Oct 5, 2015
ozweepay I figure this must be a common thing, but I couldn't find any posts about it.
In another thread, there was a guy showing a pic of his MS at a gas pump. I guess this is the opposite.
Would you throw a hissy fit? Or just shake your head and drive away?
---
�
Oct 5, 2015
wdolson I believe the term here is "ICEed". It took me a while to figure out what it meant, but finally figured it out from context. Apparently it can be pretty common at some superchargers.�
Oct 5, 2015
AEdennis Can't see the details on the sign, but in some stalls in some superchargers, ICE vehicles are allowed to park at the SC stalls at certain times.�
Oct 6, 2015
Coiled Yes, it's called ICEing. Plenty of threads on that subject. Some people have posted official-looking notices that you can leave on someone's windshield if you're so inclined.
By the way, I don't think that particular sign is the one that allows general parking for a limited time. It's the exclusive "electric vehicle charging" sign, so definitely a dick move to park there.
I wouldn't make a big deal about it unless there's a good chance that they will be preventing someone from charging, i.e., the supercharger spots are all (or nearly all) occupied.�
Oct 6, 2015
jerry33 The big problem is the signage. Those red signs do not look official. Green sizes with a picture of a car being towed are the official looking ones.�
Oct 6, 2015
Firewired This is our experience at the Lake Charles LA supercharger when we did a road trip from Texas to Florida over the summer. We called the 1800 number listed on the Supercharger and sent them a picture of the extreme ICE condition. They stated they would get with property management. On our return trip all the Superchargers were open. It isn't a convenient walk to the stores so we were thinking it might not be customers, but rather employees of the stores.�
Oct 6, 2015
muleferg Red Neck's Rule!:love:�
Oct 6, 2015
Xenius Would love to run a towing service in that area.�
Oct 6, 2015
muleferg 
The Burlington, NC SC has 30 min general parking. I'm sure it has something to do with the lease at the mall. Sign is not at Charlotte, NC�
Oct 6, 2015
glhs272 Sigh... My road trip this weekend through Wisconsin featured ICE'd superchargers at every one. The worst was this guy, was barely able to squeeze in.
�
Oct 6, 2015
mknox This is a bit of an oldie, but notice that the pickup is actually blocking two stalls. And the guy in the Leaf should just know better...
�
Oct 6, 2015
Electricfan Amazing. I've used the Lake Charles supercharger 6 times this year and never saw a single ICE car blocking a stall. Parking lot was mostly empty every time I've been there. It looks like the parking lot was almost full when you were there, so maybe it was customers who needed a parking place.
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Is this at a hotel? Were most other parking spots taken? Just wondering if the ICE car was just being rude or in desperate need of a parking spot.
This is going to be a problem in parking lots where all spaces are used.�
Oct 6, 2015
JMG Man, those pictures get my blood a boilin!!�
Oct 6, 2015
RiverBrick Looks like the Denver airport location, which is in a hotel lot and is known for mild ICEing. It's near a side-door, so some guests park there even when other spaces are available.
Edit: addition of photo from my Denver visit.
�
Oct 6, 2015
Max* There are SpC's where other cars can park (CT has one), and each time I'm there, there are other cars parked.
I've seen DE get ICEd, but when I pulled up, the guy left.
Nothing you can do, unless they enforce towing.�
Oct 6, 2015
gg_got_a_tesla This could get ugly quickly when contention from Teslas alone increases when the Model 3 comes around.
The truck with trailer above parked across multiple stalls definitely seems to be on purpose (there appear to be empty, non-SC stalls behind). Someone did something similar at Harris Ranch, CA sometime ago and refused to move.�
Oct 6, 2015
e-FTW This is another reason why setting up SCs almost exclusively on land shared with malls and restaurants can be problematic. ICEing will continue, be it by mistake, because of lack of parking spaces or purely out of spite.
I say throw in some rest areas, national parks, natural stopping points with a view along major highways, etc.
My limited experience with SCs in CA and Oregon shows that there are plenty of areas where I would have loved to charge that are not malls.�
Oct 6, 2015
Xenius Another way to get around the ICEing problem, putting these spots at the back of the lot.
