Apr 21, 2016
loganintx Here's a video on YouTube of an owner who did a great job documenting his issues with this X
He did opt for the upgraded fart noise when you roll the windows up. I must have missed that option when I ordered mine.�
Apr 21, 2016
ModelXBoy Oh wow! I am speechless. No wonder the SC manager told me my X is not the worst condition which is already one of the worst on this forum. I am so sorry for this owner. It's good that he returned it. This is more than frustration. This is insanity.�
Apr 21, 2016
AnOutsider Where's the option for "shock" or "sadness" on a post?�
Apr 21, 2016
SMSMD Thanks for Sharing..painful to watch , very informative,,Good Luck�
Apr 21, 2016
electricity That is bad. I still dont believe uploading a video of it to youtube is the correct thing to do to such a young company.�
Apr 21, 2016
proven I would have been very upset if my car had all those issues. I just went out to look at our X in the garage after watching this and we have none of those problems. From the old software version in the video it looks like that was an early sig.�
Apr 21, 2016
AnOutsider I don't believe hiding it does the young company any favors either. It's sort of like spoiling a child... Tesla needs to know where its faults lie and fix them. Coddling them will not help.�
Apr 21, 2016
loganintx I posted a few questions to him in the comments on his video. I'm hoping he responds.�
Apr 21, 2016
elguapo That's awful. It's embarrassing that the car made it out of QC. My concern, however, is the car was okay in QC and then these issues develop quickly with usage.
I have the exact same issue with my door clicking when it's open (bugs me, but not bad enough to go to SC yet). The other issue I also have just happened today - passenger side front window closing outside of trim, just like in video. I was able to lower it a couple of times and get it to go back, but now there's some odd noise coming from the door - like a piece is moving around inside when I drive.
Before today, everything was near perfect. Growing pains. Still, much better off than this guy.�
Apr 21, 2016
X Fan Man...that�s awful.....I really admire the owner�s calm demeanor.
Going to change my purchase to a lease...�
Apr 21, 2016
Ryan MF I'm sure Tesla is well aware of this. They are also being held to a higher standard with all the media scrutiny. Every issue is amplified 10x and turned into blog posts, news stories, and click bait articles.
That being said, this car still shouldn't have made it out of QA.�
Apr 21, 2016
DougH Man I would be so annoyed if I was that guy.
Was he wearing a robe lmao�
Apr 21, 2016
pchan So, it is not bad if a similar video is about Porsche Cayenne Turbo? That is really bad if he fabricated those issues when what he got was a perfect $140K vehicle from Tesla. When Tesla is selling a vehicle in this class, at this price, they should be held to the same standard as another old/new company. If they don't feel they can produce the same quality vehicle, maybe they should price it like a Kia Sorento SUV.�
Apr 21, 2016
sukhi I am speechless and actually saddened!�
Apr 21, 2016
Subhuman I'm sorry but Tesla is not being held to a higher standard at least in this case. I have never bought a new car that had issues like that regardless of make. They are being held to the industry standard which in all honesty isn't that high and they failed miserably at least on this build. This is very disappointing. This car should have never been given to the costumer until it was ready to be delivered even if it would have delayed delivery further. Sure the costumer may have been mad about the delay but once he received the car in good working order it would have been forgotten about and he would still be a happy Tesla owner.�
Apr 21, 2016
sukhi The issues shared by this guy are basic workmanship issues and should been caught during QC. No car company young or otherwise should get to deliver such shoddy vehicle. Delivering such a poor quality car shows fundamental disrespect for the customer.
One could argue some of these issues manifested post delivery but many existed from the beginning.�
Apr 21, 2016
shokunin That's disappointing to see. The sad part is that this doesn't seem to be an isolated case, many threads here about quality issues. This car seems so badly aligned that everything is just thrown off tolerance.
They need to stop the production line and get these issues resolved on the factory floor and not in the service center. They may very well be doing this as the recent production delays in VINs that should have entered production.�
Apr 21, 2016
systemcrashed Frankly, I'm having a hard time digesting this video. I'm sure there's more to the story. This is not the quality that is coming off the line currently, not even close. This vehicle may be a production line test unit that somehow made its way through to final production, possibly a preproduction unit that was put back into the line. Whatever the case may be, Tesla took the car back and I'm wondering if they offered him a replacement vehicle of the current line.�
Apr 21, 2016
Oil4AsphaultOnly This is so blatantly bad that I'm starting to wonder if someone is actively sabotaging the production line?! Just enough of a defect to pass initial QC, but fail shortly after. But those rusted parts. With the exterior being mostly aluminium, how did enough moisture get in to rust the steel parts inside?!?!�
Apr 21, 2016
systemcrashed seems suspicious to me too, we would be fools to believe that a QC inspector even came close to this car.�
Apr 21, 2016
mkjayakumar This might go viral like the video made by a Fisker Karma owner on how bad the UI is.�
Apr 21, 2016
xkwizit While I understand the frustration and disappointment of this person, I don't see what is the objective of posting this on YouTube. If you don't want to be an early adopter and you want a perfect car of which several hundreds of thousands have been produced, hold off on confirming your order. Tesla didn't force anyone to confirm their order.
