Thứ Năm, 2 tháng 2, 2017

90D with 5 seats confirmed for nearly 2 months. What's going on? part 1

  • Apr 19, 2016
    DocZ
    I know that the 5 seaters aren't expected until "mid 2016" but this is getting ridiculous. My order has been confirmed for nearly 2 months, no update on the 5 seats. I can't imagine why they're taking so long, all you have to do is ship a car without the third row seat. And no I'm not interested in getting the 6/7 seats. It's strange that given the recent design studio opening to the public and only ~3000 Xs built that they're not rushing to fulfill CONFIRMED orders. At this point it shouldn't be just the performance or just the 6/7 seaters getting order fulfillments.

    Does anyone have any update on the 5 seats?
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  • Apr 19, 2016
    SabrToothSqrl
    I also would order with 5 seats... but then came to the part about rear heat and A/C...

    Maybe that's the issue?
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  • Apr 19, 2016
    EVger
    I have held a reservation for a 5-seat Model X for almost three years. (At this point, there is no apparent benefit to letting Tesla continue to hold my reservation deposit.) I have configured, but have not ordered. Several reasons are keeping me from ordering. I would like to:
    1) spend more time with the MX than my 15 minute test drive allowed;
    2) have some idea of how Tesla will resolves whatever problems it is facing in producing the 5-seater (what will be the configuration, specs, etc.); and
    3) know when Tesla will actually start to produce the 5-seater and when it would likely be delivered (how many people got ahead of me since Tesla opened configuration to everyone, even without a reservation).

    There is no reliable information as to when (or if?) Tesla will actually start to produce the 5-seater. Two people at Tesla told me that if I ordered my 5-seater now, I could expect to get it: 1) in the second half of the year, and 2) before the end of the year. This is contrary to the �mid-2016" currently indicated on the Tesla web site. I have not ordered and will not order until I have sufficient, reliable information.
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  • Apr 19, 2016
    loganintx
    Why not just order a 7 seater and fold the seats down? Is the $4k cost the issue? Are you expecting MORE storage room in the 5 seater vs a 7 seater with 2 rear seats folded?
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  • Apr 19, 2016
    Fiver
    I wish they offered a 4 seat version.
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  • Apr 19, 2016
    Colby Boles
    Join the club, unfortunately. I have six-seat P90DL confirmed from 3.5 months ago that was supposed to be delivered in March. Others have been left waiting even longer, while sometimes people are getting their cars with a relatively short turnaround. There is no rhyme or reason to what is going on, and the more you try to understand it rationally, the more frustrated you will get, if you are like me. I'm trying to just let the whole thing go at this point - I think by the time I actually get the car I will have completely stopped thinking about it, so it might actually come as a pleasant surprise again.

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  • Apr 19, 2016
    jsollender
    Like y'all, I've had a confirmed order for 5-seater since 1/11/16, and wait and watch while the 6-7 seaters are stuck in Fremont or localities waiting for the recall part for the 3rd seat, while Tesla could be pumping out 5 seaters by the batch load. IDK what is going on either. Like someone else noted, its not just a folded down 3rd row to cover. The 5 seater does not have the heater or AC for the rear, which may make some engineer lose sleep. Not me. I really would like to see mid-2016 mean mid-2016 and not slip into Tesla time, but like all bad news today, I'm sure I will be disappointed by the whole process, like most of our brethren have experienced. Seems like if you haven't been disappointed by Tesla communications, you haven't been paying attention....please, Elon, build a quality car when you promised you would.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    DocZ
    Here's an update for everyone. Since yesterday, the design studio now shows "late 2016" for the 5 seat option on new orders
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    jsollender
    Major Grrrrr. What gives? More profit margin on 6-7 seats? Unable to devote engineers to figure out how to eliminate 2nd HVAC system? Not enough confirmed reservists for 5 seat to motivate TM to actually push the car to the production floor? Trying to design folding 2nd row? There's gotta be a reasonable rationale as to why TM is not working on the 5 seater...
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    DocZ
    I'm curious where this lack of heat/AC on the 5 seaters is coming from? It's the first time I'm hearing about it.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    vandacca
    The same engineer that is redesigning the 5-seat model has probably just finished redesigning the 3rd row latch issue. The engineer then needs to rework the cargo area, rework the HVAC and finish the new 2nd row folding seat design. This engineer probably hasn't taken a vacation in 3 years, hasn't showered in weeks and has no hope in hell of finding a partner (or their partner left 2 years ago). But I'll let him/her know that you're anxiously awaiting the 5-seat design.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    jsollender
    on config page it notes rear HVAC system for 6-7 seat models but only single system for 5 seaters, which helps to understand 6-7 seat option is $4000 more than 5 seater, all other things being equal.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    Vitold
    Sounds like 5 seat version will have the same internal volume (maybe more?), same window surface yet less cooling output - do you really want a luxury vehicle with substandard AC?
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    jsollender
    YES!
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    EVger
    Thanks for the update, DocZ. This is news to me. Since I haven�t ordered yet, my order will obviously be a �new order.� I wonder what value, if any, my years-old reservation might have. My guess is: none.