People in general are lazy as hell, you're less likely to have the masses taking up EV spots if they're in the back.�
Oct 6, 2015
stevej119 This guy must be aware that we don't have traditional car "keys" in our pockets.�
Oct 6, 2015
taurusking The other day I had to wait for 3 hrs for a person to move his car at Tesla Destination parking at a hotel in Las Colinas, Texas. The hotel could not do anything about it because they did not to whom the car belonged.
Finally this person shows up to take his car.
I approached him and told him I was waiting for 3 hrs for him to move the car and he said he did not know what those parking signs meant..???
I don't know how difficult it is to read "Tesla Parking" sign�
Oct 6, 2015
sorka Looks like there's plenty of room on the back side. I'd have no qualms about driving on that grass and reaching the cable from the other side.
On the other two parking lot examples, chargers that require pulling front in rather than backing in can be used if you block two ICE cars by backing up the it perpendicular to the ICE cars.
Basically reach the cable any way you can.
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They have this thing called a tow truck.�
Oct 6, 2015
e-FTW Also, this reminds me I need to start a contest thread for the first time a Model X with a trailer blocks other supercharger stalls. Especially the new ones configured to allow pulling in and out forwards, like the Petaluma one... Sorry, slightly off-topic, but we should be the last ones to block stalls. And it has happened with Model S.
We should have a name for the X plus trailer combo blocking a stall...
Back to your regular programming!�
Oct 6, 2015
BerTX The preferred location has a place for food and drink and restrooms. I'm sure eventually the parks and such will get destination chargers, but most are probably too far off the highway travel routes to be practical Supercharger locations.
This is definitely a good solution, although there are sometimes issues where getting the power to those locations involve significant extra cost. Also, the early sales pitch on the Supercharger siting was probably increased traffic to businesses, so the business wanted it closer to their doors.
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I'll do this when I get my MX. But only when it is not busy and I can stay with the vehicle.�
Oct 6, 2015
Footbag Not a supercharger, but at our Ikea that now has EV chargers installed, this car was spotted trying to 'get in on the fun'.
The is no indication that the charger/plug was damaged from the heat of his engine, but that is certainly a fear of this type of behavior.�
Oct 6, 2015
AntronX ^ Wow, this takes the gold.
Tesla needs to offer 20' supercharger extension cords.�
Oct 6, 2015
Nevek Burlington, WA this past August. Got all 8, fortunately they moved after we inquired at the hotel front desk. They were apologetic, but there were other spots they could have parked.�
Oct 6, 2015
JohnSnowNW Honda is kind of asking for someone to disconnect the battery cable, for the Lulz.�
Oct 6, 2015
e-FTW How about rest stops along highways? Those are everywhere, and they have bathrooms, which we have all used. And they often have a snack/coffee stand and local tourist information.
I stopped at plenty of those on our recent road trip (in an ICE) to stretch my legs, and did not care to go in town for an actual meal. Stopping at rest areas every two hours or less is standard fare for us, and we would stay about 20 minutes. Had we been supercharging at the same time, it would have been perfect!
Rest area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia�
Oct 6, 2015
DougH I think the bigger problem is stupidity.
I do love the Tesla T in the parking spots, I have not seen that before.�
Oct 6, 2015
JanetM Wow, the trucks and uHauls parking across all the stalls. That's pretty bold. The Honda just made me laugh!
I agree the SC stalls and other charging stations should be out-of-the-way to reduce temptation to park there. Also, it doesn't promote goodwill between ICE drivers and EVs when EVs get premier parking... it probably reinforces certain stereotypes, like EV owners feeling superior or entitled.�
Oct 6, 2015
AEdennis Wait... We aren't superior or entitled? [emoji12]�
Oct 6, 2015
mknox Well, yes... but the reason these stations are usually "front and center" is because that is closer to the building and hence closer to the building's electrical supply. Running cabling can be the most expensive part of installing charging stations.�
Oct 6, 2015
JanetM This also makes sense. No easy solutions, I guess. Maybe eventually, as EVs become more and more common, people will be more accepting/educated and behave themselves. If a non-handicapped person parks in a marked spot, citizens are sometimes openly disapproving - which makes it much less appealing to sneak in there. Maybe soon we'll see this positive type of peer pressure begin to emerge from the public in general, in behalf of EV owners?