Four years back I picked up a new Lexus RX from Lexus dealer and by the time I got home the front bumper popped off from a side..literally just came off while driving home. Well, for a car that has been produced en mass, should it happen? Obviously not but it does. So go back to the dealer and get it taken care of. The car is in warranty. Why make a fuss and post on YouTube?�
Apr 21, 2016
systemcrashed He may be shorting TSLA, trying to make a quick buck.�
Apr 21, 2016
hockeythug I highly doubt that is this case but it wouldn't be the first time that happened in the history of the NUMMI plant.�
Apr 21, 2016
Dr ValueSeeker That isn't possible. Mr. Musk and highly paid top execs are personally testing these cars. He said so in last ER. Are you saying they did a lousy job? Or did he not tell the truth?�
Apr 21, 2016
luca Tesla should fire all employees who delivered this car in SC�
Apr 21, 2016
Dr ValueSeeker How about the purpose of alerting other buyers and protecting them from a lemon? I guess, you want every Tesla buyer to be put on mute when the news is not good.�
Apr 21, 2016
xkwizit So are you saying no other manufacturers make lemons? You don't go around posting one offs like this. It's insane.
And when was this vehicle delivered? Early Jan maybe Feb and the video was posted today? Has Tesla not taken care of each one of the issues?�
Apr 21, 2016
ohmman Undeliverable car? 100%. How many issues are actual major issues? Maybe 50% or higher. There was a level of exaggeration to the video that was unmistakeable as well, though. I get it, you've got a car with issues, you start to look for extra stuff. The falcon wing door hinge issue was ugly. The surface rust was unacceptable (if benign). The panel gaps.. eh. They're comparable to my Model S. Obviously the passenger door motor was messed up - did he need to show that multiple times?
Again, I think this was an awful delivery, definitely return-worthy. But the video really tried to make the story more interesting.�
Apr 21, 2016
Dr ValueSeeker No, I haven't said that. You are free to make your own lemon video of other cars and post on youtube or wherever.
Are you long TSLA? You seem to have an agenda here.�
Apr 21, 2016
electricity He returned the car in december and posted the video today. I dont know but there is something more to this story for sure.�
Apr 21, 2016
xkwizit Well..no I don't go around posting videos just as I didn't of my RX ..and no I am not a shareholder or trading in TSLA. The only agenda I have is to keep this forum informative and positive and not have all this unnecessary noise scare people away from a very beautiful and functional engineering marvel.
And I wasn't even ready to be an early adopter. I reserved mine in late Aug 2015 expected to get my turn to confirm in late Summer 2016. I was expecting that first few thousand cars will have issues as the production line matures. However, I got an opportunity to order in early Jan 2016 and based on the experience of MS, we took the plunge to become an early adopter and support Tesla's mission.�
Apr 21, 2016
engle My initial reaction to this video is he shouldn't have accepted delivery in the first place with all that dirt on the sides of the seats. That makes me very suspicious. Who could miss that?
He only has one video ever posted to Youtube, and this was his response to a question about his video:
"Logan Boyd3 hours ago
What Firmware version do you have? What's your VIN range? What's the build Month/Year on your X? Have you visited an SC to fix any issues since you took delivery? Did you spend a lot of time during delivery testing out the functions of the car? Did anything have issues at that time?
![[?IMG]](https://yt3.ggpht.com/-JRV7eCtgpEE/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAAAA/qRppfV1e4Cc/s32-c-k-no-rj-c0xffffff/photo.jpg)
Bob Navi17 minutes ago
+Logan Boyd My VIN was in the mid 500. I received on Dec 27th and with in 3 days in was in service. I have return the car since then.
![[?IMG]](https://yt3.ggpht.com/-YiMky4-OGFg/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAAAA/QGy7ATL1Hts/s32-c-k-no-rj-c0xffffff/photo.jpg)
Kehl Chen12 minutes ago
+Bob Navi Tesla already bought back your car, why did you post this video four months later? For money?"�
Apr 21, 2016
ohmman I'm assuming you're talking to someone, but using the forum software properly makes it hard to tell sometimes.
�
Apr 21, 2016
Drivin The young company has hundreds of millions of dollars and you want to favor them over an individual who has way less money after that person gave them their hard earned money and got this?
