Sep 25, 2013
nkohlimd Posted on the Tesla forum that the cost of the PDC will be $6000 according to Tesla........any thoughts
parking sensor retrofit not ready yet but... | Forums | Tesla Motors�
Sep 25, 2013
Benjamin Brooks Not worth the money...�
Sep 25, 2013
Beavis I've driven without them for 34 years. I don't need to spend that much for them now.�
Sep 25, 2013
yobigd20 hah, what a ripoff.�
Sep 25, 2013
SFOTurtle No thank you�
Sep 25, 2013
EarlyAdopter If that's true I'll take the sensors and wires for $500 in parts thank you very much and have them installed by someone else.
That said, I can't see how this could possibly require $5500 in labor to install. At $125/hr that would be 44 hours. No way it could possibly take a week to install them.�
Sep 25, 2013
bhuwan Heh what a ripoff�
Sep 25, 2013
stopcrazypp I think the main problem is that there's holes that has to be punched in the front/rear facias to make the sensors work and only Fremont has that machine.
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/12128-Parking-sensors/page20?p=398795&viewfull=1#post398795
Which means a retrofit will not only be the ~$500 in sensor/wire parts, but would also include the front and rear facias. The parts/labor and paint (will have to be matched to your car) on those two could easily put the cost to about $6k.�
Sep 25, 2013
AnOutsider There were murmurings about a new bumper being flown out for the install.�
Sep 25, 2013
Raffy.Roma I disagree. IMO to retrofit parking sensors on a very complex car like the Model S is not easy and is time consuming. You can certainly get parking sensors at a cheaper price on the after market but if you want parking sensors as they have been originally designed and produced by Tesla is not cheap. This is a general rule whenever you want to retrofit anything.�
Sep 25, 2013
vfx I bet that DIY front camera is looking pretty good now!�
Sep 25, 2013
kruecab While discussing this with a co-worker yesterday, she wisely commented:
She's not an owner - yet. But I'm working to convince her. She felt the car was far too special to be trying to cram it in a spot so small that a sensor is required. I like that thinking!
If you think you need a parking sensor, you're too close!
?�
Sep 25, 2013
tomanik $6k seems hard to believe but if true would support the statement about needing new bumpers. Pretty much does away with it as a retrofit option in my mind.�
Sep 25, 2013
yobigd20 hell, you're better off taking that money and getting lasik eye surgery. then you'll be able to see like a hawk and you won't need these parking sensors, and it'll save you half the cost too! it's a win/win!�
Sep 25, 2013
PhilBa Yeah, that is a "go away, kid" pricing. Kind of insulting.�
Sep 25, 2013
artsci Why do Tesla's or any sensor installation when a touchscreen front camera DIY solution is coming soon for less than about $600.�
Sep 25, 2013
brianstorms $6,000? If that turns out to be what Tesla charges then it is just plain obscene and downright punitive. It would make me start to believe the whole "be the best car company" and "have the best customer ownership experience" is all just an act and not authentic.
I'd pay $1,000 for a retrofit but that's it. I finalized my order two days before Tesla surprise-announced parking sensors. I remain very disappointed I couldn't get them without cancelling my order and paying $4,500 extra just to get the same car with them.�
Sep 25, 2013
ddruz Artsci - Will you be keeping us up to date on the availability of this?�
Sep 25, 2013
MarkR We have nearly identical stories. I finalized about a week prior to the availability of the new parking sensors and was unwilling to pay for all of the price increases in order to get the sensors. Some of Tesla's decisions appear to reflect poor planning.
