirty car on delivery. That is completely preventable, and totally unprofessional. I would say that anyone who is willing to accept a dirty car on delivery might themselves have issues.�
Mar 28, 2013
ModelS1079 My car had a fine dust, acquired on the delivery truck that brought the car to my street. Tesla simply offered a free detail whenever I wanted, suggesting I do this in the Spring. They are on it next Thursday. I'd be shocked if they did not offer you the same.
You complaint about not enuf delivery specialists is right on - those guys are busting rumpus to make as many deliveries as they can and the (pre-paid) inventory is piling up - in Boston (Watertown), 28 vehicles were patiently awaiting a home last week. Looked to me like the cars were getting frustrated and really would have rather been driving. I think they do an awesome job (the DS's), but they need to be cloned asap.�
Mar 28, 2013
NigelM Part of this is definitely that everyone still wants their car NOW TODAY(!) and to be honest I don't blame them as I was like that also. Not making excuses for anyone at Tesla but it can't be easy when you've got 30 cars lined up and owners who all want immediate delivery. Example: How many chargers/outlets does the service center have? I'll bet they just couldn't get all the cars charged and washed in time.
The comments on rear floor mats has been discussed elsewhere and I personally agree that there should have been something; but that isn't related to timing of delivery.�
Mar 28, 2013
Beckler OP, I like how you're telling Musk how to run his business. Whatever man. Not much sympathy for your "issues". Most of what you list just means in effect they're a few days late delivering your car. Big deal.�
Mar 28, 2013
Krugerrand Yeah, it is a laughing matter. I know that as soon as I read 'ghetto', I laughed out loud and immediately rolled my eyes dismissing everything else the OP said.
That's funny too and there go my...�
Mar 28, 2013
Rodolfo Paiz I could say that someone who can so easily condemn another human being whom they've never met, by a single comment on an Internet forum, might themselves have issues. I could say that, but I would never do so since I know just how absurd such conduct would be.�
Mar 28, 2013
brianman Evaluating on the merits:
1. Unless you specifically requested a complete standard (or range) charge prior to delivery, 100 miles range isn't necessarily a bad thing. In fact it's probably a sign that your battery has been in the mid-zone rather than aggressively topped off. If they gave it to you with something like 20 miles rated, you'd definitely have a beef.
2. Likely bad form, I agree. Details and/or pictures would be useful here for discussion purposes.
3. Likely bad form, I agree. Details and/or pictures would be useful here for discussion purposes.
4. Unacceptable, but stuff happens. Make sure it's on your due bill to get it fixed.
5. This has been reported as an issue more than a few times on the forum. IIRC, there's an adjustment some people have had done. I don't think it's critical to note this on your due bill.
6. Rear floor mat/matt. This is not "news" to anyone that's been following the forum and read any post with the word "mat/matt" in it. For a long while (months) it's been discussed.
7. There are taxation and other reasons why some prefer to purchase the HPWC at delivery rather than as a separate purchase later. I suspect Tesla would not have balked if you requested to strike the HPWC from your delivery cost (and cancel your 'reservation' for one). Did you ask?
8. Need more details.
9. Yes, it could be a lot worse. That said, it could definitely use some improvements.
10. Do you have stats or official public information to support the "mad dash" assertion? My recollection from the latest Conf Call was that, if anything, they ramped down somewhat from end of calendar 2012 as part of shifting from temp hires to full time employees and generally reducing costs.�
Mar 28, 2013
eelton Why is it that whenever anyone makes critical comments about Tesla-- no matter how reasonable and heartfelt-- people dismiss them or jump down their throats? I think the OP has every right to be dissatisfied with his delivery experience.
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Mar 28, 2013
ppl people dismiss them or jump down their throats? I think the OP has every right to be dissatisfied with his delivery experience.
I agree but want more details. Was it a Jewish black Latino or maybe even rich ghetto. Not all ghettos are created equally. Suppose it could be a middle class ghetto (sometimes those can be dangerous too). We're the customers inside gangsta looking? Was hip hop playing on the radio. Please expand on these details need them to better evaluate your experience and your bias. Let us all know. Btw did you have option for home delivery. I did but then I probably would have complained about it being done in my own ghetto
sent via Tapatalk[/QUOTE]�
Mar 28, 2013
Krugerrand Well, I know for myself (and since you chose to quote my post from all the similar posts), when someone places more importance on material things, or when they over dramatize a situation, or behave in a stereotypical manner ('ghetto' service center - really? Was the OP expecting to get a facial there and be handfed chocolate dipped strawberries in a medically sterile environment?) then I take their comments with a huge grain of salt thrown over my shoulder.
Simply stating the facts of the situation without the bluster and stamping of feet is likely to receive far more support and sympathy. The OP definitely had some reasons to be put-off, but I cease to care when things are blown out of proportion.
OP to DS: I understand you guys are working real hard, and I hate to be bother, but I have a couple of issues I'd like addressed with my new car.
DS: Yes Sir/Ma'am, how can I be of assistance.
OP: Well, the car is dirty and I see a large bubble in the paint armor.
DS: You're absolutely correct. We'll have the car detailed at your earliest convenience and take care of that bubble.
OP: I also noticed the passenger door doesn't close as easily as the rest.
DS: We'll make an appointment to have Service take a look at it.
Etc...,etc...
*A couple hours later on the TMC forums*
OP: I picked up my car today at the Service Center in *fill in the blank*. There were a few issues that I think might have been caused by Tesla trying to get out as many cars as possible before the quarter ends. I spoke with my DS and he/she said they'd all be taken care of, so while I was a bit disappointed initially upon seeing my car, my DS was sympathetic and helpful, and I've every confidence the matters will be addressed. BTW, the car drove great on the way home.
