May 31, 2016
HiTech With Mr. Dahn (forgetting first name) joining Tesla's efforts to improved battery technology, how does this impact the current plans, as well as GigaFactory infrastructure (i.e. if a new tech is researched, using different chemistry, how would this impact the GF in terms of ability to modify itself, and costs involved to do so)?
(not sure they would really answer this, but would love to hear something about what their plans are with Mr. Dahn joining the team)�
May 31, 2016
neroden The communications issue is crucial for the company, but I frankly don't believe they can give a useful answer to it. :-( If it's fixed it's fixed. If it's not fixed nothing they *say* can provide evidence that they've fixed it -- after all, the board could assure us that they're totally on top of the communications issues, and then there could be a major communications failure between the board and the next layer of executives. :-(�
May 31, 2016
neroden One more, though again I don't really expect useful answers:
"The Tesla Model S software has introduced new bugs and new failure modes in over-the-air software updates, breaking things which were previously working. What is being done to change your software development model to prevent this sort of regression from happening in the future?"�
May 31, 2016
DaveT Update sent to Tesla IR. They said they'll try to weave in a few of these questions.�
May 31, 2016
SW2Fiddler Thanks for your efforts Dave!�
May 31, 2016
Fallenone Thanks a lot for doing this Dave. Am I too greedy to think this interaction between Tesla IR, you, and TMC means Tesla is picking up on communication?�
May 31, 2016
tinm I am a small bit hopeful, but not too, given that what, only six maybe seven people upvoted (and one person effing downvoted) my submission in this thread the other day, that someone will ask a meaningful question regarding the status, 2016/2017 strategy, and prospects regarding Tesla's fight against the states that currently ban or partially ban Tesla from sales and/or service.
No disrespect, but Californians, who bask in the neon glow of umpteen-gazillion superchargers, Tesla stores, and service centers from one end of the state to the other, are the probably the worst people to decide whether such a question is put before Elon Musk today. And yet I fear it is Californians -- who don't know what it is like to live in a state that flat-out bans Tesla and how that means a customer has no recourse but to have to schedule, far in advance, a Tesla Ranger to drive 8-12 hours from the Tesla service center in another state already beleaguered by its own customer demand, load the car on a flat-bed trailer, and drive 8-12 hours back to the service center, just to get service -- Californians who are going to decide what is cool and hip to ask the CEO and Chairman of the Board today.
I hope I am wrong, I really do. After last year's debacle of fan-boy questions, I really am not in the mood to hear "when will Model Y come out" and "will Model 3 have a HUD" questions today when there are customers (many of whom are SHAREHOLDERS and many of whom have also ordered Model 3) who deal with the hassle of corrupt state legislatures and stupid anti-competitive laws every single day, and need RESOLUTION to this longstanding issue especially before the onslaught of the accelerated Model 3 roll-out.�
May 31, 2016
Johan Thanks for the effort @DaveT!�
May 31, 2016
Skotty Ask about the rumors that Tesla is considering partnering with additional battery manufacturers other than just Panasonic.�
May 31, 2016
SW2Fiddler Amen from TX, @tinm
However there may be an aspect of not wanting to "tip our hand" regarding plans that may be in the works to challenge (or Bully Trap) these established law-dealership-lawmaker-law "money-for-legislation" feedback loops.�
May 31, 2016
Haxster Is there any truth to the rumor that Mr. Musk will be late to the shareholders meeting because the Model X he was driving ran out of charge?
�
May 31, 2016
azaz hi will the meeting be streamed live?�
May 31, 2016
Johan Are you pulling our leg or did you hear this, and if so from who?
Or maybe the GPS directed him to some other computer museum?�
May 31, 2016
DaveT Yes, it will be live-streamed here,
2016 Shareholder Meeting | Tesla Motors�
May 31, 2016
Model 3 Are there any youtube mirrors on this? All I get is "Video could not be loaded or timed out".�
May 31, 2016
Haxster The leg. The leg. My attempt at humor. Sorry.�
May 31, 2016
W84M3 Same for me�
May 31, 2016
FlatSix911 Screen shots from the somewhat lengthy presentation ... Tesla Company History milestones
�
May 31, 2016
FlatSix911 
�
May 31, 2016
ggies07 I had to leave right as it started, so I just went back to the page and I thought they would have the video up, but they don't....anyone have it by chance?�
May 31, 2016
Haxster Of all the suggested questions from this thread, none were presented at the shareholders meeting.