In both our cases they lost revenue from the additional add-on that we were willing to pay for and created ill will without any benefit to Tesla. Maybe it was a foolish oversight or maybe some really stupid people are employed at Tesla. As an early adopter (2009) and a purchaser of two of their cars, I was pissed. As a stockholder, I'd want that decision maker demoted or fired.�
Sep 25, 2013
Teriyaki88 I could get into lots accidents, pay for my repairs without using insurance, and still have plenty of $$ left over. $6K is ridiculous!�
Sep 25, 2013
dennis My aftermarket parking sensor installation cost about $2000, broken down as follows: $500 parts, $250 painting, 15 hours labor @ $85. The $6000 number from Tesla is probably $4250 parts (because of new front and rear fascias) and 10 hrs. labor @ $175. The only downside of the aftermarket install is that it does not provide the visual feedback you get with the OEM install, just different audio tones for front and rear sensors. You can find my original post with pics here.�
Sep 25, 2013
vfx $6000 is the, "we don't want to do it" price. Too bad an owner can't just buy and install the sensors (with a careful hand and a dremel tool) and have Tesla service hook up the wires and turn on the software.�
Sep 26, 2013
dsmith2189 the post on the TM site references a "Peter Welch" that said $6K. I never heard of him... Who is this and what does he do at tesla.�
Sep 26, 2013
jerry33 As shipped, the Model S is already the second easiest car to park that I've ever had (First prize goes to the DS-21). For $600 I'd think about it just to have the gimmick, for $6000, not on your Nelly.�
Sep 26, 2013
ChrisPDX To me it's pretty impressive that Tesla is even offering this option. Most car companies that come out with a factory option in a later production car would simply tell owners of earlier versions that they would happily take their car as a trade in on the purchase of a new car and that's it! $6K may be high but considering there is also probably new wire harnesses involved here too, it's no surprise it's going to be expensive when compared to the factory cost (which would simply use a different spec harness and bumper covers from the start).�
Sep 26, 2013
artsci As I'm in China for another week, no progress will be made until I return. But since all of the cables and connectors are in hand, the first weekend in October I'll be able to rig the front camera to the front of my car for a test that I can post. A week later I should have it operable so the camera can be switched from front to rear using Homelink on the touchscreen.
After that it will probably take a month or so to produce a kit for interested owners.�
Sep 26, 2013
dgmanny Has anyone tried the following solution? nVISION 60100VA Back Up Sensor System. One of the challenges is that it needs a 12v power source. Has anyone removed a back tail light? most of my parking situations are straight on so i dont need four sensors spaced throughout the bumper. thanks�
Sep 26, 2013
gregincal This thread is ridiculous, because it is based on a false premise that Tesla has announced a retrofit and it's going to cost $6000. Even the original quote in no way said that this was going to be the price they would charge for the retrofit, in fact it said they wouldn't offer it. The quote from the original thread: "So, i heard back from Peter Welch. He said they looked at the retrofit and determined it would cost $6000. A little hard to believe. However at that cost they decided not to offer it."
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Sep 26, 2013
dsmith2189 Exactly, I want a response from an authoritative source, not someone I've never heard of.�
Sep 26, 2013
Gizmotoy Is it? I had a hell of a time getting them in and out of the Santana Row parking spots in CA. The Tesla employee on my test drive told me they don't even usually let people park them after test drives because they're so hard to get into the spots. The turning radius seemed somewhat acceptable, but that front overhang is huge.
And I'm coming from an AWD car with the turning radius of a dump truck, so I'm used to poor parking ability.�
Sep 26, 2013
jerry33 I find parking it totally easy. You just line up the car with the mirrors and stop when the curb is at the bottom of the screen. Perfect every time.�
Sep 26, 2013
ddruz Totally agree. The car is a dream in aligning parking side to side (down tilt mirrors) and rear (camera). The front is the only place sensors would help fill in an area that now must be estimated.�
Sep 26, 2013
SteveW25561 I think straight in parking isn't too bad but parallel parking can be tougher (long wide car).
Backing at an angle to a wall for example is tricky since the camera doesn't cover the edges of the bumper -- I find it hard to tell if the rear corners of the car would hit a wall when backing in in these situations, especially in a dark garage. Sensors would definitely be welcome there.
The front camera I installed makes pulling up to curbs and concrete stoppers much less nerve wracking. Parking sensors won't help with that.
I'll reserve judgement until the price is actually announced. Since $6k is being floated now, if the final price is closer to $3000 I'd bet there will be fewer complaints than if no "leaked" price occurred.�
Sep 26, 2013
Andrew Has anybody considered one of these?
http://www.curb-alert.com/features.php
I just came across one for sale on eBay for $150. Curious to know if that might be a reasonable alternative...�
Sep 26, 2013
rekoh I have to ask a question because I am confused.
If you bought the sensors on your own. Installed on your own (dremel tool... aftermarket shop... whatever). Dont they just plug into the harness?? ...meaning: cant they just turn on the software and you are good to go?�
Sep 26, 2013
Puyallup Bill That looks interesting. I have just sent a query asking about experience with a model S.