Random Poster: What sort of issues did you have?
OP: Well, my car was dirty and there was a large bubble in the paint armor. The passenger door was hard to close....
Random Poster: Ah, that sucks big time. A few of us have had those issues as well, but Tesla resolved them quickly.
Etc., etc...
But note it's not nearly as dramatic as 'my car only had 100 miles of charge and even though I live only 40 miles away and had plenty of charge to get there, what if I had wanted to drive 200 miles, I wouldn't have been able to, even though I didn't want to, how dare they not read my mind and fully charge my car...(because the last dozen ICE cars I've bought all came with full gas tanks�
Mar 28, 2013
bellwilliam if you think I am one of those anal perfectionist owner, it is far far from truth. last 3 cars I took delivery took less than 10 seconds walk around.
I race cars for a hobby, all my race cars have horrible paint, dents all over, scratched windshield and banged up body. it doesn't bother me one bit. All my street cars do not have perfect paint jobs. but I take care of all my cars mechanically.
if Tesla was priced like a Hyundai, I would probably let it slide on all accounts other than cars not delivered clean. but paying $100k better gets me a delivery experience closer to Porsche than a Hyundai.
as for charging full. every new car by law (not sure if it is Cali only) needs to be delivered with full tank of fuel. Why would EV be any different ? My Volt was delivered with full charge, and Volt runs on fuel. This bothered me more than it should, because Solar City didn't finish my install on time (aren't they suppose to coordinate with Tesla ?), so I had to charge at 110v last night. I can barely get into my office today for a 220v charge (luckily office has 220v). Range anxiety within 24 hours of ownership !!
as for ghetto service center comment. have you guys been a Mercedes, Lexus or Porsche service center ? compare next time before you jump on my throat.
paint armor - I have them on over 10 cars I own, they are all applied better than the Tesla. I should of gone with a local, save 1/2 of the money and ending up with a better paint armor.
as for "mad dash", I don't have proof that's what happening other than the rep saying they need to clear out the lot by Sunday. That's a lots of cars. If Tesla takes extra weeks or 2. better delivery experience, better quality. Yes, numbers won't show up this quarter, but it will show up next quarter. Short term numbers don't mean a thing in grand scheme of things.
note, I wasn't complaining about the car itself. car drives well and I love it....But the whole delivery experience is very underwhelming.
- - - Updated - - -
1. I did mention about the car being dirty, no, DS did not fix it or offer me a detail.
2. I didn't see paint armor bubble nor front passenger door latching issue till after I got home.
3. as for 100 miles charge, see my previous post.
4. service center - cheapest Tesla you can buy is $60k. yes, I expect better than my local BMW dealer where you can buy a brand new $30k BMW.
- - - Updated - - -
This is a Tesla forum, hopefully my comments will help other new Tesla owners:
1. if you live far away, call ahead to make sure your new S will have enough charges at delivery.
2. if you are ordering, skip paint armor.
3. buy rear floor mats beforehand.
4. ignore what Solar City promise that charger will be ready at time of delivery. plan early.�
Mar 28, 2013
NigelM Just worth noting that cars "delivered" means nothing in the quarterly results; it's cars "paid for" that counts.
FTR, I agree it's good advice to not assume that Tesla knows where you want to drive after you take possession; tell your DS in advance if you need a full charge. Also, as with any new car take the time to do a walk around - you're signing that you received the vehicle in good condition unless otherwise noted.�
Mar 28, 2013
AC1K ALL of his points are valid, if this is a $100K luxury car, it better be damn perfect in every single way upon delivery. i've worked at a dealership (mazda) and even they go through every square mm before delivery, its absolutely perfect. We aren't buying a used POS from some guy on craigs list or kijiji, there should be no "loose ends". to deliver a car that's not even charged? WTF, i would understand if its a used car but BRAND NEW = full tank, no exceptions.
not a laughing matter, if you piss off your customers and they blast you on a review where hundreds of thousands of people see it they will loose business, i was going to put a deposit on a P85 in June but if i see any more of this kind of BS delivery posted on the forum i may actually drop the idea all together. I want to know what Telsa does to fix this.
to the OP, please keep us posted.�
Mar 28, 2013
fluxemag I think those were all reasonable concerns, but not all related to end of Q1 push. Anyone who has worked in manufacturing probably know about this phenomenon.�
Mar 28, 2013
Beckler While you're correct that there should be no loose ends, this isn't like a standard company yet so the comparisons you make aren't valid. They've been doing it for what, a few months? I always sigh when people talk about cancelling or 'never doing business again' with such and such company over these sorts of things. If essentially minor things like this mean you cancel your order for your Model S - which is unique in the world - then clearly you never really wanted it that much to begin with.�
Mar 28, 2013
bellwilliam note I never complained about the car. it is a great performance car. not quite the luxury of Mercedes or Audi, but performance is up there and love all the gadgets. I wouldn't want to discourage you to buy one. This is like buying a Ferrari 458 (insert hot girl or say a lousy restaurant with great food), dealer treats you like shi*, but you still want it
- - - Updated - - -
that's a good point.......but you sure about that ? isn't paid but not delivered meant it is treated say as a deposit, shows up as a liability on the book ?�
Mar 28, 2013
montgom626 Elon Musk has done the impossible.
No problem with TM and my MS. Delivered on a Thursday night, 220 miles of range, impeccable condition. Paint armor well done.
Carbon fiber spoiler and parcel shelf will come when they are ready. I am still on 4.2 and happy. 4.3 has some "bugs". Why would I want a release with any bugs?