Our most local SC, San Marcos, puts the stalls reasonably close to the building, but in a back parking lot behind the mall. It's not inconvenient, but definitely doesn't feel privileged either. I think it's a good balance where possible to employ.�
Oct 6, 2015
yo mama Shhhh. It's probably best that we not say that out loud.
Seriously, though - some of these ICE parkers have some balls. I've honestly only used SCs a few times and each time they were pretty empty because they were in remote locations of the parking lot. I did, however, like how virtually everyTesla owner give each other a little nod of acknowledgement - akin to people who don't know each other personally but are members of the same national fraternity.�
Oct 6, 2015
Atlantis I wonder what people would think if some future Model X owner would park its car and its trailer right in front of a gas station spots...?�
Oct 6, 2015
e-FTW And that would be the right way to do it. You would also have to watch for paired stalls so that other Tesla may charge at full speed.�
Oct 6, 2015
taurusking Since it was a Tesla destination charging...I thought it was up to the hotel.
The hotel front desk did not want to do anything about moving the other truck...
What a bummer !�
Oct 6, 2015
wdolson Here on the West Coast it's inconceivable anyone has not heard of Tesla (I've yet to run into anyone who hasn't, and 90% of those who have want one). But I was in a thread with someone else from Texas a few weeks ago who said people are always approaching his car wondering what it is. Based on that conversation, I'm not too surprised there are some people in the US who don't know what a Tesla is and don't understand what the signs and SCs are about. However, if I encountered something in a parking lot I didn't understand and a sign saying the spot was reserved for something other than some category I fit, I would not park there unless there were no other spots.�
Oct 6, 2015
green1 Tesla could very easily go a long way towards fixing this problem, they just need to replace those ridiculous and completely useless red signs with the appropriate no parking except for EV charging signs, with a picture of a tow truck at the bottom, and then start towing.
People won't make the same mistake again.�
Oct 6, 2015
Schmidty This. Many of the pics of ICE'd superchargers actually have signs allowing ICE cars to park their for 30 minutes, so often no "crime" has been committed.
�
Oct 6, 2015
BrianC Couple quick things that always bother me with these threads
1) DO NOT TOUCH OTHER PEOPLES CARS! This is a great way to meet the wrong person and the police get involved with the aftermath of what breaks out.
2) If you dont own the parking lot and the place that does own it does nothing, you have no right to do anything.
3) TELSA needs to start getting some ad money going and letting people know what superchargers and the vehicles they make are. My parents still have no idea how great these cars are after about a few dozen times explaining to them.
4) DO NOT TOUCH OTHER PEOPLES CARS�
Oct 6, 2015
jeffro01 I say key their cars and slash their tires, that'll show 'em...
Seriously though, you're going to have people who park there intentionally because they think it's some sort of hilarious game or they want to stick to "rich" people. I know a few people like that who brag about parking in EV stalls... I had an argument with a BMW owner in March at a garage in Oakland where he was about to park his BMW in a clearly marked EV stall only me behind him I honked furiously and pointed at the sign before he got the gist and moved (our Volt which needed a charge to make it back home without using gas), only to come back and ask me what my problem was pointing out that I had a gas engine so I didn't need to charge so what's it matter? I was less than polite in my response, I'll just leave it at that...
The long term solution to this problem is legislation that makes it easier for people to be towed, at their expense, for parking in EV designated spaces. I believe a few states already have such laws, and then enforce them. I can promise you that no level of ideology or seriously misplaced humor will return once someone pays to get their car back...
Jeff�
Oct 6, 2015
artsci Believe it or not Delanman told me he saw some kids put the Supercharger plug into their gas tank, thinking it was a gas pump. Stupid? Out to lunch may be a better description.
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Easy to say but Tesla does not control these spaces -- the property owner does. Tesla has no legal right to enforcement. Every supercharger location requires a deal with the property holder, some much better than others.�
Oct 6, 2015
sorka Right, they said they couldn't do anything about but i guess that's because they didn't *want* to do anything about since they could have had it towed.�
Oct 6, 2015
Electricfan The only hotel I've charged at had an orange cone blocking the spot. Maybe suggest that for future use. I guess a bold ICE owner would move it anyway, but at least its putting them to a little more trouble, and they can't claim innocence so easily. "Oh, I didn't know I couldn't move that orange cone..." doesn't work so well.�
Oct 6, 2015
ozweepay I want traffic spikes on every SC stall that lower when you press a button on your MS console.