    I would appreciate any thoughts about whether I should just cancel and get my deposit back? I would like to continue to support Tesla, but this is getting ludicrous.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    Fiver
    If you were getting ludicrous you would probably have your X by now.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    DocZ
    To be honest, I would cancel and get my deposit back. I regret confirming my order because now it means I'll have to eat my $5000 deposit. Or if I want the 6 seats then I incur a $500 fee and then pay an additional $3000 to get my car sooner, which is ridiculous to ask customers to do that. I want the configuration that I ordered and I expect to get it in a reasonable time from if I'm dropping $100k+.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    systemcrashed
    Another user on a different forum was able to get the $500 change fee waived by a manager , they claimed that their decision to buy the car was initially made based on the previously advertised information. But if 5 seater is what you want/need then you will probably be waiting unfortunately.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    DocZ
    Either way, I have to spend an additional $3000 to get the option that I DIDN'T want. And I get that things come available a little later or whatever....but we're 7 months post launch for Gods sake.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    systemcrashed
    I hear ya! If it makes any difference I believe there will be a general delay of 2-3 weeks for all models. What I heard today from my DS.
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    Uncle Paul
    My bet is that they are reworking the 5 seat to address concerns and comments from forums like these.

    Probably going to make these seats in house, so maybe the wait will turn out better for all of us on the list.

    I was told long ago that they were going to produced the more highly optioned versions first to recoup some of their massive investment, and those will less expensive configurations will be coming along later.

    Believe they are just doing what they said they were going to do.

    Tesla will release no 5 seater (or 75) before it's time.

    Those that ordered early were told that the 70 was going to be made after the 90 orders were fulfilled, Those that waited now will receive 75 batteries for no additional cost.

    Those that ordered a small tow hitch are now receiving a full sized hitch with connections at no additional charge.

    Those that ordered a fixed rear spoiler are now receiving a motorized version...no additional cost.

    Those that ordered black painted interior trim are now being upgraded to real wood at no additional cost.

    In so many cases Tesla has delivered even more than they had promised.

    Maybe it will be the same happy ending for those waiting for the 5 seaters : >)
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  • Apr 20, 2016
    jsollender
    Hope you're right but expecting reality that no folding seat exists
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  • May 9, 2016
    DocZ
    Well folks, I caved and went ahead with the 6 seat option for the additional $3,000.

    I'm very disappointed in Tesla at the lack of updates on the 5 seat interiors. People who spend $100k+ on the vehicle should get the configuration that they want. Now I'm out an extra $3k for something I didn't want but it is what it is.
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  • May 9, 2016
    evanevery
    Thats just not true. I haven't seen mine and it has Ludicrous, and PUP, and everything else... Still in the "factory queue" and "Late April-May" has been removed from the status page (just like everyone else)..

    Some one give a cracker to Mr Biggles for me...
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  • Jul 22, 2016
    Kincaid
    I got a call from someone at Tesla yesterday that was intended to follow up on a conversation I had with my "delivery specialist". The delivery specialist had been faced with dealing with my politely directed, but nonetheless, forcefully frustrated comments relating to the imponderable and unexplained delayed for the 5 seat Model X version I ordered.
    I got the impression that the sole purpose of yesterday's call was to gauge just how frustrated I was with Tesla and its incompetence at managing the 5 seat fiasco. Maybe they wanted to try to get me to switch to a Model S, or perhaps a 6 seat Model X. I did not let them head down that path.
    I did get verification that what I had expected when Tesla last contacted me a month ago was true: the "late 2016" delivery for a 5 seat Model X was now pushed back to "early 2017" delivery. Oh, great. These guys are turning out to be a bumbling collection of amateurs. To add fun to the discourse, when I directly asked the Tesla representative who called me whether the 5 seat version would have folding rear seats, he actually replied that he did not know. Is Tesla a car company, or something else, like a board game?
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  • Jul 22, 2016
    ccutrer
    A ouija game in particular. Supernatural forces, and you cannot really divine what's going on.
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  • Jul 22, 2016
    182RG
    Sad. A 5 seat MX 60D with coil springs would make me pry my wallet open, cough up hard cash, and cancel the M3. They can build FWD, but not a 2nd row seat commonly found in any other SUV/CUV that has 5 star crash ratings?