I am going to side with Elon Musk. Fellow has done the impossible.�
Mar 28, 2013
AMPd I'd still love some pics of the misaligned panels, just want to see if there has been an improvement from early production vehicles
Also pics of the large bubble would be nice�
Mar 28, 2013
AC1K
yeah i understand that the car has great performance on paper and im working 2 full time jobs temporarily just to save up for this beast of a car, however, if im going to drop $122K CAD on a car (yes im willing pay $16K more than the US Price just because im in Canada), the delivery, service, dealer has to be up to par as well.
for me, customer service is 50% the other 50% is the product itself, if either one fails to meet standards, i consider the whole thing a failure. I want Tesla to succeed, its the first company that actually looks to the future, but half assing the customer service part ESPECIALLY first impressions such as delivery will not allow them too. Being a startup, they have to do everything better, cleaner, and faster than the big three.
i fully get what you are saying about the hot girl/lousy restaurant, ive been in both situations, it comes down to my time and money. Do i want to deal with BS? the answer is no, i just wont bother if thats the case. I will only pay if a company deserves the money, its the whole voting with your wallet thing.�
Mar 28, 2013
bellwilliam I am off to Germany (Ring) for a week, I will get picture of panels when I get back.�
Mar 28, 2013
Doug_G To be fair, $6500 of that is import duty that goes to the Canadian government. And I just compared two identically configured (most options) cars and the price difference was only $8750 when you include the $7500 US government rebate. So you're not paying a huge chunk extra.�
Mar 28, 2013
wstuff I find it very interesting the positions some people take on a one sided conversation or post, I think Tesla has done a marvelous job all around. My experience from beginning to end has been impeccable. I think the sales and manufacturing model they have developed demands that outcome. To fly off the handle and make a bold assertion as to your willingness to purchase an item from any company on a one sided post is irrational, lets wait till the OP gets back from his trip and TAKES the time to post a couple of pictures and then look at the results. This off with their heads attitude without evidence needs a little tempering with evidence.�
Mar 28, 2013
AC1K okay, i guess our government sucks and Alberta has no rebate, fine, but technically at the end, a full $16K+more comes out of my pocket and into someone elses, doesnt matter who. I'm willing to absorb that cost, but if i do, i expect the car to be delivered as advertised with no delays or missing parts, professionalism all around, it should be the same experience if not better than buying a $100K mercedes, bmw, lexus, etc.
this picture is only the base model difference, the P85 im spec-ing has the glass roof, 21" wheels, tech package, armor, stereo upgrade and the parcel shelf.
EDIT: sorry i guess i accidentally thread jacked the op�
Mar 28, 2013
blc1017 I wouldn't tolerate a DS doing nothing after I noted the car being dirty...I hope you not only pointed out that it was dirty, but that you stated you wanted resolution for it, and that you keep on Tesla to make it right. That said, sounds like you made assumptions that certain things were taken care of. Why didn't you contact your DS and ask him to ensure there was adequate charge on the car for your needs? I did that last week..picking my car up tomorrow. Did you do a 10 second walk around like you did with your other cars? The activity in the service center, the dirt on the car, and the non-responsiveness of the DS would have been red flags for me to spend a bit more time on the inspection. I'm not letting Tesla off the hook..far from it...but I do think the adage "trust but verify" fits in this case.�
Mar 28, 2013
EVNow Unfortunately, those who depend on wall street funding have to appease the wall street. It is like making a deal with the devil ...�
Mar 28, 2013
Right_Said_Fred For some people the glass is always half full, for others always half empty...�
Mar 28, 2013
Suzieq Rodolfo, don't want to engage on this level, but I will anyway. I did not condemn any person. I said "anyone... might have issues..." It was not personal.
I stand by my statement. I have not taken delivery yet. But if my vehicle is delivered dirty, I will tell the DS to bring it back when it's clean and ready to be accepted. Tesla is a new manufacturer, and I am willing to accept all that goes with that. I am not willing to accept a vehicle that is not in day one pristine condition when I get it. How dirty was the vehicle that the OP accepted? That's another question and I am not going to get into that. If there are those out there who are willing to accept a brand new luxury vehicle of any type or price that is not clean.... well, I say again. They have issues themselves. And I am not condemning anyone, just stating my opinion.�
Mar 28, 2013
stopcrazypp I've made no comments on the merits of his specific points except for whether they relate to any quarter end dash, so I'm not sure why you responded to me specifically. And on that point I don't think there's any evidence this is quarter end related, and as I pointed out, the points outside of the 1-5 definitely have nothing to do with any rush (nor are they really news if you have been following this forum).
But anyways, on those 1-5 points, I agree with blc1017. Point out the issues to the DS and see how they respond. From previous delivery stories I have read, the DS do make a note of every issue you point out and will help you resolve it (even if it's not possible to do it immediately).
Looking further up thread, it seems the OP pointed out the car was dirty but pointed out none of the other points to the DS. That's a different situation than the original post, which made its sound like the delivery experience was horrible (as in he pointed out all those long list of issues and the rep did nothing about any of it). However, the real situation seems to be that he pointed out the car was dirty (and perhaps the range), but didn't look at the rest more thoroughly until he got home and ended up disappointed.�
Mar 28, 2013
Clprenz I don't think people are understanding the magnitude of the impact of tesla being profitable. They NEED to be profitable not only for their stock, but to keep in business. Their suppliers have been having some problems and those need to be addressed but, I would understand that Tesla still needs to have a clean car, 150 miles+ charge, and a good experience for a $80,000 car. At this quarter of them all, the Street is more important for tesla.�
Mar 28, 2013
Electric1 Agreed. My delivery experience was far from flawless, yet understanding that 1) this is a new venture for us all, 2) it could have been worse 3) one simply has to understand that
IF you want a "Mercedes/BMW (and my last experience with them wasn't so hot on the delivery side either/Audi experience", go ahead and buy one (and have a wonderful delivery experience tomorrow). IF you want an all electric, performance 5/7 passenger wondercar, buy a Model S.