I am sort of concerned about the turn on/off procedure. The unit turns on when an ICE alternator is running, and off 20 minutes after the alternator stops turning. I don't know when the MS charges the 12 battery. As needed? When the car is turned on?�
Sep 26, 2013
SteveW25561 The curb alert device only helps with low lying objects but it won't help with objects like the bumper of the car in front of you where there's just space under the car and no object on the ground to detect, but the bumper looms above. A front facing camera can show you both of these things.�
Sep 26, 2013
EarlyAdopter Yes, that should be the fall-back case. Buy the parts from Tesla ($500), drill your own holes in the bumper (this talk of having to buy a new bumper is ridiculous) and run the wires, then pay Tesla a half hour of labor to recode the car to enable the sensors.�
Sep 26, 2013
Kraken Even if it is 6k, shouldn't the resale value of your car go up a couple grand at least since any car with the same specs originally sold for 4500 more?�
Sep 27, 2013
steve841 I don't think that will be the case .... since this EV thing is still unknown and its currently a $500 option ... it seems Mileage would be the greatest factor in determining value (I would figure age of car should play a role too).�
Sep 27, 2013
Gizmotoy Maybe backing in is easier. They had me park head-first. That and I've only driven the car a few times and was somewhat nervous about smashing up $300k of cars that aren't mine. If you could swing wide I think it would be easier, but the valet pylons are there so you have to stay in the lane directly adjacent to the spots. Not a lot of room.
I wasn't the only one, though. All of the customer cars were crooked both times I was there save for the one spot not obstructed by the pylons.�
Sep 27, 2013
briboynyc I would think if you have the resale value guarantee from Tesla you could recoup 43% of the cost of installation. On the guarantee it says 43% on all options so if you get this dealer installed I would think this is an option. On the�
Sep 29, 2013
LaszloB Parking sensor upgrade
I hope that the company will make this useful feature available, at a reasonable price, to those of us who had already bought the Model S!�
Sep 29, 2013
LaszloB That is totally unreasonable!�
Sep 29, 2013
lloyds Not worth it, but I understand that Tesla will have to charge to get it done correctly. I will be going with an aftermarket front camera that will cost a lot less than 6k. Plus I'm more of a visual type than to rely on the beeps�
Sep 29, 2013
LaszloB Thanks--I'll look into the alternative.�
Sep 29, 2013
TylerCA It's not completely out of line due to retrofitting any system. They did prep many in terms of the cost being "high".�
Sep 30, 2013
AmpedRealtor Tesla is already offering fog light retrofits, but nothing in terms of the parking sensors. I believe this speaks volumes. The parking sensors will NOT be offered as a retrofit at any price. I think we should stop hoping for something that will never happen. It's been 2 months now since the options changed over. Tesla said that if a retrofit option were to be offered, we would know in a few weeks. Those weeks have come and gone.
Can we move on?
�
Sep 30, 2013
LaszloB Steve, how did you insert the photo?�
Oct 1, 2013
phat78boy Where did you see this? Do you happen to know price?�
Oct 1, 2013
LaszloB No, I don't. I did talked with the factory service group last week, and a man told me that they will release info soon. He also recommended that owners who are interested in having the Parking Assist option retrofitted should contact Tesla to let their desires known.�
Oct 1, 2013
AmpedRealtor Several others in the forums have indicated that they are receiving the fog lights at the service center. They are integrated into the whole turning light assembly and are a simple swap, however the bumper needs to be removed in order to make the change. I don't know what the cost is for the retrofit.�
Oct 4, 2013
omarsultan Because...?�
Oct 4, 2013
markb1 Some people bought cars when Tesla's web site said fog lights were included, yet the cars were delivered without fog lights.�
Oct 4, 2013
rlang59 Based on AmpedRealtors VIN I can't see how that would be the case. My VIN is 9805 and the fog lights were not on the website when I ordered.�
Oct 4, 2013
AmpedRealtor My apologies, I have corrected my previous post. I've had a few service bulletins applied to my car as well as a number of issues corrected after delivery, I think I was just confused. I have the cornering lights, but those presumably are not the new fog lights. My dog and best friend of 13 years passed away on Sunday and I've been in somewhat of a fog for the last few days. Participating in this forum and the one at Teslamotors has provided me with some escapist relief, but in the shock of the loss I'm noticing that I'm confusing facts and events that have taken place recently.�
Oct 4, 2013
ModelX So sorry to hear of your loss!�
Oct 4, 2013
Kraken Vin isn't a fully utilizable indicator, my vin is much higher, but because we ordered before the cut off date for the fog lights (and my email communication with tesla strongly indicates a cut off date), I was able to get it retrofitted for free. That date appears to be sometime in February, and I ordered in January.�
Oct 4, 2013
brianstorms Spoke with Ownership the other day and I was told that they ARE going to be made available as a retrofit.The company is still collecting names of owners interested in the retrofit. No word yet on WHEN, however.