That is really sad.
Whatever happened to the 99% not being screwed over by the 1%?�
Apr 21, 2016
Drivin I think Mr. Hubris had some explaining to do!
Either that or he will get a promotion. Seriously hard to tell at this point.
Rust? Really???�
Apr 21, 2016
Drivin Rah rah rah!
Let's be positive!
Sis boom ba!
People prefer an agenda of transparency and truth over mindless cheerleading, but keep trying. It is interesting to watch
Denial is not a river in France.�
Apr 21, 2016
K-MTG I haven't seen anyone with a sunshade report any issues. The presence of a sunshade resolves all reliability issues.�
Apr 21, 2016
ModelXBoy What? Give me that sunshade then!�
Apr 22, 2016
K-MTG Hopefully you will have one on your replacement X! How is the process going, did they assign you a new VIN? I am have horrible communication with my DS Emily at Costa Mesa�
Apr 22, 2016
systemcrashed The varying degrees of issue reports across current owners begs me to ask some questions. If a car such as the one in the video ever made it to a SC, to what degree can it be "prepared" for delivery to the customer? Are there some SCs that have Tesla wizards that can fix any issue and some SCs with hacks that can't? Was the QC at the factory non existent for a period of time early on, but now in full effect? And last but not least was bob in the video promised a new car off the current line?�
Apr 22, 2016
Mark Z Watching the video did bring back memories of similar issues. After I cleaned my "used" driver's seat with a Mr. Clean Magic Eraser, the SC took care of all the remaining problems. Here are a few that were noted by the OP and corresponding results on my teenage VIN.
The Falcon Wing Door not opening out is due to sun heat on the door. Tesla reengineered the mounting of the sensor. Fixed.
The passenger door not opening was solved by replacing the door latch. Fixed. (Also, try standing away from the FWD sensor.)
The driver window making noise or window alignment. One visit to the SC and it works perfectly.
New vehicles can be like buying a new house. You create a punch list of issues and the contractor solves them.�
Apr 22, 2016
N5329K Ghosts of NUMMI, the worst plant in GM's dodgy history. Fit and finish issues would be appalling in a Tata subcompact. Neither Honda nor Toyota would ever allow a car like that through QC. Tesla needs to focus. This sort of experience will be magnified a thousand-fold when production moves beyond first-adopters and true believers. No automobile company would survive the kind of publicity that would generate.
Robin�
Apr 22, 2016
AnOutsider *catches up on thread*
Ah, I'd wondered how long it would take for accusations of short etc to get thrown around.�
Apr 22, 2016
systemcrashed @AnOutsider , sorry my facetiousness was not more transparent... Thought that was the point.�
Apr 22, 2016
Jeffgtx Nummi was co-operated by Toyota.�
Apr 22, 2016
systemcrashed Does anyone remember the Geo Metro?�
Apr 22, 2016
ankitmishra There is not much in this video that isn't already a known issue. White seats are known to tear and Tesla has acknowledged it and promised an improvement. Doors are having problems and people have criticised Tesla more than enough for that. It will be resolved in this quarter in my opinion. Now, panel gaps have been occurring from time to time. And I don't think they will stop until Tesla becomes stable and boring. People who are saying they are holding Tesla to same standards as any other car maker have questionable argument. Same standards can't be applied to Tesla as no other company is as extraordinary as Tesla. It's like people are saying why a supercomputer utilises so much electricity in cooling and requires maintenance when their calculator keeps on going on and on even if it's treated like dirt.
People who like a no problem car should wait till the car is in market for few years. New things are done by trying and failing. A lot of problems show up when car is produced in numbers.�
Apr 22, 2016
N5329K Jeffgtx:
Yes it was. They saw it as a way to learn the North American market. GM hoped to learn the secrets of "lean manufacturing." The Japanese couldn't believe what that saw at NUMMI. Workers were showing up drunk, they were driving screws with hammers to keep the line going. Parts were stripped from finished cars to complete cars still in assembly. The parking lot was filled with new cars that couldn't move, had been built incorrectly, with the wrong parts, and had to be fixed by special "tiger teams" to get them off site.
Toyota brought a lot of GM guys to Japan to try to learn how to build cars better. GM decided there was nothing to learn and bailed on the cooperative arrangement. What Toyota learned from the experience, they never said. Though the Japanese are famously polite.
Robin�
Apr 22, 2016
ohmman I strongly recommend listening to this episode of This American Life, which documents some of the NUMMI history.�
Apr 22, 2016
DougH I actually saw one two days ago, the guy driving tried to pass me on the highway. I honked and waived.�
Apr 22, 2016
DrComputer Hmm... one can see that he has aftermarket tint added to the front (and probably rear) windows. Most tint installers disassemble the doors so they can put the tint below the door line. I wonder if the tint installers screwed up something when re-assembling the front and falcon wing doors. Could the dirty back seats also be attributed to any after-market parts he had installed in the car? I think there is more to the story.�
Apr 22, 2016
Buddyroe No company should put out a product this bad. No excuse for it. Period.