All of that havig been said, if we want to be true Beta testers and help TM improve, we should share our positive and negative experience with them, in an appropriate fashion, so that they can learn from their mistakes.�
Mar 28, 2013
Doug_G Or Provincial Sales Tax! Don't forget that pretty much everyone else is paying Provincial or State taxes on top of that.�
Mar 28, 2013
K Hall My car arrived direct from the factory and rolled off the truck. It had 160 mi of range on it. It had not been detailed. The DS noted that they owed me a detail on my due bill. I went strait to the car wash (another thread ) washed it, drove to Chipotle and plugged it in while I had lunch. Plugging it in is a lot of fun BTW.
I do understand the psychology of a feeling of entitlement after laying out $100 K. I can tell you it�s worth every penny. The problems you are articulating are incredibly small compared to what you get back out of a Model S.
For Pete sake man up!
The car is indescribably superior to anything else in my garage. Mercedes, BMW and Lexus. The ICE cars all feel like they are broken after driving the MS.
If you can�t afford the car then that is another discussion. Don�t buy it. If you can, you will never regret that decision even f it does arrive dirty.
Respectfully,
K. Hall
�
Mar 28, 2013
CapitalistOppressor First of all, every concern raised by the OP is a valid concern. Tesla does not provide a consistently high quality delivery experience. They ought to. Period, end of story.
That said, they are a startup and haven't had a hundred years to perfect this process like every other car maker has (to a greater or lesser degree). Anyone expecting perfection has unrealistic expectations. Period, end of story.
Most of the pushback in this thread is probably a result of calling the service center ghetto. I must admit I lol'd at that. Rephrase that and the tone of the conversation would have gone differently.�
Mar 28, 2013
Beavis The car needs to be delivered in order to recognize revenue per GAAP. So, in order to make their numbers, they do need to deliver cars.�
Mar 28, 2013
Doug Martoccia Dear Tesla-
When you deliver my car, you can drive it though mud puddles get it really dirty. I can just hit the drive through car wash on the way home. I can also skip the High Priced Water Cooler (HPWC) and the expensive plastic stuff people put on the front of their cars to protect the paint as I really don't need these extravagances. What I would like is for the car to be well built, long lasting and with no mechanical defects.
Sincerely.
Doug M�
Mar 28, 2013
AMPd I love this answer.
All that matters after getting the car is that there are no mechanical issues, dirt can be washed away, plastics can be added on later!�
Mar 28, 2013
aznt1217 I think the OP makes a valid point. But truthfully speaking Luxury car dealers aren't any better. I actually request they not wash my car. Most dealerships do a really poor job and end up marring the clear coat surface (but hey maybe you got good luxury dealers where you are).
- I know this isn't an excuse but why not take it up with Tesla and your store directly. If you were really irate do you have photos to prove it and follow up with customer service/your store? There have been plenty of similar stories and Tesla has footed the bill for them.
- I also am curious to know about your panel gap fit and finish issues. Please post pictures so the community here at TMC can help you and who knows maybe even George B might get on the case. Yes George B has personally helped people on this forum.
- Which store is it? Perhaps its something that should be called out for quality control.�
Mar 28, 2013
AC1K I don't really agree with this, even when i bought a Hyundai 4 years ago, they had it perfect on delivery, i looked at every square millimeter of the car and it was clean and detailed through out. That car was only $36K and came with floor mats front and back embroidered with the Genesis logo (so the equivalent of premium floor mats), so if i spend $100K i should have the same amount of service and quality but 3x the car.
it shouldn't matter if they are a startup, they can observe how others have done it and do it better, dont tell me the CSR's have never bought a car from anyone other than Tesla.
i don't know if the general buyer on these boards have so much money bleeding out of them that they don't care or what but being 30 and NOT making 6+ figures a year i worked hard to get this money, i expect results from it, and the results im expecting are no where near unreasonable since dealers like Kia/Hyunda/toyota/ford and Mitsubishi have provided high quality service for 1/8th the price.
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wow, really? i used to work at Mazda and if the car has been sitting outside for a long time before getting sold, the paint would have a grimy residue on it so they would wash and do a full 3 stage wax the car to make it have the smooth "brand new" feel again
It was not acceptable to have a non-clean/non-detailed car upon delivery.
i guess some dealers just don't give a sh*t.�
Mar 28, 2013
vfx Ben I'm curious about the "ghetto service center". If it's the LA service center and I was there today you should know that it was the first/second Tesla store in the world when Tesla had both service and sales in the same place. It was 1.5 million build and a beautiful state of the art showroom with computers for customers, snacks and a spotless service room. They sold and repaired Roadsters there for 3 years. They regularly had high profile fancy parties there. I attended the one at the ROTEC movie premier that showed at the theater down the street. Very posh.
When the 3rd street Promanade Tesla Store was built, it changed to a service center. Now with the dozens of huge MS in states of repair and delivery they are hemorrhaging for space and it's like a squirrel trying to fit a full winters supply of nuts in it's cheeks. Comparing Tesla owned service centers to established separately owned Infiniti, Merc, BMW dealerships is just not fair for a startup.