Then I want a Supercharging snake to automatically start charging my car without my having to manually insert the plug.
And then I want a cookie. Chocolate chip, preferably.�
Oct 6, 2015
green1 And yet Tesla arranges with the property owner to put up signs that mean absolutely nothing, when I bet every single one of them would have accepted a useful no parking sign in place of the red one that nobody honours because it has no meaning.
This isn't property owners blocking Tesla from doing the right thing, this is Tesla being stupid and intentionally using useless signs.
They may not be able to deal with towing, but they can absolutely put up no parking signs.�
Oct 6, 2015
wdolson I don't think spikes would be necessary, but some kind of barrier that could only be lowered by a car equipped for supercharging would go a long ways towards preventing this problem. It could be done with a firmware upgrade, though to do it well would probably require new hardware on the car.
As for the snake, I posted a while back that I think Tesla is thinking about that technology for a Supercharger upgrade at some point in the future.�
Oct 6, 2015
artsci I met totally by chance at the Indpendence, MO supercharger on my cross-country drive the contractor who does the supercharger installations nationwide for Tesla. While it's easy to assume that Tesla controls what signs get posted and facile to accuse then of being stupid, that's not the situation. Based on what the contractor told me the property owner makes that determination based on what it's willing to enforce. That's why the signage varies from place to place, as does the configuration of the superchargers themselves. On the cross country trip I saw many different and sometimes odd supercharger configurations and signage that varied from threats to tow for illegal parkers and the familiar 30 minute warning.�
Oct 6, 2015
AlanSqB I'm voting for "X'd out."�
Oct 6, 2015
nbbody Most of the superchargers I have seen have had their own service drop and transformer, with the exception of one at a mall in Bethesda. In those cases, the gear was fairly close to the utility poles. Distance from the secondary side of transformer to inverters is a lot more important than primary side, because of voltage drop.�
Oct 6, 2015
smartypnz Problem with installing at rest areas is the availability of that kind of power. Shopping malls are much easier.�
Oct 6, 2015
e-FTW Yes, I know. But one can only wonder, since it seems like such a good fit. Maybe a solar plus power wall setup? Lots of power walls...�
Oct 7, 2015
ozweepay Is it known what the contract is for Tesla and the property owner? How does Tesla pitch the idea to them?
"You will get a lot of high net worth people stopping in for a coffee, snack, or other purchase, plus exposure for your brand, for approx 40 mins as they pass through."
??�
Oct 7, 2015
wdolson The pitch probably is something like that. For retailers and restaurants, it's a captive audience. Unlike with ICE where people stop for 10 minutes, it takes longer to refuel a Tesla, so having something for people to do while charging is good for business.�
Oct 7, 2015
mknox Yes. I was referring to Level 2 stations in that comment. Although there is one Supercharger location that I frequent and it is right up front and center by a hotel entrance. It was constantly getting ICE'd. It ended up costing Tesla more in utility fees to locate it there, because utility power was closer to the far end of the parking lot, but the property owner wanted it right up front. Kind of a shame, because the other end of the lot is always free of cars, and is a closer walk to some of the other nearby amenities. I guess the property owner wanted users to come to his restaurant in the hotel and not the others nearby.
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At some locations, Tesla has been adding this sign below the somewhat confusing Tesla one:
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Oct 7, 2015
ggr We already have a term for this: ICEing. And we already have a very extensive thread, making pretty much everything above just a rehash of what has gone before. Merge?�
Oct 7, 2015
JenniferQ I may have some insight on this: Back in Austin, at a hospital parking lot, there were a lot of EV spots up front but i did not see chargers there and there truly are very few EV cars in Texas, or were then anyway. So, everyone parked in them, but especially BIG trucks, Suburbans, etc. I think they also said something like EV/Carpool parking or something. So it really did look like "preferred" parking spots rather than necessity spots. I'll have to take a look next time I'm back and see if there were actually any chargers there, because if so, they were always ICEd by monster trucks.�
Oct 7, 2015
TexasEV Those preferred parking spots for EVs are to get the building LEED points for being "green". The program is worse than useless-- it actually does a disservice by contributing to the image of EV owners being entitled. It's really unlikely anyone would buy an EV to get a better parking space. What we want are charging spaces, and we don't mind walking from a distant part of the parking lot to have them. LEED points should be given for providing EV charging, not preferred parking.�
Oct 7, 2015
green1 Honestly it should REPLACE the red one, but at least that's the right sign to have there. I just wish they'd put them everywhere.�
Oct 7, 2015
yo mama Eh, one of the many reasons I went Tesla was because of the single-driver carpool eligibility here in California. The preferred parking/charging spots sort of factored into that part of the decision. While not a driving factor it was something of a "plus" factor. Good parking is hard to find at Whole Foods!