    The 3rd row in the X is way too tight, and for me worthless.

    I don't have kids, and I don't haul people from point A to B.

    What I do have is a dog, luggage, ski gear, coolers, beach chairs, umbrellas, shopping "stuff" from Home Depot and IKEA, and assorted other things to carry.
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  • Jul 22, 2016
    beths11
    Yes, Yes, Yes...!
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  • Jul 25, 2016
    jsollender
    ...and I was the same way with no need for 3rd row, and am happily driving my new Tesla Model X 90D with 6 seat configuration, now day 4 of ownership. The third row has been folded down since delivery, and no reason to raise the seats. I have been to home depot twice, no lumber, but a new kitchen sink for my kitchen remodel. It fit just fine on the tops of the folded 3rd row. While I left the 5 seat club, I am happily driving my new car. If you want it sooner, like the upsale people have told you, do so. Venting is fully permitted, but ultimately, it is about your wait versus getting the same style car with the last row of seats folded down. You ain't gonna get much more room with missing 3rd row seats....
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  • Jul 25, 2016
    182RG
    It's also about the unnecessary cost and complexity of air suspension, a 3rd row I'll never use, the shiny 2nd row seat backs getting scratched up, a 80 lb dog who likes room, keeping total costs down to a level of comfort, etc. It's more than just space.
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  • Jul 25, 2016
    Fiver
    When will the 4 seater variant be offered? Like the 6 seater layout but no back seats. I'd buy that.
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  • Jul 26, 2016
    beths11
    @jsollender , this exactly...I've delayed my delivery until May as I am out of state for the winter. Frankly, I find delayed gratification very satisfying. I will have the car for many years, a few months don't matter. What does matter is Tesla continually changing their delivery dates and very poor communication when the dates are changed.