I LOVE Tesla. I spend way too many hours in the comment section of articles defending Tesla - well, honestly, just defending the truth (on the WSJ articles, I am "Carl Saxton"). But, I simply could not possibly defend this.�
Apr 22, 2016
rallykeeper Personally, I like these videos, and I'm very long TSLA, very much a fanboy and evangelize regularly. However, I'm the first to admit that Tesla has QC issues (particularly with software) and Tesla has communication issues. Both are likely attributable to their high rate of growth, but both need improvement.
By way of background, I'm on on my second go-around as a Tesla beta-tester (2012 Model S, early MX 90D). I've also worked with three different service centers in Los Angeles (starting with the original West LA center) and probably average 2 appointments/year since my first year.
While service is ultimately great, one thing I've learned with our Model S is that you have to clearly document* all problems -- big and small. That's both for the benefit of getting your problem fixed -- but also for the benefit of the SC technician to learn about all the various production quirks that can occur. Finally, I think it can remind the Fremont engineers that they still have some incremental improvements to make (e.g., Mark Z's points about the sensors being relocated).
The other thing I've learned is that you have to be persistent in figuring out all your issues or you'll be frustrated how they constantly crop up. Videos like this -- whatever the motivation in posting -- are highly helpful in knowing what to look for.
Our MX won't be going into service until week 6 after delivery (that'll be early May). My punchlist is already 10+ items long (with at least 50% of the same issues -- though some to a lesser degree -- as this video, plus a few more big-gish and small-ish).
If anyone is interested, here are a sampling of our issues so far (see how they are similar even though my car was made much later?):
- Passenger door stuck problems (I have experienced virtually all those). Door clicking on both both front doors.
- Rear hatch alignment issues (mine were more severe as they caused body/paint damage due to misalingment)
- Chrome gaps (same as video)
- Window scraping (ours on the the FWDs and horizontal instead of vertical lines)
- Front seat motor problems (probably mostly software)
- That pesky recall
- FWD door slow "collapsing" if it hasn't been opened all the way
- Phantom inconsistent proximity sensing by both the front doors and the FWDs.
- (Still need to inspect for rust)
* Written language documentation doesn't seem to sufficient or the problems will persist. By way of example, 3+ years after taking delivery, we only just now got our squeaky seatbelt replaced (original MS owners will recall that rear passenger and occasionally front passenger buckles squeaked because they weren't installed correctly). It took me driving into the service center and showing my third technician the problem before we finally got it fixed. (The problem was obviously never big enough to merit its own trip -- the car was actually in for its second go-around at fixing the rear leaky taillight.)�
Apr 22, 2016
systemcrashed Great episode, we donated our 1994 Geo Prism about 6 years ago, still ran but body was falling apart. Hope Tesla didn't hire any of those NUMMI Union guys.�
Apr 22, 2016
gaswalla This is an appropriate warning for everyone taking delivery in the last 2 weeks of a quarter.. Yes, you want your vehicle asap, but it's worth the wait to mid - quarter. Similar issues Model S for first 1-2 years�
Apr 22, 2016
nienco2 Here is something not previously known: Tesla has so disrespected this customer that it was okay to take his money and then pass off what clearly was a flawed car. Just insulting! Maybe they could have said, "look the car has some minor issues but if you will take delivery before the 31st we will fix it all 100% next month".�
Apr 22, 2016
sukhi Watching these forums, I find it quite odd to see all these statements and counter statements about being long or short on TSLA stock. Ins't it possible that some of us just want to have a conversations about the merits or demerits of a company's product and services without it devolving into accusations about benefiting from the company stock one way or the other. Sometimes our relationship with a company might be just about getting the fair value for a specific product purchase and the service thereof. No more and no less. More often than not, being an investor or a consumer have nothing to do with each other. There are many companies whose products I would gladly use but would never invest in that company and vice versa.�
Apr 22, 2016
ModelXBoy People need to understand the difference between QC problem and QC problems lead to body damage. My X has just a simple latch problem and some painting issues. But here is the diagram on how my car takes more than "lemon law" required which is more than 30 days to fix:
Latch problem failture ---> Busted bolt joint problem ---> Door panel damage (Body shop involved) ---> top pillar damage (body shop involve) ---> glass shattered by body shop ---> waiting for parts ---> wrong parts received ---> reorder window and install ---> still waiting.
The chain of problems all happened in SC.