�
Oct 7, 2015
AEdennis Ditto to @yo mama... At least with our first EV (the BMW Active E) but getting involved in the rEVolution made me accidentally environmental... Thus the title of my blog...
But, solo HOV access and good parking/charging spots is the "gateway" drug to a cleaner lifestyle.�
Oct 7, 2015
hsctiger93 There's a positive flip-side to getting ICE'd.
Last Black Friday, on our way home from Jupiter Island, FL we stopped at the St. Augustine outlet supercharger to find not only orange cones blocking off all the supercharger spaces for Tesla, but a parking attendant present to keep an eye on the cars trying to move those cones. Hardly a space to find at the outlets that day... except for the spots at the Supercharger. It was a very kind gesture from mall management to do this. We got in, charged, ate, spent, then got out very easily.�
Oct 7, 2015
muleferg The Ugly Dog in Highlands NC. Drove by this place 8 times and did not see the charger. 3 ICE, i garbage can, And and a conifer blocking it.Didn't need a charge since i was staying at the Old Edwards Inn next door.
�
Oct 7, 2015
MikeS85D Me too. I'm still waiting for my white HOV stickers to arrive in the mail maybe today... I wonder how long the HOV lanes will be a useful perk though - Often on I-85 the HOV lane is just as busy as the regular lanes, mainly filled with EVs and hybrids rather than actual "high occupancy" drivers.�
Oct 7, 2015
BerTX The point and problem is, the property owner does not WANT the parking slots to be unavailable to non-Teslas. If they did, there would be signage to try to prevent it.
Tesla needs to avoid locating in places with these constraints.�
Oct 7, 2015
Max* That's not always possible. If the choice is have a SpC at a rest area on a highway but have to share the parking space with ICE cars, or move the SpC 10s of miles out of the way, I'm 100% happy to share my spot with other vehicles.�
Oct 7, 2015
muleferg The SC in Burlington, NC that has the 30 min general parking, I have been there several times and never seen it be iced. I have never seen more than 2 Tesla. One good thing it's way back where its to long for people to walk to the movie.
�
Oct 7, 2015
marcad80 Print, Cut and Distribute, have left a few myself.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=7&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CEQQFjAGahUKEwjs2bXxpbHIAhXIaz4KHRSMDog&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.blinknetwork.com%2Ffile%2F7741%2FBlink%2BCourtesy%2BNotices.pdf&usg=AFQjCNH8qP1da7GcVxeyN9Ue8MTU25fI0A
Enjoy!�
Oct 7, 2015
yo mama I got my decals and "registration" a week or so ago. I just can't bring myself to blemish the otherwise perfect body of my P85D - it's like putting a crappy tattoo on a beautiful person. I'm sorta of curious what the worst punishment possible is for driving in the HOV land without the stickers on, assuming the vehicle is otherwise authorized to use them.�
Oct 7, 2015
William13 I believe a study should be done by Tesla to determine what works best to prevent ICEing. My observations: 1)Parking garages using green cones are never ICEd (theft of cones in open lots make this impractical ? ), 2)Green paint on the asphalt seems to work well, 3)multiple types of signs are used (efficacy should be monitored to see which work best).
I believe the green paint on the asphalt is needed. Full coverage.�
Oct 7, 2015
green1 Around here paint is pointless, not visible for half the year and wears out quickly. Signs are the important part.�
Oct 7, 2015
CSFTN
I am not aware of "preferred parking/charging spots." That smacks of elitism to me. Rather, there are facilities whose purpose is not to provide us with a special parking spot, but rather to enable the longer distance drives. Spots for charging are spots for charging, not parking.�
Oct 7, 2015
AEdennis When charging at Level 2 speeds... You're effectively parked there for a LONG time. At 30A, how many miles can you add at 30 minutes of charging?