I told the Ownership person to consider just selling the damn parts and letting us do it ourselves. Ownership told me, well the problem is only the Tesla factory has the proper drills for cutting holes in the bumpers, and that the Service Centers won't be able to do it. So I said, okay, you tell me when, and i will drive up to Fremont the second I get word. It's 500 miles. It's nothing. I don't think Ownership was expecting me to say this. But I'm serious.
Unfortunately, I did also get the sense that it is going to be so expensive as to be pointless. Maybe not $6000 expensive, but expensive. That's all I know.�
Oct 4, 2013
brianman Tell them you're not alone on this. I'd probably have to coordinate with vacation, but for thousands in cost differential it's a no-brainer to make the drive down there.�
Oct 4, 2013
shady Driving lessons for the win!�
Oct 4, 2013
Kraken
Maybe it will be the same cost for everyone whether they live near or far or drive their own car here.... Maybe we are all subsidizing the transportation costs of others vehicles again.�
Oct 4, 2013
brianman Honestly, I thought I might get something out of the Ranger part of my service plan for stuff like this. I guess not. : |�
Oct 4, 2013
dsmith2189 They�
Oct 4, 2013
rekoh RUMOR ALERT: heard from someone connected to Tesla: .. parts for sensors (8) and module will be $1500, but they cannot order as of yet. No estimate on price to install ...�
Oct 4, 2013
brianstorms Yes, sorry it wasn't clear -- I talked to Ownership about Parking Sensors.
What happened was, I emailed 'em to ask if there were any update yet. I got back a boilerplate email that, well, let's just say it was kind of an insult to my intelligence. It talked about how owners who had confirmed orders before August 2013 blah blah blah. I wrote back and told them, no, this is no good, I ordered my car on July 19, and confirmed around Aug 1, and within 48 hours, Parking Sensors were quietly introduced on the website, and I immediately contacted Tesla and was told in no uncertain terms, tough luck, cancel your order, pay $4500 for the same car with $500 sensors, ha ha.
Further, I told 'em this time, nope, nuh-uh, not gonna accept this as an explanation or as an answer. Please try again.
Next thing i know, Ownership is calling me . . .�
Oct 5, 2013
EarlyAdopter I sure hope this doesn't prove to be true. Lame that buying the parts on the production line cost $500 (labor would be close to $0), but having the same parts put in a box and shipped to you or your service center adds $1000. That would be a hellova markup for shipping and handling.�
Oct 5, 2013
teslasguy I had aftermarket front/rear bumper sensors with internal displays several months ago. Absolutely looks like a factory install and works great. Total under $1500. Also had a front curb sensor installed. Around $300.�
Oct 6, 2013
bob_p If Tesla is not going to provide the upgrade, they should make the parts available to 3rd parties, since they appear to be able to install the sensors in the bumpers.�
Oct 6, 2013
briboynyc Did your aftermarket install work with the tesla native display? if so what manufacturer of the sensors did you use?
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Oct 6, 2013
AmpedRealtor Parking sensors which require an additional internal display of any kind cannot, by definition, look like a factory install. A factory install does not require additional and ugly monitors to be installed.�
Oct 6, 2013
logan "Ugly monitors" may be a bit subjective�
Oct 6, 2013
Andrew I emailed Ownership in early August, and got a reply from John Crick: "While we do not have retrofit pricing for existing owners, we should have more information over the next several weeks."