Total 32 days in SC right now
This is how all started.
Bottom line, normal SC fixes and swap parts are easy fixes, but once body shop is involved, there will be world of troubles.
ModelXBoy�
Apr 22, 2016
alleycat He should have sold this to Ford.�
Apr 22, 2016
rallykeeper Agreed, but saying you are long is sometimes necessary.
Unfortunately around here, occasionally when you write something negative about Tesla the product, you are accused of being short TSLA the stock. You only have to look at the posts above to see evidence of that.
Those of us that post that we are long are simply trying to bat down the short accusation right away.
It seems to be that TSLA is rather unique when it comes to the intertwining of investment opinions and product opinions. Only AAPL seems to foster the same level of "enthusiasm". (E.g., I'm not sure I've ever seen a positive or negative discussion of PlayStations devolve into accusations of being short SNE; or Disney movies, Microsoft Windows, etc).�
Apr 22, 2016
sukhi I think investing $100K+ in buying product of a company is enough of a proof
�
Apr 22, 2016
ohmman I wonder if people think I'm long or short TSLA, based on my posts.�
Apr 22, 2016
ModelXBoy BTW guys, if you purchase a Tesla product, that is the best way to support Tesla. Buying stock does not help Tesla, once publicly trade company acquires its initial offering, their stock is then publicly traded, has nothing to do with Tesla anymore. So be a Tesla investor does not really help Tesla. People are in it for the money reason. If someone here on the forum believe Tesla is an innovative company and wants it to last as long as possible, the best way is to buy their product.�
Apr 22, 2016
sukhi I guess middle of the road folks like us could be accused of planting the comments to influence TSLA price to day trade in order to take advantage of the short term movements
PS: Of course we used the day trading profits to buy Tesla cars�
Apr 22, 2016
Blastphemy It helps every Tesla executive and employee who vests stock options as part of their employment contract.�
Apr 22, 2016
AnOutsider Amen. It seems there's an issue disconnecting owner from investor (and a number of folks who are just investors). There's also some folks who are VERY pro Tesla and perhaps see calling someone a "short" an easy way to dismiss an opinion or position that's anti-Tesla.�
Apr 22, 2016
pchan Very good point. I am speechless ... He probably only spent $140K on his X, what is he thinking? Problem free? Rust free? It made with metal, of course it rusts.�
Apr 22, 2016
ohmman That is one benefit, certainly, since buy-side pressure keeps the stock price aloft. Arguably more importantly, Tesla occasionally needs to raise capital and can issue a secondary offering, as they did last year. They were able to do it when the price was quite high, which is quite valuable.
Firms also report to investors. If share price is floundering, companies don't just ride on the coattails of their IPO funding. The stock price certainly doesn't have "nothing to do with Tesla anymore."
That said, I agree with @ModelXBoy that buying the product is as important or more so than buying shares of the company.�
Apr 22, 2016
proven Elon Musk made that comment after this guy already gave his car back to Tesla. This video may be new, but he took delivery on December 27th amid all the signatures that were delivered before the end of the year with quality issues. Not that I'm excusing the quality of his car--it's terrible--but that really doesn't represent what is coming off the line now.�
Apr 22, 2016
Subhuman While I understand your sentiment this is simple not true. How do you think Tesla paid of the DOE loan 8 years early and was able to build the gigafactory. This was all completed by secondary offerings. Interest free loan if you will from shareholders. Current talk is that Tesla will complete another secondary offering to excelorate production of the Model 3. Without access to capital markets Tesla may not be where it is at today.
Edit: Ohmman beat me to it.�
Apr 22, 2016
Drivin Yes.
A higher stock price also helps Tesla raise additional money at a lower cost.�
Apr 22, 2016
Drivin How do you know that?
There are cars coming off the line that have apparent delivery delays for some people.�
Apr 22, 2016
proven Do I "know" it absolutely without fail? No because I don't work for Tesla--but I've been looking at the evidence.
One, ours delivered in March is great and only had a few issues. Second, the posts on here with problems have been slowing down. Third, the posts on the Facebook Model X group have shown fewer problems. Fourth, I haven't seen more than a few people writing about problems as bad as this guys and they were also in the early run of cars. Fifth, I live close to the service center and each time I've been in there recently anecdotally they are seeing fewer problems with the X's.
Taking all of that together it seems that yes, cars coming off the line are much better than what that guy received. Remember that his car was one of the first 300 delivered and many of those people had big issues. My understanding of the current delays are that they are waiting for the third row seat recall parts.�
Apr 22, 2016
AnOutsider That was a REALLY good listen (listened to it in chunks while coding). Very enlightening, and sort of reinforces my dislike of unions and entrenched individuals.�
Apr 22, 2016
Drivin You are making a definitive statement that the line has improved, based on one actual data point (a $130k car that "only" has a few problems) and a bunch of random, unsubstantiated reports from anonymous people on the internet as well as the lack of information (not seeing posts as bad as this).