Just saying...�
Oct 7, 2015
Panoz Every page of this thread is a surprise. The UHauls with trailers parking the long way across charging spots take the cake.�
Oct 7, 2015
yo mama Here in Hippieville, California places like Whole Foods put their EV charging/parking in the premium spots right up front. Very clear signage and people are mostly respectful. EVs are allowed to park there even if they aren't charging, plus they also have preferred "EV only" parking spots that *don't* have charging stations next to them. It's like preferred parking for expectant moms and/or "handicap" parking (or whatever the PC term is for those spots). I'm not sure I'd call it "elitism" but there is clearly an effort to encourage EV behavior from a social standpoint.�
Oct 7, 2015
Sasmania While this is definitely a problem when it happens to us individually, I have to say it's much more the exception than the norm. I just finished my trip where I hit 200 SuperChargers....
90% of the time I was the ONLY car, Tesla or otherwise
about 9% of the time there were a couple of other Teslas and no ICING
Maybe 2 times were SC's ICED and in both cases there were still plenty of open slots.
Only once, in CA of course, did I have to wait for an SC (about 15 minutes) but that was due to full Tesla usage.
One key is for Tesla to NOT take the prime spots...which in most cases they don't and this solves 95% of the ICING.�
Oct 7, 2015
brucet999 200 SuperChargers! at 100 mi apart, that's a 20,000 mile trip.
I am more than impressed!�
Oct 7, 2015
ozweepay To contrast, I've been to a SC only once in my life, and the only car there was a Kia. So 100% ICEing for me so far.�
Oct 8, 2015
Max* His margin of error is much smaller than yours
I know you were joking�
Oct 8, 2015
robertvg Model XXX ?�
Oct 10, 2015
smartypnz Wow - not long ago I considered a Smart Car as a second 'around town' vehicle. Not once did I think it may make me 'Elitist'.�
Oct 11, 2015
muleferg New Sign's at Burlington NC. 4 stations have the new sign.
�
Oct 11, 2015
William13 This signage at Burlington makes the most sense. It is likely the most effective.�
Oct 11, 2015
Andyw2100 Any idea why the new signs would be placed in just four of the stalls? Do you think it was a shortage of signs, or are they somehow trying to differentiate the stalls? I'm really not sure how the lack of the extra sign changes anything, so adding the sign to only some of the stalls seems odd.�
Oct 11, 2015
TexasEV It's likely due to the terms of the lease with the shopping center. At many superchargers some of the stalls are marked for exclusive use of supercharging and some allow a specified amount of time for "general parking" (usually 30 or 60 min.). When you arrive at one of these stations I recommend using a stall with the general parking sign. That keeps the supercharger spaces marked for exclusive use open for the next arrival, otherwise the general spaces may fill up with ICEs and the next Model S may have to wait.�
Oct 11, 2015
Andyw2100 I was aware of the necessity to allow other car parking at some locations. I just didn't see how the addition of the second sign changed anything. But looking at the photo more closely, it looks like the signs that have the second sign added, that say "Tesla Vehicle Charging Only" are, in fact, different from the signs that don't have that second sign added. So you are probably correct that the stalls with one sign are less exclusive.�
Oct 11, 2015
gnelson I stopped a a Cracker Barrel i S Pittsburg, TN. A huge blue Ford Truck was parked in front of the Blink charger. I was able to park in the adjacent space and the cable barely reached. When I finished lunch the truck was still there. I wrote a note an left it on his windshield: I am sorry that you are eat up with the dumb a$$ and haven't realized that a Ford truck is not an electric vehicle.�
Oct 11, 2015
Andyw2100 That note is really telling 'em!�
Oct 11, 2015
CHG-ON A great invitation for four flat tires, IMO. It's like those jerks that park in handicapped spaces, though not quite a egregious. Reminds me of when idiots would take two spaces to avoid door dings in LA in the 90's and come out to see their car keyed. Absolutely not the right answer, but they are asking for it.�
Oct 11, 2015
Andyw2100 You think blocking a charging spot is less of an issue than parking in a handicapped spot? I'd have to disagree.