It was a lengthy (but engaging) presentation covering the history of the company followed by a few financials and Q&A from only the local attendees. Some of the questions addressed topics on this thread...but not many.�
May 31, 2016
DaveT Tesla IR let me know that they reviewed the most popular questions from this thread with Elon before the meeting and that he addressed many of the questions in his prepared remarks.�
May 31, 2016
dennis Well I guess 1 out of the top 5 reported by Electrek ain't bad... Musk said there was the potential to triple the output of the Gigafactory vs. what was initially planned, although it was unclear if that was the 35gW of cells or the 50gW of packs that could be tripled. None of the other 4 top questions were addressed at all in the prepared remarks. I left early in the Q&A because I found the questioners soap boxes way too big.�
May 31, 2016
mkjayakumar Questions have to be screened going forward. This need not be a love fest for Elon.
And some of the questions were outright juvenile and silly. Except one general question and a vague answer, we did not learn any details about Tesla Energy current orders and revenue.�
May 31, 2016
ecarfan They may not post the video until tomorrow.�
May 31, 2016
ecarfan I was at the shareholder's meeting, seated right next to a microphone, but decided not to ask my question because Elon essentially answered it during his presentation, when he revealed that the Gigafactory output when completed may be up to triple his initially stated estimate, and that the production mix of car batters vs. stationary storage batteries would likely be more like 50/59 instead of 70/30. I was impressed to hear that.�
May 31, 2016
EinSV Elon's 50/50 estimate for future Tesla Energy/Tesla Automotive revenue provided a more than satisfactory answer to my question:
I think several other questions were also answered at a level Tesla was comfortable with and would not reveal competitively sensitive info.�
May 31, 2016
Yggdrasill My question was answered in the 2.5 hour long speech. Initial cell production will be the new 20700-format.
I think that's good news, it pretty much confirms that the 20700-format cell production at the Gigafactory will ramp up well ahead of Model 3 launch, so the new and improved Model 3 battery pack should be ready. The battery format gives Tesla an additional advantage over the other car makers who are currently using, or intend to use 18650-cells.
It also indicates that Tesla is probably going to incorporate the 20700-format into other products fairly quickly. Even assuming cell production starts December 31st, that's 2-3 quarters of 20700-format production that needs to be put to use in products other than the Model 3. Maybe the 100 kWh S/X pack might use them.�
May 31, 2016
neroden OK, so I haven't gone through the whole three-hour presentation, but it seems they didn't say anything about service center expansion?�
Jun 1, 2016
Benz Well, Elon clarified that a package will be required for having Supercharger capability with the Tesla Model 3.�
Jun 1, 2016
davecolene0606 Very low servicing requirements are a key value component of an EV. Tesla's stated principle of service not being a "profit center" reconciles with this value component. Is Model III being designed with this specifically in mind to reduce the need for servicing requirements and thus the capital and operational expenditures for additional service centers?
Follow up:
Are design improvements of the S & X also targeting reduced service requirements for this same reason?�
Jun 1, 2016
davecolene0606 Rats, out of the county, maybe next year.... Sigh�
Jun 1, 2016
HiTech I ended up spending the 3.5 hrs on the event and made notes on the following Tesla Forum. Feel free to jump on there and add anything I may have missed.
2016 Share Holder Meeting | Tesla Motors�
Jun 1, 2016
Haxster So, what county did you send your rats to...and did they have a good time?�
Jun 1, 2016
tinm Yesterday's meeting had a clear message: we're chumps. This whole exercise was for naught.
If we want our questions answered, we have to ask them. If we want to make sure we get a chance to ask them, we go to the shareholders meeting, in person, in sufficient numbers such that the majority of our questions get through all the filters in place that otherwise, as was abundantly evident yesterday, do a fine job blocking them from getting through.
Otherwise, chumps.�
Jun 1, 2016
ecarfan No, we're not "chumps". I think it very likely that the person that DaveT was in contact with at Tesla genuinely wanted to help and planned to try to get some of the questions posted here asked at the meeting. It didn't happen for reasons that were outside that person's control, of course.
When you have a Q&A format where anyone at the meeting has the opportunity to ask a question, or at least get in line to ask a question, many of the questions are going to personal to that individuals wants and needs and will be poorly thought out and inadequately researched.