I just followed up with him, and specifically asked to be added to the "interest list." He wrote back (impressively, within about half an hour, and on a Sunday). Unfortunately, though, here was his reply:
"Thank you for the follow up. There is no update at this time. We will note your interest for management. Wish I had better information."�
Oct 6, 2013
Kraken They can't start doing parking sensor upgrades until they are upgrading people from 4.x to 5.x. ... Just sayin...�
Oct 10, 2013
Musterion Parking sensors work fine on 4.5, even has cool miniature car display. Parking sensors - Page 34�
Oct 10, 2013
Shumdit I feel strongly that there is no reason the retrofit kit should cost more than the $500 it is as an option. Labor they can argue the point on but if they charged more than $500 for the kit I would expect some reasonable explanation for it. I am sure they may need some parts that are not already in place, but i cant fathom that it would be anywhere close to three times the cost just for the parts. That gives buyers the option of installing it themselves if they want to with only a simple programming update by tesla to activate them if the software is not already included with the latest version of the software. I am sure they are making a tidy profit at $500 and this would open up potentially thousands of additional sales to existing owners.�
Oct 10, 2013
bhuwan posted WITHOUT permission, mainly because all of the info is well known in this thread, got this from ownership:
�
Oct 10, 2013
andrewket Cars were not delivered in VIN order. I'm over 10000 but ordered when fog lights were included. My car was delayed mostly due to the red color and 3rd row.�
Oct 10, 2013
hasselboxster Couldn't there be an option to take your car out of service for two weeks, and send the parts out to be cut at the factory? Shipping plastic would have to be significantly less than buying new pieces.�
Oct 10, 2013
bhuwan I am planning. A road trip to California next year, I would love if they kept the car for a few days and did the work. Little chance of that happening but wishful thinking.�
Oct 10, 2013
brianman If you're serious about this (coordinating with a trip to California and having the service done in Fremont while you're there), please contact [email�protected] to get an official response. I know at least a few of us are considering the same thing -- except taking the trip specifically for this purpose -- and are interested in what you might hear. Thanks!�
Oct 10, 2013
bhuwan Good idea. Just emailed them.�
Oct 10, 2013
nkohlimd Spoke with Sound in Motion in Boston, they quoted about $1500 to do the front and rear sensors with a bezel-less sensor install similar to Al and Ed's in CA. It would be audio only but could include visual bar sensors although the shop felt it would look a little cheezy. I will wait till I hear official word from Tesla but no reason that bezel-free install needs a special laser punch IMHO. I do want parking sensors as my wife won't drive the car without them and the front facing camera, although great, doesn't provide side protection. My gut is I will go with the local install (sad I won't get the on screen integration) and save the cash for other goodies .....�
Oct 10, 2013
bhuwan Group buy? I'm in, If so.�
Oct 10, 2013
nkohlimd Good suggestion. Let me see if I can organize a local group buy but let's wait for final word from tesla......�
Oct 10, 2013
dennis My take on this: They floated the $6K price, saw a LOT of resistance from owners, and are looking for another approach that will cost less so they can satisfy the large number of owners who want the sensor retrofit.
I emailed my Regional Service Manager several weeks ago suggesting they outsource Bay Area retrofits to the aftermarket firm that installed mine. While I understand the potential quality issues if they have Service Center personnel drilling the bumpers, there are reputable firms that routinely do this kind of work.�
Oct 10, 2013
bhuwan Sweet�
Oct 10, 2013
tdiggity In my dreams, I'm hoping that Tesla will change the sensors so that they can be installed without a silly sonic drill. Regardless of if it can be done without the special drill, I'm hoping they just ditch the whole process and use sensors that are easier to install. Everyone would be happier this way. Seeing the final product doesn't make any of us say "wow those sensors are installed so well and flush I wonder how they did it..." Lol.�
Oct 10, 2013
teslasguy @ampedrealtor interesting you think my internal parking sensors are ugly as you've never seen them. Many people that have seen them comment that they look as though they could be a factory install. To each his own. :-/�
Oct 11, 2013
aaron.s bhuwan,
Aren't you joining us for the cross country drive to Teslive next year?! If they do only offer the retrofit at the factory, then I would be in too!