    I expect I will end up with a better product the longer I wait.
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  • Jul 26, 2016
    jsollender
    I whole heartedly agree with you @beths11 . If you want to wait, like we all have from one degree to another, you WILL have a more advanced car than any of us currently driving. I just got tired of the wait. With financing, the upsell made no difference to me as far as monthly costs, so I was all in when I spoke to HQ about the real likelihood of seeing a 5 seater in my driveway this Q3. Though this car would make me a 6 car family, the other 3 cars would be at college campuses around the US, leaving 3 cars at home. My youngest kid needs his license (16.5 years old) to drive to school, so with only 2 cars at home (before X arrived), he had no car for HS. Thus, I wanted a car this summer to ease the burden of having to drive him to school. We all have our individual thresholds for saying wait, or stop waiting and get what is currently available off the assembly line. Beth, you will be ecstatic when you get your car. I think there are far more people with their cars who are entirely content with them who do not visit these forums. I was scared my car would be a potential lemon, and 5 days in the car is flawless. I smile big and wide internally and externally while driving. Your wait will be well deserved, and may include hardware for AP 2.0, folding 2nd row and all sorts of other bells and whistles you have read about.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    Kincaid
    Based on the call I received from Tesla yesterday, I now have sufficient information to conclude my research on what Tesla Motors actually is, and what it is striving to be. The call from Tesla was basically an attempt to pacify me by offering up a slightly discounted and immediate delivery 90D with 6 seats, as opposed to the 90D with 5 seats I have had on order for over 2 years. Results are now conclusive. Tesla is not a board game, as I had surmised earlier. Tesla is in fact a game show. The specific genre by which the Tesla game show is conducted is best defined by Let's Make A Deal. The difference is that Monty Hall managed the show much more personably that Elon Musk, and it was much more fun to watch. I'm tired of the Tesla game show.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    jsollender
    So which door did you pick?
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    bonaire
    Model X can come with 7 seats - 2 front, 3 middle, two rear, correct? Get a 7-seater and unbolt the rear seats. Or you can trade those rear seats for what's behind door number 3.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    beths11
    I think you are joking? There are these things called sensors in the seats that can be unbolted and yanked out as it leaves the electronics of the car in a state of chaos.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    bonaire
    Half-joking. Third row is a fold-flat row, and yes, $4000 option which can be an expensive thing to add just to get it earlier and then fold-flat the rear 2 seats. It just seems like it should be easier to start building and shipping 5-seaters. Do we think this is due to the revenue loss of not installing the extra 2 seats? Or is it possibly due to a required NHTSA crash test for 5-seat models not yet completed?
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    ccutrer
    I doubt it's revenue loss. They're happy to sell you a 60D six seater right now, which is cheaper than a 75D five seater. We don't know the exact delay reason, but likely an engineering issue or validation test holding it up.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    TacC
    I recall reading that they needed crash test data, although I could be wrong. If memory serves, the gist of the theory was that the five seater was considered a different car rather than a variant.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    faktor
    I feel like I am starting again from the beginning! Today my DS wrote that 5 seat is not available. I changed the order at 6 seat and wait, what the **** happens. :mad::( Originally informed me that my model X arrives august / september. Better information I got from teslamotorsclub.com, that I do not like. The email was no word of any apology. Pretty soon Tesla changes in a corporation that can not communicate with the customer. :(
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    jsollender
    I thought when I was hot and heavy for 5 seater I looked at modelxtracker and concluded there were not many 5 seat reservists. Looking today, out of 2000 records, only 55 of them are 5 seaters, or 4%. Not enough interest for TM to really care about the 5 seat people. My honest opinion is that TM is gonna make you all wait and wait and wait till you are sick of waiting and then move to a 6-7 seat version because they will never produce a variant with so little customer interest. Granted those who have ordered 5 seaters represent 100% of those interested in receiving a 5 seater, but the numbers are telling tesla that it is not worth their cost to engineer such a vehicle. Just my humble opinion folks.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    jsollender
    Not to call you out on it @faktor but I always thought the factory made a mistake with both you and @Harry C where they never intended to make a 5 seater for either of you. I know you had a VIN, but that 5 seat VIN will never be made. It looks to me like only 4% of modelxtracker cars are 5 seaters. Tesla is just not going to make a 5 seat car with so little interest....
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    beths11
    You would think they would take it off the Design Studio rather than continuing to tell consumers it is available for order if thee was no intention to build it. I think they will produce a five seater. I believe it will have a folding seat and they don't want to start shipping it or share that information for fear of losing orders in 2016. They are trying to max. out quarterly/annual revenue. I withdrew my information from the tracker after a rude comment from one of the people who helps manage the site. He was so much more knowledgeable than me (sarcasm) and actually told me to cancel my reservation in April, just before the free upgrade came, and reorder. Totally out of line.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    jsollender
    I do feel for you @beths11 . Knowing you are out of here for winter and in no rush, it's ultimately your call to wait or upgrade. Upgrade is guarantee for relatively quick delivery ( I went from upgrade to driving in 6 weeks in Denver), and staying where you are is a crap shoot. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk it through with my Tesla contact....
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    182RG
    ^ This ^

    $6,500 for something you don't want or need.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    vandacca
    I'm sure the interest was a lot more than 4%, but Tesla has been aggressively luring people to switch to the 6/7 seat variant over the past few months. It would be much higher if that model was available today. Tesla is skewing the numbers.
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  • Jul 27, 2016
    jsollender
    those numbers are just the 5 seat orders divided by total number of orders in modelxtracker, pure and simple. 55/2085=4%
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  • Jul 28, 2016
    bonaire
    Web site says "Late 2016 for new orders".

    Also, I see that the only way not to get smart air suspension (SAS) is to get a 5-seater. One must order SAS for 6 and 7 seating. Is it that coils may not work well for the weight of 7-adults?
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  • Jul 28, 2016
    maratd
    That doesn't make sense. You might have cargo that weighs more in a 5 seater.

    More than likely, they won't have coil ready until they have the 5 seater ready. So you can only get coil with a 5 seater.

    Disappointing. I ordered a 6 seater with coil in February and refused to upgrade to SAS. Looks like I'll be waiting for a while longer ...
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  • Jul 28, 2016
    DSBS4
    Given that Tesla hasn't delivered on their end of the bargain, do you think they would let you cancel your order and get your $2500 confirmation deposit back?
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  • Jul 28, 2016
    faktor
    Yesterday I changed the configuration to 6 seat :confused:
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  • Jul 28, 2016
    jsollender
    I think you made a wise decision. You will love it when you get it delivered.
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  • Jul 28, 2016
    maratd
    Technically they haven't reneged yet. I was always told Sep/Oct and I believe 5 seaters heard the same. Although it's looking extremely unlikely.