There is at least some chance the offending driver didn't realize what he or she was doing by blocking a charging spot. There is really no chance that someone parking in a handicapped spot isn't aware that what he or she is doing is wrong. I think that's the more offensive act.�
Oct 11, 2015
MorrisonHiker Does it snow where you live? I accidentally parked in a handicapped spot once when visiting a convenience store during a snow storm. The lot was covered in fresh snow and there was no sign indicating the spot was a handicapped space. Luckily I was only there for a minute and only noticed the blue paint on the pavement when I backed out of the spot as my tires cleared a path in the snow. I'm just saying that sometimes one can honestly make a mistake and park in a handicapped spot without knowing it is a handicapped spot, especially if there are no signs present.
With all the signs and the charging equipment around EV spots, I really don't see how someone could claim innocence. More than likely, they know that there is no punishment or fine in most jurisdictions so they go ahead and park there.
I just saw this picture today:
�
Oct 11, 2015
andrewket ^^ this. I always take a general parking space over a reserved space if possible.�
Oct 11, 2015
Andyw2100 It does snow where I live.
I wasn't really commenting on an innocent mistake, where someone just doesn't see a handicapped symbol, or the EV parking sign. We've definitely read in the ICE-ing threads of people saying they didn't know what the signs meant, etc. I'm more willing to believe that than that someone didn't know what a handicapped symbol meant if they did see it, that's all. Neither are good.�
Oct 11, 2015
Chuq This style of SC is handy for when all stalls are ICEd:
Picture above is of a temporary SC in Euroa, Australia.�
Oct 11, 2015
green1 Great for dealing with ICE, poor for dealing with snow...
Much easier to get a snowplow through a parking lot if there's no charger stands in the way.�
Oct 11, 2015
wdolson When I was about 12 or 13, my mother was driving in a parking lot, just after turning a corner, we heard a big bang under the hood and she started panicking because the steering had completely gone out. Fortunately the car was perfectly straight and a handicapped spot was directly in front of us. She was flapping in panic and I told her to park in the handicapped spot. She was horrified at the thought and said "but I'm not handicapped!" I responded "but the car is!"
We parking in the spot long enough for a tow truck to collect the car and tow it to our mechanic. The power steering unit split open completely disabling the steering, the mechanic said he hadn't seen it before. We were very fortunate it happened in a parking lot and there was a handicapped spot we could pull into. It could have been a lot worse.�
Oct 12, 2015
smartypnz
Wow!! First thought was 'Cheap Gas!!!' till I realized it's not per gallon.�
Oct 12, 2015
ozweepay Why are SC cables so short?
Because of high voltage/amperage used?�
Oct 12, 2015
MorrisonHiker Someone once asked Abraham Lincoln "How long should a man's legs be in proportion to his body?" Lincoln replied "I have not given the matter much consideration, but on first blush I should judge they ought to be long enough to reach from his body to the ground."
I think the same could be said for Superchargers. The cable only needs to be long enough to reach from the Supercharger to the car parked in the designated space. :wink:�
Oct 12, 2015
green1 Exactly. To make them longer you'd also have to make them significantly thicker and then they'd be a real pain to handle.�
Oct 12, 2015
ozweepay But this often requires you to back in, yes?
I've been to a SC only once and didn't back in far enough for the cable to reach, so had to inch back some more. I remember wondering why the cable was so short...
I think one advantage of short cable is just neatness: won't end up coiled on the ground, getting run over. My longer cable at home often looks messy lying on the garage floor.�
Oct 12, 2015
SherSlick That supercharger seems to ALWAYS have at least one spot ICE'd. (Denver @Airport) One time I was there and it had the shuttle from the hotel parked across two stalls.
I call Tesla and send them a picture each time. Not sure if that really DOES anything but at least then the mothership knows...�
Oct 12, 2015
wdolson DC does not travel as well as AC does. The simplistic answer back in the day of Edison (who favored DC power) vs Nikola Tesla (who invented AC) was DC fell off the line going around corners. It isn't quite that way, but you want DC runs to be as short as possible.�
Oct 12, 2015
gjunky It would be nice if Tesla installed those raising posts and make them Tesla Aware and only open when a Tesla is near (I am sure they have some way of knowing). ICE problem solved.