Many of the questions were on subjects that have been asked and answered before ("what are the next car models?", answer "sorry we don't discuss future products until we are ready") or questions that a basic Google search would answer ("when will Tesla provide emergency responder info?", answer "we have done that already but here's the most important thing to keep in mind...").
My favorite ridiculous question category is "it was just announced that a major battery breakthrough has occurred that radically increases battery capacity..." and Elon says "that's not true and less than 1% of what you read about new battery breakthroughs is true" (paraphrasing). He's been saying that for a decade and so far he's been correct.
Elon seems to want to keep the open mic format at the shareholder meeting. He remains courteous even in the face of absurd questions or in cases where the person is really just reading a statement to try to make a point and doesn't actually want an answer.
The alternative is for Telsa to only accept questions in advance and select those the wish to answer. Sometimes I think that might be preferable to the current situation, which has a very low signal-to-noise ration.�
Jun 1, 2016
techmaven No, not at all. Of course, my main question was answered, so I'm biased.
However, just because you ask a question doesn't mean they answer it. They reviewed questions and answered what they wanted to answer in the way they wanted to answer. But in essence, we did ask the questions. Much kudos to @DaveT for making this happen.�
Jun 1, 2016
Flight Risk No, I'll still own "my car on the side" a subie BRZ for naughty weekends....�
Jun 1, 2016
Johan Previously I have half in jest but also half seriously suggested the TMC Investors subforum should get together and try to get to ask questions on the conference call. Yes I know it would be sitting at the grownup table but honestly we can come up would just as good, relevant and important questions as some of the analysts. On some calls they've also had questions from financial news reporters from Bloomberg for example, so I'm not sure it's a strict "analysts only" policy. Besides, together we are analysts right?�
Jun 1, 2016
msnow I'm not sure how Tesla does it but most companies quarterly earnings calls are strictly to present financial results and attended by financial analysts only. They usually take place on a conference call. Many take a few questions but they are financially focused. The shareholders meetings are separate in person events for shareholders.�
Jun 1, 2016
Johan Well I did mean that we as a group could come up with financial questions, not product or feature related primarily.�
Jun 1, 2016
AlMc I totally get the difference and I know that some people are concerned with teeshirts, job opportunities and asking 'where's my bike dude' at the wrong meeting....But I agree with Johan...we could get better questions, in general, and financial ones specifically.�
Jun 1, 2016
slcasner
Are there any other manufacturers considering 18650 cells (or any cylindrical cells) rather than larger-format prismatic cells? What I've heard and read is that all the other manufacturers consider Tesla to be crazy for using cylindrical cells, and that it only made sense as a means to bootstrap into using lithium-ion as an automotive battery by starting from an existing commodity component. Martin Eberhard emphasized the idea of using commodity cells in the original Tesla business plan. JB made clear in the presentation that he and the battery team consider the 20700 cell to be optimal after considering tradeoffs.�
Jun 1, 2016
SW2Fiddler "The next question is from Al McJohan of the research firm Morecow, Bellestake & Szizel..."�
Jun 1, 2016
davecolene0606 Peru, where the X windshield factory is, on second thought they have plenty, so I shoulda said "Shucks"�
Jun 1, 2016
GoTslaGo Thought that was "Morecowbells..."�
Jun 1, 2016
Johan read it again, in one long coherent read�
Jun 1, 2016
GoTslaGo Got it now! Thanks!�
Jun 1, 2016
techmaven Audi.
Audi Pioneering New EV Battery Technology - Gas 2�
Jun 1, 2016
AlMc Yeah....what ^^he said^^�
Jun 1, 2016
Yggdrasill Faraday Future appeared to be using cylindrical cells for their battery pack design. You also have these guys: Kreisel starts construction of new 800MWh battery factory for high energy density packs for EVs
I'm pretty sure I've seen others as well.�
Jun 1, 2016
slcasner Thanks. That article says the module could contain cylindrical, prismatic or pouch cells, but the rest of the text implies that cylindrical cells are not preferred. Quoting: "Audi says, 'Pouch cells and prismatic cells are more versatile. With minor changes to their exterior dimensions, they can be configured specifically for maximum power output, maximum energy or a combination of both, making them ideal for a plug-in hybrid vehicle.'"