Well, ok then.
Kind of ironic given your screen name.
LOL.�
Apr 22, 2016
ohmman Agreed. Avoiding the thin ice of politics here, I'll just say that the story did a good job explaining how one particular union (UAW) in one particular arrangement (GM) had a tremendous amount of drawbacks and operational deficiencies. Some of the examples also show the value of Tesla's flexible robotic line (where they can pull a vehicle out but keep the line running).�
Apr 22, 2016
bhzmark the video is down. is there a repost or can someone summarize the highlights (lowlights)?�
Apr 22, 2016
proven That's true, it's all anecdotal besides our car and the three or so other ones I've seen in person. But seriously are you arguing that the problems are still this bad? Or are you just trying to prove that I don't know for sure?
Edit: Also, I'm not sure why you responded so rudely. You questioned a statement I made, I responded with my reasoning, and then you laugh and make fun of me? I thought it was the start of a good discussion.�
Apr 22, 2016
xkwizit I would still understand if someone who received a Model X that had more than cosmetic issues which Tesla hasn't been able to fix yet is venting here. But LOL, all these other folks trying to beat down the Model X owners who actually have a good car and are happy with their dealing with Tesla. That's pathetic IMHO. And defeats the purpose of sharing and learning on TMC.�
Apr 22, 2016
Subhuman Off topic but below is a link the another This American Life as they spend a month at a Jeep dealership. If interested in the in Tesla's battle against the dealership lobby it is an interesting listen.
513: 129 Cars�
Apr 22, 2016
dwebb66 As was pointed out earlier, it is not a matter of when you take delivery. It only matters when your car is produced, if Tesla has your car ready in the last two weeks of a quarter, it is already built and waiting until after the quarter ends to pick it up will not improve the quality of the car unless Tesla has a reason to touch/review it aging (for example, the seat recall which seems to be delaying deliveries.�
Apr 22, 2016
nienco2 Cha Ching!!! video has been taken down... guess he was finally offered enough $$$, so happy ending after all�
Apr 22, 2016
Dr ValueSeeker Yes, it shows the distorted world we live in. The Model X road trip videos and Phil Lebeau's Tesla commercials are on youtube for a long time. But anything negative must be hidden promptly from the public. I really thought Tesla was different�
Apr 22, 2016
Drivin They are different.
I don't know of any other car company that cancelled an order because they didn't like what a person said about a marketing event (even though the person seemed to praise the vision, goals and products of the company).�
Apr 22, 2016
S'toon That's not what happened. There were emails and at least one conversion between Alsop and Musk. It was after those that Musk said "It's not worth dealing with this individual."
I know many years ago I worked for a local computer store, and when a customer made a sexist comment to one of our salespeople another salesperson got on the phone and told they guy "We don't need your business." All companies have the option of not serving people that are more trouble than they're worth.�
Apr 22, 2016
cgiGuy Looks like he deleted the video. It would have been much more understandable if he had posted in Dec/Jan when he got the vehicle. But posting it 4 months after he returned it made me question his motivation.�
Apr 22, 2016
Drivin Well okay. I didn't realize that you have read the emails and were on the phone with the two of them.
I don't know where you got that quote from Musk, but that must have been in a conversation you had with him.
My mistake.�
Apr 22, 2016
Drivin Well, we don't know if he posted it back then and deleted it just like he deleted it this time.�
Apr 22, 2016
trigoe �
Apr 22, 2016
Dr ValueSeeker He got the car at the end of December. it must have taken some time to negotiate the return and get a refund. Will you feel safe to post such video before consummating the process? He would've been punished by Tesla. Just see the example above, of someone being denied his Model X.
And, why will he delete the video on his own within a day? And, if he really made this up, he could have lied and said, he got the car in March. But he didn't. These attempts of trying to dismiss anything negative as false or ill-motivated is getting tiring. It's not like Model X quality has been stellar other than this.�
Apr 22, 2016
jsollender Did I miss something in this thread? What video are you talking about? The guy with sig X delivery in December who turned car in and YouTubed 4 months later or some other video?�
Apr 22, 2016
cwerdna I'm not sure what the Geo Metro has to do w/NUMMI.
It wasn't ever produced at NUMMI and was joint venture of GM and Suzuki.
NUMMI was a Toyota/GM joint venture and produced vehicles such as the Corolla-based Pontiac Vibe, Toyota Corolla, Geo/Chevy Prizm and Toyota Tacoma.�
Apr 22, 2016
engle Edit: Opps! Should have caught up to the end of thread before replying. Ohmman beat me to it.