It's now about 10 times too small and Tesla corporate (who decides these things) knows it. The lease has two more years and the owner (a Roadster owner) won't let them out of it. It looks terrible now. They have things like tires and parts and boxes stacked up in every corner. They built a wall and knocked down others just to get cars inside.
New service centers in Torrance and Van Nuys are being built. The Tesla store up north is being closed now and the LA service center will move to a bigger facility but not nearly fast enough.
It's just growing pains. Cool car. Everything else is catching up.�
Mar 28, 2013
Norbert Without saying anything about specific issues, I'd like to point out (though surely not a new point), that these are related to Tesla not only being a startup on a new volume level, but also other similar factors: The delivery rate having been raised to 500/week, at the same time as the gov loan has been used and cash reserves are limited. In order to become profitable, Tesla needs (or needed) to reduce production costs first. They will soon be able to employ more people, and build more service centers etc., but currently they are probably still constrained (or have been until recently).�
Mar 28, 2013
DrTaras The 'ghetto' facility even had a cameo role in ROTEC!�
Mar 28, 2013
vfx You mean WKTEC?�
Mar 28, 2013
ModelS1079 [/QUOTE]
Mods, please, help.�
Mar 28, 2013
NigelM Under GAAP there's more than one option for recognizing revenue. You are correct if one uses the standard sales basis where revenue is only recognized when title of the product is transferred; although arguably that happens when the temp tag is issued and not when the car is physically delivered. However, there exists the alternative to book revenue based on percentage of completion; I'd argue this is quite acceptable when building a $100k piece of machinery that has been completely paid for and Tesla could easily book 99% of the revenue and remain GAAP compliant.
It's a little irrelevant as IMO the issue is related to Tesla's increased production rate and growing pains in delivery capacity rather than trying to make Q1 numbers.�
Mar 28, 2013
brian45011 Does this help?: "We recognize revenue when (i) persuasive evidence of an arrangement exists; (ii) delivery has occurred and there are no uncertainties regarding customer acceptance; (iii) fees are fixed or determinable; and (iv) collection is reasonably assured."�
Mar 28, 2013
jomo25 There's definitely a correlation to them being stretched further during quarter ends. It is because they are trying to make numbers for the quarter. To dismiss this is a bit naive IMO. Even my IDS admitted to me today that they are stretched thin this week cuz they are trying to get as much out the door as possible. He even said there will be a noticeable slowdown the next week as people recover from the flurry of activity this week. Thus, my car will likely not enter production til the end of next week or even the week after since they will be slowing down next week.�
Mar 28, 2013
DrTaras Probably WKTEC too�
Mar 28, 2013
Oyvind.H +1
..�
Mar 28, 2013
joefee I have had some of the same issues but they have been addressed by my Service Center� owners can rate their delivery experience here:
Total Delivery Experience Poll�
Mar 28, 2013
vfx I was wrong. WKTEC came out over a year before the LA store was built.
Who Killed the Electric Car? (2006) - IMDb
LA store 6/2007
�
Mar 29, 2013
EarlyAdopter Last year in a post here I predicted that the first 10,000 Model S'es would be sold simply for what it is, but the next 10,000 would be based on how it is.
Mark the date and time. With this thread, it's clear that day has come. Expect more of this as the year goes on.�
Mar 29, 2013
aznt1217 Yes some dealers don't care. I remember when I ordered my Acura tsx I ordered it in gray with black interior. After a three week wait, car was black/black. I was like why did I wait then? I saw a gray one on the lot, they sold it the day before. I believe they made a mistake and sold my car.�
Mar 29, 2013
lolachampcar I will be interesting to watch the transition from Tesla doing the early adopter a favor by delivering a car to the customer doing Tesla a favor by buying the car. I suspect there might be a bit of pain for all in the interim.
For those that read my posts in the worst possible light, no, I'm not saying all of Tesla sucks. I am in awe of the company, product and management. My comments are based on simple observation of issues that will need to be corrected if Tesla is to live up to its own standards. There is nothing worse than a blow hard spewing how great they are and then not performing. Tesla is way down the road to performing and will never be a McLaren. I just want to see them make that last 5% and, as any programmer knows, that last 5% is a *itch!
EarlyAdoptor,
Sorry to use so many words to basically say the same thing�
Mar 29, 2013
Suzieq The real problem with accepting a dirty car is that dirt hides defects. So you accept a dirty car, drive it home, wash it, and find nicks and scratches in the paint. Too late! You accepted the car. If this is OK with you, hey everyone is different. My car will be clean before I accept it. And hopefully, defect free as well.�
Mar 29, 2013
ppl There is no way this post is true-
1. My oen delivery service was perfect as was the car cleaned and charged
2. Explain why anyone would accept car in condition he reports. No obligation to who would be foolish enough to accept car with bubbling finish and malaligned doors?
Another short attack�
Mar 29, 2013
jerry33 My car was clean on delivery (not for very long though--whatever happened to the self-cleaning car?
The two Tesla folks took a lot of time explaining the car to us.
I knew enough to get paint armour from a local installer.
I don't see how they could have done better.
Waiting for the parcel shelf.�
Mar 29, 2013
montgom626 You just did condemn this fellow. So "do as I say, not as I do"?