Aaron�
Oct 11, 2013
bhuwan I'd like to but my all depends on my fiances schedule�
Oct 11, 2013
AmpedRealtor My point was simply that no third party product could possibly look as good as a Tesla factory installation exactly because a Tesla factory installation would use the screens in the vehicle and integrate into the car's operating system, not require an additional display/alert device that did not interface with the rest of the system. The Tesla solution is far more elegant and not something any third party can currently replicate, therefore not as good as a factory install. That's just my opinion, but obviously what is important is that it suits your needs and that you are happy with it.�
Oct 12, 2013
bob_p Retrofitting new features is going to be an ongoing problem for Tesla. With the exception of the battery pack (which can be replaced), the rest of the car is a very simple design - and should last for many years. The software can be updated to add new features. As an early adopter, I would like to have the option to add new features to my Model S - rather than being forced to buy a new car - just to get a few new gadgets (which is the business model for the other manufacturers). And once installed, I want these features to be the same as if they'd come on the car delivered from the factory.
I would like the option for installing the parking sensors in my car. When they add dynamic cruise control or night vision - I'd also like an option to add those features - integrated into my car.
Adding those features will likely cost more than if they were purchased on a brand new car. But adding them later, even at a higher price is still much less expensive than the alternative - selling the old car and replacing it with a new one - which is the business model for the other manufacturers.
Perhaps Tesla should consider establishing a separate group internally to focus on what will likely be a growing retrofit business. Some retrofits will make sense for the Service Centers to handle (such as the 2nd charger or adding supercharging). For others, such as the parking sensor upgrades, it might make more sense to have those done by 3rd parties - that may have the skills and equipment already to do the installations (such as installation of the sensors into the bumpers - without having to send them back to the factory).
And, if they begin planning for the retrofits, in parallel to adding new features to manufacturing of new vehicles, they'd be able to announce the retrofit option to current owners - when they announce new features being added for new orders. This would eliminate all of the angst and frustration we've seen with the parking sensors.
Personally, I'd prefer they have the Service Centers focus more on providing service on the cars - and let qualified 3rd parties (with the appropriate expertise) handle the retrofits. This is what they already do for glass replacement - which they send out to a 3rd party to handle...
My 2 cents on this issue...�
Oct 12, 2013
gnelson I like your thoughts!�
Oct 12, 2013
hasselboxster second that. there is money left on the table for people that are not going to buy new, but will give more money for new features. this seems in-line with how Tesla has already established itself. i dont think Tesla and Model S is merely about an electric car, but also a different business model and this continual improvement of the car over time is a major part of that model. not being able to figure out and engineer these retrofits is a major fail on that mission.
my last service center visit describe the engineering in the model s with a mission to be "the last car you'd need to own".�
Oct 12, 2013
vfx And some else once said, Today's Model S is the worst car Tesla will ever make." (!)�
Oct 13, 2013
neroden At this price I might actually get them, even though it's very expensive. I've spent way too much time getting out of the car to check my positioning, and getting back in to move it two feet. The car is enormous.�
Oct 13, 2013
AmpedRealtor For only $4,000 I would be happy to perform that service for you...�
Oct 13, 2013
Stoneymonster On the other foot, seeing that seemingly minor body working on the rear quarter panels is running up to $22k, maybe this isn't such a bad deal�
Oct 13, 2013
KenEE I feel like we early adopters should get quite the deal on a retrofit. Any car in this class should have parking sensors in the tech or convenience packages, but Tesla was unable to get it in before initial ship.
I think the right thing to do for supporters who bought any way and trusted Tesla is to make the obvious deficiencies available cheap.
Things like cup holders and parking sensors will never be missing again and there is no good reason to fleece early supporters.
Now upgrades that are truly new functionality and not deadline misses are a different story...�
Oct 13, 2013
dirkhh Welcome to the real world. There is zero incentive for Tesla to do that. Quite the contrary. They are going to fleece us every chance they get. And we'll all line up and reserve an early Model X...�
Oct 14, 2013
AmpedRealtor Right, in other words you purchased the car with the features that were available at the time. Hypothesizing months later whether the car "should have" had parking sensors and parlaying that false argument into an unspoken expectation of receiving these features down the road even though no promise or representation was ever made, is laughable. Talk about entitlement!
Wow, so you purchased an obviously deficient vehicle? Why on earth would you do that?