I agree the best way to support Tesla is to purchase their products.
That said, it does indirectly help Tesla when there is sufficient demand on the secondary market for their shares to keep the stock price elevated such that whenever TSLA needs to raise more capital with a secondary offering, as they might to accelerate their Model 3 plans, they can do so at a higher stock price which minimizes dilution for existing shareholders. Personally, I was very happy when the shares headed down last time, as I was able to add to my position at ~150.�
Apr 22, 2016
engle Either that, or it was a video Ford made after they tried to reassemble the early X they bought for $200K!�
Apr 22, 2016
pchan I was worrying I will have similar issues when my X supposedly deliver next month. Now, I feel a lot better when the video is down. I don't know what this thread is talking about. Let me go watch the Phil Lebeau video again. Thanks Tesla.�
Apr 22, 2016
systemcrashed f
i meant prism, I mentioned it in a later post... Thanks for the "rectification".�
Apr 22, 2016
wbrumfiel I was hoping to see the video too, guess I need to read these threads quicker�
Apr 22, 2016
ohmman Summary: The guy had a broken passenger door, a faulty passenger falcon wing door sensor, a busted passenger falcon wing door hinge at the articulating joint, which led to a piece of metal sticking into the cabin. He had ripped Ultra White material on the driver's seat, along with filthy fabric between the seats, especially in the 2nd row. Fit and finish were worse than they should be. If indeed the car was delivered this way, it was not acceptable to be sold by any stretch of the imagination. The owner did show a lot of the same issues from different looks, which made it look like there were more problems than I listed. However, I think I covered the majority of them.�
Apr 22, 2016
Mark Z Well, not quite. There is one bakery that no longer feels that way.
I am pleased the video has disappeared for one main reason, the video did not represent the excellence we are experiencing overall. The vehicle in question seemed more like a demonstrator, as the hidden dirt throughout and torn seat were unlike anything anyone has posted in regard to delivery condition. Perhaps there were some test drives before that video was taken. We may have seen conditions that did not represent all the facts. To be honest, I laughed at the excess that was shown, as it was far beyond the norm. (The sound of the window was priceless.�
Apr 23, 2016
joebob73 It's also possible that his agreement with Tesla for buying back the car precluded discussion of the issues as part of the buy back agreement. Perhaps someone from Tesla reminded him of this�
Apr 23, 2016
bhzmark Also possible that we was still negotiating the resolution with Tesla and needed this to add a little spark to the negotiation. When it served its purpose, and perhaps as a part of the resolution, he removed it.�
Apr 23, 2016
Drivin Is is possible that a hipster working for Big EV or Big Solar got to him
Something like: "Take down that video or you will never eat farm fresh organic arugula again!"�
Apr 23, 2016
loganintx The video is back...
�
Apr 23, 2016
wbrumfiel Say no to vertical video! Also that sucks for him. Sounds like they were able to send it back though. That's rather embarrassing for Tesla if it left the line or SC that way.�
Apr 23, 2016
ssq I just saw this video and I'm deeply concerned and disappointed at QC. I am hopeful of this car being a proper miss on QC checks, that slipped through in the rush of meeting quarterly numbers.�
Apr 23, 2016
engle You really think someone would be so naive or ignorant to accept delivery with all of those stains on the upholstery "since day one"? I sure don't. This video lacks credibility.
Also, the person who posted it, calling themselves "Keef Wivaneff", can't spell. The last title slide reads:
"EVENTHOUGH I LOVED THE CAR WE
ENDED UP RETURNGING IT BECAUSE
MY FAMILY AND I WERE VERY
DISAPOINTED WITH ALL THE ISSUES"
Also, "BECUASE" on the first slide. It almost reads as if a PR firm put it together and misspelt on purpose to make it look "amateurish", along with the lousy resolution cell phone video camera.
To me it looks like an intentional hit piece designed to negatively impact Tesla's sales. I just posted in the comments section of this bogus video:
"Your video is a joke and a sham. Only an ignorant fool would accept delivery of a Model X with those kind of upholstery stains "since day one". I challenge you to re-post under your real name -- but I know you won't. How many shares of Tesla are you shorting? Do you work for an oil company or in Detroit or Germany? You also need to learn how to spell. "Returnging" it? ha ha ha (disclaimer: my Model X has zero issues and I love driving it so much that I find excuses to do so.)"�
Apr 23, 2016
engle This video poster is busted!! "Keef Wivaneff blows the whistle on GREEN SCAMS".