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I agree with your comment. My car was perfect at delivery. If it had not been perfect, I would not have accepted it. I have never accepted a car, any car, from any manufacturer that was not good at the time of delivery. Is this called due diligence? Or just common sense? If I had accepted a car in such alleged poor condition, I would have been a fool.�
Mar 29, 2013
fluxemag When I was 17 I worked at the Scottsdale Jag/Porsche/Bentley/Aston dealer as a lot attendant making $7 an hour. Best job I've ever had by the way (I ultimately was fired for speeding in a 911, go figure...not to mention cruising ASU in a DB7 Volante many a times). The dealership had a bay where I would drive the cars up an hand wash them periodically. I washed the interior, exterior, door jams, trunk jams and under the bonnet. This was totally different from the detailing job done by a professional in the adjacent bay which was not part of new car sales. I also worked at the local Mercedes dealership (for 1 day) and they just drive the cars through a 10 foot long auto wash. I suspect most dealerships just drive it through a mechanical wash, which is terrible. I wouldn't drive a black car through one of those for any reason.
So I guess my point is, I think a good hand wash is all we should expect.�
Mar 29, 2013
artsci Is this a troll attack by a short? I guess these people will stop at nothing. If so, liar liar pants on fire.�
Mar 29, 2013
Norbert Opinions on this matter are slightly different, let's leave it at that and calm down.�
Mar 29, 2013
AMPd Are they delivering Standard Suspension cars already?
How often does Tesla miss their delivery window ? - Page 2
Ops car is standard suspension, post #13�
Mar 29, 2013
brianman I'm offended by your casual and improper use of this word.�
Mar 29, 2013
Rodolfo Paiz Not at all. I noted how easy it is to condemn someone in such a knee-jerk fashion, and how his/her approach might well be turned against him/her. Then I said that I would never do so since I know just how absurd such conduct would be. The intent was for that person to realize the error of his/her ways... not that I have high hopes, but it was worth a try.
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Amen.
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For the sake of comparison, I just got home from my Model S delivery at the Dania Beach (FL) Service Center. Yes, it's almost 1am and I just received my car: Jacques drove back to Dania from his home at 10pm to deliver my car to me. I wanted the car, he wanted to help his company make the best quarterly numbers they can, so we were on the same page. My car was absolutely impeccable. We went over both the car and the paperwork with a fine-toothed comb (none of this "when I get home" baloney), and I cannot find even the smallest gripe. The whole delivery experience took about 90 minutes and I cannot think of any way in which Tesla could have done better.
And oh-my-God this car is incredible.�
Mar 30, 2013
DrTaras I agree wholeheartedly. Sometimes in this forum I noticed that if you're not 100% Tesla-fanboy, all the time, people jump all over you! :cursing:
I, for one, believe in airing dirty laundry but others believe that it should be kept under wraps!
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Pre-Script Olive Branch: I removed the name of the person I'm quoting above, because it is not a personal attack on them, just a critique of the style. :smile:
Does an 'N' of 1 prove that 'there is no way this post is true'?
Why is there a lack of perception relativity that other people can have other experiences that are 180 degrees from their own?
Then, especially someone who bought the car, goes and blogs about it; do they want to destroy the company or maybe, just maybe, if enough people complain, the company will change for the better?
Maybe, just maybe, enthusiasm rolls over you like a wave of 'love at 1st site' and you accept a car, with all its delivery imperfections...
"but soon afterwards you wake up from your drunken stupor to find out that what happened was not right," I said to the Federali Policia in a Tijuana prison when I was asking for antibiotics a few decades back! :scared:�
Mar 30, 2013
AC1K apologies, i guess the Tesla forum has a completely different audience than the previous car enthusiast forums i have been on.
i've edited the original post, just doesn't seem to get my point across as effectively IMO (i can buy a brand new car with $16K as a winter car vs losing the entire amount)�
Mar 30, 2013
Kevin Sharpe +1 good luck with that comment :wink:�
Mar 30, 2013
lolachampcar .... not wanting to butt kiss here but thanks to all those out there that may not share my opinion but always offer thoughtful comments and engage reasonable discussion.�
Mar 30, 2013
PeterK I agree the delivery and service experience is important when you're spending this much. But from extensive reading of this forum and my own experience I think the OP's delivery (esp. dirty with paint armor bubbles) is an exception.
I had informed the DS that I was charging on 110v at home (not SolarCity's fault, snowstorm delays and need for a new meter) so they gave me a range charge. No due bill items other than the HPWC, which is shipped separately and i cant use until i get my meter anyway. They provided soft drinks to those who wanted them, and apologized for a somewhat limited selection ("No drinking in the car, kids!"). And the DS and a trainee spent 90 minutes with me and my family, wrapping up at 8:45pm.�
Mar 30, 2013
AC1K im starting to see that with all the responses, i guess most people wont voice their opinion unless its bad.
If a delivery went smooth and everything is right, the people would be out driving instead of at home frustrated infront of the computer letting off steam.
ill buy a Model S P85 regardless, but the time to purchase is still up in the air, if Tesla does have "teething" issues i can wait until they have it right with customer service and technical/mechanical issues, my current car is only 4 years old and its been the most reliable and fun car ive ever had, its not like i would be dead in the water.
there still is no company even close to tesla, the leaf is a joke, the mitubishi ev looks stupid, the fisker, prius an the volt dont solve anything because they still burn gas, what am i left with? im not going to downgrade just to go EV, every successive car ive had has been an upgrade in all aspects, not going to stop now.�
Mar 30, 2013
Norbert Personally, I believe in neither of those.�
Mar 30, 2013
lolachampcar AC1K,
Great delivery and my DS has been very good before, during and after....�
Mar 30, 2013
Rodolfo Paiz It's a well-known concept in marketing: for example, there's a well-done study that showed happy customers tell 3 people about their good experience while unhappy customers tell 15 people about their bad experience. This is all "on average" of course... but yes, happy customers make a lot less noise.