Tesla shook you down, eh? They totally ripped you off and "fleeced" you of your money because they sold you a car with specific features that you felt was totally acceptable at the time because you actually bought one. Can you please remind us when Tesla held a gun to your head?�
Oct 14, 2013
dirkhh Exactly my point. The economic incentive goes exactly the other way around. Signature owners pay more for a similar car than production owners. And usually their cars have lots more technical issues. Yet the desire to have the car earlier makes lot of people get in line.
So why on earth would they give them anything for free? It makes no sense.
fleece(flis)
n., v. fleeced, fleec�ing. n.
[...]
6. to overcharge.
No implication of a gun to the head (btw: I love the fact that I got negative reputation comments for using the same term... get a life, people... Yes, Tesla is going to fleece us. Every. Step. Of. The. Way. You can stay in denial and believe that the upgrade fairy will bring you goodies, in the meantime I recommend putting money into the piggybank for the next n-thousand dollar upgrade for something that you think you are entitled to get).�
Oct 14, 2013
vfx I would opt out of the piggybank and buy TSLA stock.�
Oct 14, 2013
Kraken I was talking to a guy at the Palo Alto store tonight. He wasn't dressed quite like the rest of the employees and I know there has been some extra attention at the store with the grand opening and the model x prototype on display, so he might have not been part of the normal sales staff. Anyway, regardless of his position, he seemed like he knew more details than he was allowed to tell me, and he seemed in the know of something coming down.
basically, he said that the original retrofit option was just way too expensive (what we already know) and that they planned on having the price released within one month of the release of the sensors on new orders. Due to the excessive price, they went back to the drawing board and are going to be making some decisions really soon (he might have even said something about this week, but the details are blurry). He referenced the price of the parts ($500) and the price of 3rd party (a couple grand) and said that they hoped to cut it somewhere in the middle.
He also reiterated many times that they wanted to take care of the people who are already owners and stand out as the company that did allow current owners those types of opportunities.
Again, I wouldn't take too much from this because I couldn't tell you who he was from Adam, but I left hopeful of a reasonable price point and an update pretty soon.
also, for those of you who chose a dark color, those sensors are nearly invisible from more than 2 feet away. Unfortunately for me, they were very obvious on the pearl white due to the dark ring around the outside. It was nice to be able to see them on a variety of cars. The actual interface was very useable too, and they let me do a test run of it in the parking lot. I do still have my doubts that it will help with a low curb (I avoid parking over any curbs at all).�
Oct 14, 2013
brianman Regardless of what they decide on for the particulars of this retrofit, I hope they maintain this philosophy throughout retrofit decision-making.�
Oct 15, 2013
AnOutsider This. This is what I've always been led to expect from Tesla, regardless of what anyone says. It's why I decided to jump in early. Hope the philosophy continues.
*edit* tired of agreeing with brianman�
Oct 18, 2013
huntjo I had a P85+ loaner for a day with 5.0 and parking sensors. Thought they were cool for a while, but decided the beeping was a little annoying at times when I already know it's super close, like pulling into my garage. I probably won't push for parking sensors retrofit, unless it's part of adaptive cruise control.
...of course, I clearly would have benefited from the sensors on delivery, since I have hit my own garage twice. Once scuffing only paint armor, and once damaging the bumper. But now I'm kinda used to living without them�
Oct 28, 2013
neroden For reference, I would happily pay a couple hundred dollars over third-party for a Tesla retrofit, just to get the sensor information showing up on the main touchscreen.
Great. Let's hope the same philsophy applies to the winter weather package, which is equally if not more important to retrofit.