Thanks for the additional examples. I guess what I've heard in the past relates primarily to the major auto manufacturers.�
Jun 1, 2016
techmaven Yeah, reportedly the Audi R8 e-tron has cylindrical cells and possibly the Q6 e-tron too. Obviously BEVs favor maximum specific energy and PHEVs usually favor maximum power density.�
Jun 2, 2016
electracity It shows the legacy burden of established manufacturers, doesn't it? The battery people have to plan for all sorts of contingencies from their bosses. "Maybe PHEV dominates the next decade". "Maybe simple 48v HEV becomes standard". The flexibility in cell manufacturing architecture likely increases BEV cost to traditional manufacturers. Plus it may be more problematic to provide low C rate in a battery shape agnostic design.
The Germans probably don't need to worry about cost too much for their first high end BEVs. But they don't seem well positioned to bring high performance to mid priced cars.�
Jun 2, 2016
slcasner By the way, I hope you don't begrudge me the question about Roadster 3.0. If you take a gander over at the Roadster sub-forum you'll see that we are having trouble getting any information about the rate and scheduling of upgrades or the other components of the original 3.0 upgrade plan other than the battery.�
Jun 2, 2016
Johan Not at all. The shareholder's meeting is, as per Tesla's format, a kind of free-for-all open Q&A.
What I was thinking was if there was a way for enthusiast investors to get together and, by an appointed representative, ask financially and stock related questions on the conference calls.�
Jun 9, 2016
Skotty It's nice to occasionally have an open unfiltered forum where anyone can ask a question so that we are all reminded of why it's not a good idea to have an open unfiltered forum where anyone can ask a question.
Some of the questions were absurd. I think the one where the guy had a personal grievance against Solar City he wanted to talk about kind of takes the cake this time. It was inappropriate on multiple levels. It was personal and not of public interest. It was not a question. It was something Elon and company could provide no useful response to. It wasn't even about Tesla.
I'm also perplexed how you can tell the audience a thousand times to keep to short quick to the point questions and still people go into entire lectures where the actual question is nowhere to be found.
Here's a real suggestion to everyone, including those who are asking well intentioned questions. There is a very good reason to keep your question very short and to the point, and not try to cram in more than one question. When you ramble on a bit, or try to inject multiple questions, the speaker begins to lose focus on what the actual question was, and then the answer ends up being something loosely related that doesn't actually answer the original question. This keeps happening at the shareholder meetings, and it's really annoying. Please ask short to the point questions so that your question actually gets answered (even if it's just a "can't comment on that" answer) and the QA can move along more efficiently and get to more questions.�
Jun 9, 2016
MitchJi If we could do that what makes you think that we would get more than one question?
And the effen Californians wouldn't ask about the fact that dealers are banned in New Mexico,,�
Jun 9, 2016
msnow According to your profile you're an "effen Californian" too right?�
Jun 10, 2016
Skotty Recent tweets answer this question. Sounds like there is consideration of using Samsung for Tesla Energy products (and LG Chem for Roadster 3.0), but all the automotive batteries will remain Panasonic. That's pretty much what I expected.�
Jun 10, 2016
MitchJi Yes. I'm the person who "effing downvoted my submission" in the ludricrous posts quoted above. It might be reasonable to disagree with my beliefs that; this question is not of sufficient strategic importance to investors, and my belief that asking that question would not accomplish anything meaningful, but blaming the problem on shareholders, many of whom are from California, for not asking the question, and the corollary assumption that if they did that Elon could solve the problem much sooner are ludricrous.
At the meeting Elon and JB said that they will be able to produce all of the cells required for both TE and TM at the GF in the fairly near future. Since no one else is close on price going forward it's a safe assumption that moset of their cells will come from the GF, plus maybe Panasonic for the MS-MX (subject to existing contracts).�
Jun 10, 2016
tinm Why do my quoted statements say "anonomous said"? Did you change my user name? Did the system?�
Jul 7, 2016
googlepeakoil Did anyone think the 2 1/2 hour presentation on the "complete history of Tesla" was a deliberate ploy to take up most of the time and stop people asking questions. Can't believe how Musk was so slow on the above - then when it got to the end and spending 15 minutes on a few questions said rather impatiently "you know guys we're running 1 hour late - I need to go soon - I'll take a few more questions". Thought that was arrogant and a bit offensive to the people who'd attended!�
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