If you're not willing to go through some teething issues, wait a bit before buying. I'm thrilled with my Model S, like I was thrilled with my Roadster. But it's still a young company and there are still teething issues. Witness Alcantaragate going on right now, plus the vampire losses, plus plenty of missing functionality (no track-up view or range buttons on map, no shuffle for songs), and so on. I fully believe Tesla is putting forth their best effort and that everything will work out very well... but today, things are not perfect and you cannot reasonably expect -- yet -- that Tesla's error and failure rates will be near-zero.
On the other hand, if you can stomach some teething issues... the Model S is all that and a bag of chips. I'm thinking of sleeping in the car for a day or two. :-D�
Mar 30, 2013
jerry33 Speaking of chips, I really have to get that car vacuum.
I thought I might have to when I said we're going to pick it up today, but Denise really likes it too.�
Mar 31, 2013
lolachampcar Two comments on the 3 and 15 ratio of good experiences being passed on versus bad-
First, I literally proselytize when in comes to MS. If someone shows interest, I will continue to answer questions until they run out of them and, if I think they are a potential customer, will make sure they get a ride and/or drive in the car as well. I've NEVER done that for any other product.
Second, the best possible scenario for a company is to have an issue and then blow the customer away with how they address it. This allows you access to the "talk to 15" group with the conversation being how well you handled the problem. I've had first hand experience with this and it works. Tesla is trying hard to tune up their business to take advantage of it.�
Mar 31, 2013
Doug Martoccia Given the title of this thread, it's obvious that some dirty laundry would be discussed. I think it's ok to voice a few gripes and complaints; however, it must be done with tact and precision. Making general statements about cars not being clean, etc. is a waste of everyone's time unless accompanied by the specific location where the delivery occurred, your response, Teslas response, etc. If a buyer notes that a car they are buying is dirty, all auto companies, including Tesla, will offer to detail it for you, either that day or at a future date. Condemning the entire company because the XYZ service center was busy and didn't have a car delivered properly is a bit unfair.
People will jump down others throats in a heartbeat on these (and other) forums when statements appear contrary to how they see the world. Negative comments (in any forum) must be handled very carefully. Provide a few details, attempt to explain what happened in a balanced manner, be thoughtful...�
Mar 31, 2013
kendallpb Woah, uh, yeah, definitely complain about this; they must fix it IMHO (and like I said, my local Service Center had no problems arranging...which reminds me I still need to examine it to make sure it looks okay now).�
Mar 31, 2013
kendallpb I don't see it happening like that in general, or here (I see support, opposition, and just downright amusement at the original post). Maybe we're not reading the same thread, or maybe you just want the opposite--no complaint should ever be disagreed with? ;-) Surely not, but I can't square your comment with what I read here (both in this thread and in the Model S forum in general). Maybe it's a glass half-empty/half-full thing like someone mentioned in this thread.
Anyway, IMHO folks must expect--and will get--push-back when complaints are vague or unrealistic, or there's a lot of attitude, or the complainer doesn't take ownership of their own part, etc. That seems reasonable to me. I'm not saying all these are at issue here--just in general, I feel like I see most push-back from glass-half-full people coming from, and I feel that's a-okay. I don't want a non-stop gripe-fest or a non-stop love-fest; fortunately, I don't see either.
Sorry to get a little meta. Back to the most important part of this thread: The "ghetto" comments still make me grin. :biggrin: Someone should do a photo safari of all the Tesla locations; they probably vary quite a bit in neighborhoods, appearance, etc.
Obligatory DS Recap: My delivery was awesome but, as with many, I still await my parcel shelf and HPWC. I've covered my other, incredibly minor issues in other threads, mostly resolved now.�
Apr 4, 2013
bellwilliam got back today, awesome trip at the Ring.
here are 3 pictures of the panel fits I was complaining about. There are ~3 more panel issue, but I couldn't get a decent shot to show the misalignment, so not posting those, they also aren't as bad.
btw, bad luck. I was away for 7 days. come back home, car won't start. no light, no nothing. talked to a service rep, taught me how to undo the charge port lock thing, and plug in the charger (wasn't plugged in during the trip, my fault. Solar City didn't finish my install on 220v till 2 days ago, but I should of plugged in 110v). unfortunately it won't charge. He informed me it is a 12v issue in this batch of delivery. Will get a tow back to the service center tomorrow.�
Apr 4, 2013
AMPd Thanks for the pics
Wow the white really shows off those gaps/misalignments
Luckily for me this is all I care about
Its what's inside that counts�
Apr 5, 2013
Rodolfo Paiz Agreed on each and every point.�
Apr 5, 2013
bellwilliam update: I called Tesla yesterday about 12v issue. car is completely dead. someone from local service center called me today. no rangers available. so we will see what happens on Monday...�
Apr 5, 2013
qwk If you are impatient, pop the nose cone off, and put a trickle charger on it for a few hours. Should do the trick to start charging.�
Apr 5, 2013
jomo25 I refer you to this post: 12V battery issues (error messages/car charging problems) - Page 22
Also, so you left for a week and didn't leave it plugged in? I thought the recommendation is to leave it plugged in. Not that that should have caused a dead 12V. Just asking for clarification and if that is the recommended protocol.�
Apr 5, 2013
bellwilliam I popped off the nose cone an hour ago, and stuck a charger on it. still nothing so far, will wait overnight.
thanks for the link, it is saying issue fixed with 4.2 which I already have.