Look at some of his other videos:
�
Apr 23, 2016
ssq I accept all your points but how the heck does a car in such bad shape leave the SC. unless he sabotaged the car and "created" those issues? I am just curious..�
Apr 23, 2016
ohmman It was a different user last time it was posted. I didn't think to check his other posts at the time - good call, @engle. Could be that the other poster was legit, and this one copied the video for reposting to "blow the whistle" on this green scam! Or they could be one and the same.�
Apr 23, 2016
ModelXBoy There is a saying Once something is on the internet, it will always be on the internet. Once the original video is on youtube, probably hundreds of shares and copies are made. So we should not be surprised that the video is back. Just why is the question.�
Apr 23, 2016
engle Agree he may have downloaded the video and re-posted it.
Keef Wivaneff is probably his real name, and he really has it in for Tesla, which he calls "Terdsla". Googled him and found these links:
Keef Wivaneff | Flickr - Photo Sharing! (a collection of Tesla's that have been in car accidents)
Keef Wivaneff � Profile � Disqus (writes "Heil Elon!!!!" and endless B.S. including about SCTY)
Keef Wivaneff - Google+ (more "Terdsla" ranting)
Keef Wivaneff's public profile | Identity | The Guardian (10 Jun 2014 post claiming he rented a Model S and got stranded when he ran out of electricity just short of a SC)
Keef Wivaneff's public profile | Identity | The Guardian (in this post he claims the Falcon 9 rocket 1st stage landing on the barge was faked)
My time is too valuable to find more of this guy's garbage.
OK... One more:
"In response to WeaponZero
I don't believe it is true CGI. It is more akin to frame by frame photoshop.
Simple off the shelf software:
Video editing basics in Adobe Photoshop | Adobe Photoshop CC tutorials
Take background shot of stormy seas.
Add barge - can be real footage.
Add wocket and move (jerkily) frame by frame.
VOILA - webounding wocket�
Apr 24, 2016
K-MTG Are you a private investigator?�
Apr 24, 2016
systemcrashed Most likely the video was originally posted using an alias or fake account "bob", that's why once it was reported it was taken down, which forced him to post under his true identity. I was never convinced this was real, too many unanswered questions. The more I watch it the less sense it makes to me how this car was delivered like that. Nevertheless, the truth will be clear about Tesla when we start seeing people take delivery of better cars as the kinks are worked out. I also believe that once something makes it to the internet it's there to stay, this holds true for the origin of the video too�
Apr 24, 2016
proven That's not true. That bakery is still free to deny service to customers who are more trouble than they are worth.�
Apr 24, 2016
Dr ValueSeeker Some people have preserved the video in fear of it being removed. It was originally posted by Bob Navi, IIRC. Keef Wivanef has merely re-uploaded that.Whatever the motive, the video stands on its own. Motive is not important to analyze the video.
It seems, the original owner recorded these for the service center.�
Apr 24, 2016
AnOutsider I've seen plenty of folks here (confirmed owners) who mispell things as well. Not to mention a lot of ASL.�
Apr 24, 2016
EinSV Do you have first-hand knowledge of this? If not, could you please share your basis for asserting that this video is legitimate, as opposed to FUD?
Or could it be the case that you like the video because it supports the argument you made in your December 31, 2015 SeekingAlpha article under the name ValueSeeker -- one of 10 anti-Tesla articles you have authored on SA -- in which you urge readers to join you in shorting Tesla stock based on the rationale that the Model X would be a flop? (See excerpt below)
"So, it was natural for many of the would-be Model X owners to switch their orders to Model S instead. While this will help the Q4 delivery number, it will hurt the Model X sales numbers in the future. Many also simply chose to cancel their reservations to buy some other SUV that actually provides the utility they need. Based on the number and sentiment of posters on TMC forums, it won't be surprising to find out that over 50% of Model X reservations are already cancelled. That will leave only around 15,000 Model X reservations intact. Would it make sense for Tesla to set up a fully automated production line for a run of just 15,000 cars? We will see. My hunch is that Tesla may continue to produce these cars in a trickle to cover up the fact that Model X demand has all but evaporated."�
Apr 24, 2016
sukhi I could not speak to the motives of the poster and not sure we would give the entire benefit of the doubt to Tesla. The issues described in the video are not unique or unheard of. We have had members here report the same issues. Agreed that all of these are not equally severe but these are issues nonetheless.�
Apr 24, 2016
trigoe Yes! Getting popcorn and a big gulp. This thread gets better and better as the crazy fanboys poop themselves scurrying to the rescue.
The video isn't a fake, you can question motives all you like but that stuff happened. Forget the dirt on the seats if you want, all the other stuff, happened. All of it.
I'll just keep my deposit on an X for a long while longer before placing order. I do not mind. I've waited this long, I'll wait another year until it's sorted.
Oh, and I am long TSLA.�
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