They could even combine it with the Homelink system and let you open a/all spots from the dash.�
Oct 12, 2015
yo mama Or snipers. That could also work.�
Oct 12, 2015
TexasEV I would have called the hotel too, and posted a "review" about them on Trip Advisor. I guarantee that by the next day the manager would have posted an apology and the driver wouldn't do that again.�
Oct 12, 2015
Soolim Really? from elementary circuit study, DC is affected only by resistance, while AC is affected by resistance, inductance, and capacitance. Why would DC not travel an extra few feet?�
Oct 12, 2015
wdolson The real problem with DC is you are mostly stuck with the voltage you start with, there are ways to do DC to DC conversion, but it's more complex than it is for AC. With AC, all you need is a transformer to step the voltage up or down. The higher the current and the lower the voltage, the higher the power losses. Long distance power lines are usually 400,000 V to get the current down as low as possible. Then at the destination, it is run through a transformer and stepped down to a safer voltage.
I don't know the resistance of the supercharger cables, but there has been talk about how hot they get and some of the newest ones have liquid cooling. That is due to lost energy from resistance in the cables. All that current going through there means even with the extremely low resistance of copper, the losses are still going to be high enough to make the cable very hot. A longer cable means more resistance which means more heating.�
Oct 12, 2015
Soolim Your explanation of AC voltage for transmission is correct. The AC voltage has no relevance to the SC cable being short. Output from the supercharger is DC which I assumed you know very well.�
Oct 12, 2015
stevezzzz The Silverthorne CO superchargers were located in a rarely used overflow lot at an outlet mall; ICEing has never been a problem...
...until now. They built a Starbucks adjacent to the Superchargers with a drive-thru traffic pattern that utilizes the overflow lot. My wife was there charging this week and says that there were ICE cars parked in some of the SpC bays. She took no photos, though.�
Oct 12, 2015
Andyw2100 Not that it's a good situation, but if the chargers are only being ICEd by cars waiting for Starbucks drive-thru, the Tesla drivers who need the stalls shouldn't wind up having to wait very long.�
Oct 12, 2015
stevezzzz Fair point. But to be precise, the drivers of the parked cars aren't waiting for the drive-thru but are inside the store. Still not as bad as waiting for a charging spot ICEd by a hotel guest...�
Oct 12, 2015
Andyw2100 Ah, OK.
You had written that the drive-thru traffic pattern utilized the overflow lot, so I thought it was just people from the drive-thru, waiting while their drinks were prepared.
In any case, as you suggest, still better than people off shopping, or in a hotel or something.�
Oct 12, 2015
Jabushey Two of four chargers ICED in Duluth, MN last Thursday evening. I mentioned it to the Holiday Inn front desk and they seemed concerned and said they would take care of it. Still there after a range charge, sooooo....
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Oct 12, 2015
MrClown Half the spots, the ones closest to Starbucks, have signs that allow general short term parking. I was in 2A and came back to an ICE in 1A next to me. I was mildly annoyed until I noticed the signs. They also left about 5 minutes later.�
Oct 12, 2015
rickgt This is poetic justice.... wish they all were like this. box in an ICE car, and they will think twice next time...
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Oct 12, 2015
wdolson I know it's DC.�
Oct 13, 2015
JamesPolk Rest areas, national parks, and scenic areas are all public areas funded by the public. No supercharger should be there and the public shouldn't and wouldn't allow it (for good reason).
Just need to find locations where the spots aren't convenient for ICEing. Malls will fill up and people aren't going to give a crap if they need a spot to park to leave it open so Teslas can charge up their S/III/X. Tesla needs to plan better and have partnering businesses enforce the spots.�
Oct 13, 2015
luvnMyTS If you can afford it, get some wheel dollies for about $50 per set. An aluminum quick pump jack. If there's an ice car parked in a Supercharger stall that's clearly marked "tesla parking only", jack that piece of crap up, slide the wheel dollies underneath the tires and roll the car out of the way. Me personally, it would be worth the $50 to just leave the Ice car on them and let the owner figure out how to get the car off of them.
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