long story, but Solar City didn't coordinate the install with electrical company, so I didn't get 220v power till couple of days ago. when SCE came over and hooked up the power. I should of plugged into 110v before I left, my wife didn't bother charge using 220v (she was afraid of doing the charge first time without me), as I would be back in 2 days. car had ~60 miles left before I left for a week trip.�
Apr 6, 2013
Doug Martoccia This vampire drain problem really needs to get fixed ASAP. Ok, by next month when I should be taking delivery <grin>
There is no reason that an EV should require to be plugged in when the car is not driven. My Active E can be left alone for weeks and it's just a prototype with lots of design issues!�
Apr 6, 2013
bellwilliam Charging 12v overnight didn't fix the 12v, it read 6v on voltmeter. I then hooked up a jumper battery, car woke up. Started charging (220v) for few hours, now everything works. Ran voltmeter, 12v battery is now reading 14v. Great so far. Took it out for a drive, everything works.�
Apr 6, 2013
AMPd Glad it was a rather simple fix.�
Apr 7, 2013
jkirkebo The 12V might be shot after being left so low on charge for such a long time. Lead acid batteries really don't like that, so you might end up having to replace it. If you do, you'll soon find out.�
Apr 7, 2013
bellwilliam not sure how 7 days is a long time......
and car only had 125 miles on it, of which 50 miles came from factory.
when you say left on low charge, do you mean 12v or the 220v system (propulsion) ?
I will check the voltage of 12v battery regularly, checking it through cigarette lighter socket.�
Apr 7, 2013
lolachampcar Some chargers will not charge if the battery voltage starts off too low. Others may default to 6V charging in your situation. The jumping provided some charge and supply current for the system which then allowed access to the high voltage system for charging. However, you have a lead acid battery that has spent time at low voltage. Typically this will damage the battery and cause you problems down the road. You may want Tesla to follow up and do a capacity test on it.
Sorry,
I did not see that jkirkebo got to the comment first.�
Apr 7, 2013
jkirkebo I mean the 12V battery. Letting one sit discharged (<10V) overnight is usually not very healthy for it.�
Apr 8, 2013
Greg G Disappointing delivery situation today. I had requested a service center pickup (Rockville). Tesla changed that to a home delivery to make their 1st quarter numbers. The driver couldn't get the cars off the truck today because 3 of the 6 cars were dead. The primary battery was at "0" so the 12v battery died. It seems that the team at the factory didn't charge the cars enough to last for the cross-country trip.
Tesla sent a tech from the service center. He "jumped" the dead cars, and we drove the 300 yards to a single Blink charger that was (fortunately) in the shopping center where we had the truck deliver the cars. An hour later, I had enough of a charge to drive home. What should have been an easy 1-hour process ended up taking 4 hours and two trips to the shopping center. Even now I'm still waiting for the car to charge enough so I can drive it without range anxiety (it's at 17 miles now). I'm happy to have the car, and it's in good condition otherwise. But, the delivery experience was a letdown.�
Apr 13, 2013
PeterK I assume they changed to home deliveries so they could count them as soon as the truck left the factory, vs. when you would have picked up at the service center. As a shareholder and Model S owner I want to see Tesla succeed, and exceeding 1Q sales/delivery numbers to achieve the first profitable quarter was a huge milestone. I'm glad my early March delivery helped contribute to it. But I think the company owes people like Greg G and perhaps the OP a "thank you" in the form of a little Tesla branded gear to make up for the rushed/incomplete/on-our-terms deliveries at the end of the quarter.�
Apr 13, 2013
Doug Martoccia The 12V shouldn't drain this quickly. I wonder if this is a problem with the keyless entry system? I can't believe that they would have so many issues with 12V batteries without a non-battery related cause.�
Apr 13, 2013
jerry33 It's not surprising to me. Every car with a big battery has more issues with the 12V battery than with anything else. The engineers size the battery to be "just enough" and so if anything unexpected happens--battery drained. Honestly, if they would add 9 kg and put in a full sized battery like this one at least 75% of the problems with the 12V would go away.�
Apr 13, 2013
AC1K 330 cca? for $100+K car, i would expect 1000cca agm battery considering how many electonics in the car rely on the battery.�
May 2, 2013
MikeMueller I had the same experience and very disappointed. You want to drive your new car but its trashed with no charge to show it off. I have yet to get a follow up car on delivery or an email.�
May 3, 2013
islandbayy ACK, CCA Does not matter at all for the Tesla. CCA is Cold Cranking Amps. We are not "Cranking" a ICE over. That is the only time CCA comes into play.
What we want are AH (Amp Hours). Amp hours are how long a battery can provide XXX # of amps for a certain period of time. Which is usually rated at 1 amp I believe. so a deep cycle battery, rated at 114 amp hours, should be able to provide 1 amp of power for 114 hours, or 114 amps for 1 hour (Although, due to inefficiencies and being able to get less power at higher draws, most likely a 114 ah battery would be able to provide about 70 or 80 at 114 amp draw for a hour-ish).
So the magic number, is the AH capacity of the battery. It could be 10 cranking amps, but as long as it can provide enough current to the electronics, and has a deep cycle capacity of enough amp hours, it's fine.
The odyssey battery above poster linked to has a AH rating of 28AH. That is fairly decent. Personally, my experience with Odyssey has not been a good one, and I will not be using their batteries any time soon. I have had great success with Batteries Plus Werker series Deep Cycles for Sealed Batteries, and Extremely great success with Walmart's Flooded Deep Cycle Everstart-Maxx Marine for flooded uses such as my EV Conversion. And Walmart has a warranty second to none. Unfortunately, they do not have a side that would fit a Tesla.
Although, anyone here have the Group Size or dimensions of the Tesla battery, I would really like it as I am looking into a Lithium Alternative.�
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