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The beeping can be turned off. I would turn it off and rely on the visuals on the screen. I mainly want it to gauge distance in front.�
Oct 30, 2013
fryfrye I've just got the quote to retrofit parking sensors on my car after my better-half backed into a well camouflaged pole in a parking garage (her story and she's sticking to it). The quote is for just around 6k as previously reported. Since I have a bumper that most likely will need to be replaced (waiting for estimate from Euro Collision next week) I may be in a situation where I am already paying nearly 2k for a rear bumper replacement (parts, labor, paint) and I've confirmed that I get to keep the other parts that are replaced (front bumper/nose cone). Those parts seem to have a quick-sell street value of about $1100. So the parking sensor retrofit would only be about 3k additional. I suspect it will come down to how much the repair/replace quote is for the current bumper.�
Oct 30, 2013
bhuwan Wow, just so I'm understanding you correctly, Tesla has actually offered a "retrofit" to you and quoted the cost as $6,000?�
Oct 30, 2013
brianman Hm. I'm curious if they are still molding "original Sig" nose cones or not.�
Oct 30, 2013
ken830 A coworker bumped into my rear bumper in the parking lot. Replacement/paint/etc cost just over $2,000... I had wanted to hold-off on the repair because of the rumors hinting at parking sensor retrofit requiring bumper replacement, but this was April and there was no news for over a month.�
Oct 30, 2013
fryfrye Yes. Although it all hinges on the cost to replace/repair the rear-bumper. If that hits 2k, then its toss-up.�
Oct 31, 2013
JPP At today�s event @ Chrissy Field in SF, I had the opportunity to talk with Jerome G, and get a close look at his personal (well..corporate with MFG tags) red P85+ (debadged). He was very generous and gracious with his time, and fairly candid. He noted that essentially every new feature/add-on/update/retrofit gets put on his S early (he really is on the bleeding/alpha edge), with all of the attendant woes and benefits. He has tested tires (original Contis, new Michelins), suspension upgrades, parking sensors, power folding mirrors, and so on.
Photo of Jerome's rear bumper:
I asked about the parking distance control system, and the possibility of retrofits. He in fact had them retrofitted into his personal S. There are many significant issues, and this will not ever be offered as an �advertised�, mainstream upgrade.
First, there is the technical and cosmetic issue about making holes in the front and rear bumper fascia. In his opinion, trying to create holes in the painted bumper fascia is fraught with cosmetic issues, with paint flaking and a subtle uneven appearance to the openings. In forward production, they use a sonic system to make a very precise clean hole without disrupting the paint. Also, in the retrofit, the mounting system to the fascia apparently needs to be different than the system used in forward production, and he was/is unhappy with the fitment. He showed me the cosmetic result on his personal S, and I agree that it just does not look perfect.
More significant is the wiring harness. Older production vehicles do not have the necessary wiring. Even current production, depending on the �build list�, might not have the proper wiring for a retrofit (apparently they do use different harnesses and wiring looms depending on options ordered). In some instances, he noted that doing a retrofit would be essentially impossible due to the complexity of rewiring the chassis.
Jerome did not rule out the possibility of individual owners asking if TM would (for essentially any price) in fact do a retrofit, but IMHO this will never show up as a �factory approved� option.
I think that if you are waiting for this, and you must have parking sensors, find a local installer/customizer and decide if aftermarket will work for you. Also note that one TMC contributor is working on a retrofit front bumper camera (identical to the existing rear camera) that might be an easier better option for S owners who are concerned about front bumper damage.
Sorry for the bad news.�
Dec 29, 2013
artsci
Cars built post-June 2013, Vin P12142 and higher, have a wiring harness for the parking sensors. Cars built before then, forget it.�
Dec 29, 2013
markb1 What exactly constitutes a wiring harness? No explanation I've heard of why parking sensors cannot be retrofitted has been sufficiently detailed for me to make any sense of.�
Dec 30, 2013
artsci Basically, a wiring harness is a cable with a bundle of wires and connectors that make the electrical connections for a number of components. The Model S has 2 harnesses for the front bumper which connect a number of components. For example, there's a separate harness for the tech package. As new features are added the harness is modified, which is why the parking sensors won't work with pre-June 2013 built cars. The sensor connections weren't in the harness for the earlier cars. You could make the connections separately but only at huge expense and incovenience. Here's a drawing of the two:
�
Dec 30, 2013
markb1 Do you know what's involved in that? Routing wires might be a pain, but third party shops do that sort of thing all the time. I suppose there's more to it than routing the wires, but what?�
Dec 30, 2013
stopcrazypp Sure, but if it can't be integrated into existing wiring, it can't be qualified as a "factory approved" option, but rather as an aftermarket option. Kind of like some dealer installed alarm systems.
And if it's an aftermarket option anyways, there's probably a lot of third parties that can do it a lot cheaper than Tesla, which is probably why Tesla is considering not offering it.�
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