    Also, it was a $5000 deposit :)
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  • Jul 28, 2016
    ccutrer
    Depending on when you ordered. Shortly after the design studio went public, it dropped to $2500. The title of this thread is "confirmed for nearly two months". Of course a May/June confirmation has nothing on a Dec. '15 confirmation that came from a two or three year old reservation that's still waiting for a 5 seat and/or coil.
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  • Aug 24, 2016
    Kincaid
    Let's Make a Deal or Let's Make a Tesla

    Oh where, or where, is my Model X,
    Oh where, or where, can it be?
    The number of seats I ordered was five
    And Tesla won't build one for me
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  • Aug 24, 2016
    jsollender
    They are moving forward to higher margins with the 100 battery pack and continue to push all 5 seat reservations to upgrade. At some future point they might cave and build a 5 seat car to satisfy a diminutive crowd of vperl and one or 2 others....but then again maybe not!
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  • Aug 24, 2016
    beths11
    At some point they may build a folding, five seat for those who cancelled orders because they didn't deliver on an important feature and attract those who are active, outdoor enthusiasts, no just kid haulers.
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  • Aug 24, 2016
    PhilBa
    We ordered a 90D (right before the P100D announce). They told us that the 5 seater was all the way out in 2017.
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  • Aug 25, 2016
    Kincaid
    Today, August 25, is the venerable Monty Hall's 95 birthday. He never tried to pose as a scientist, rocket engineer, or automotive designer. Instead, he shared the fun of encouraging people to wonder about what was behind door number 1, door number 2, or door number 3.
    In honor of his birthday, Monty Hall was today appointed Chairman and CEO of Space X (door #1), SolarCity (door #2), and Tesla (door #3), replacing Elon Musk. Musk has been doing a wonderful job at Space X, SolarCity, and Tesla, and we all appreciate his hard work and creative instincts. He will return as CEO and Chairman tomorrow, and will spend today doing research on the importance of getting the 5 seat Model X to market. He starts by assimilating these facts from the NHTSA:
    1. Percentage of time a vehicle has 1 occupant: 32%
    2. Percentage of time a vehicle has 2 occupants: 28%
    3. Percentage of time a vehicle has 3 occupants: 19%
    4. Percentage of time a vehicle has 4 occupants: 10%
    5. Percentage of time a vehicle has 5 occupants: 9%
    6. Percentage of time a vehicle has 6 occupants: >1%
    7. Percentage of time a vehicle has 7 occupants: >1%
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  • Aug 25, 2016
    jsollender
    Doesn't car have single occupant 100% of time?
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  • Aug 25, 2016
    Kincaid
    I hope not! Let's hope a car always has an occupant when it is in motion. But, if you are sleeping in the car, or sitting in the car when it is in the garage, or lounging in the car when you are at work, or out to lunch or dinner, perhaps it would be time to disengage from that lifestyle choice and consider more expansive and diverse locations than a vehicle to occupy.
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  • Aug 27, 2016
    TacC
    Kincaid is saying "only one occupant," as opposed to "one or more occupants."
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  • Aug 28, 2016
    Kincaid
    I received yet another call from Tesla last week, the purpose of which was, yet again, to suggest that I switch my order from a 5 seat to a 6 or 7 seat model. The first call I received a month ago offered an incentive of a $2K discount. This most recent call offered the incentive of a 50% reduction of the price increase for, that the cost of the 6 or 7 seat upgrade. I declined, and had an extended discussion about the reason for the 5 seat delays, and the estimated date the 5 seater would start being available.
    I received few direct answers, but did get word that there were a substantial number of outstanding orders for 5 seat versions, that delivery would be unlikely to start in 2016, and most surprisingly, the Tesla representative could not say whether the 5 seat version would have fold down rear seats.
    If Tesla attempts to fulfill early 5 seat deliveries with vehicles that do not have fold down rear seats, Tesla will wind up seeing those orders cancelled. There is no one who wants a 5 seat version with rear seats that do not fold down.
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  • Aug 28, 2016
    anticitizen13.7
    I doubt that the 5-seat version will have fold down rear seats.

    That would require an entirely new bench design, which adds complexity to the supply chain and would probably also require new crash testing.
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  • Aug 28, 2016
    AnxietyRanger
    But this long delay (over a year's wait for the five seater) could well be explained by a redesign of the second row - either just for the five-seater (perhaps a fixed-in-place bench that folds but does not move) or indeed for the entire Model X going forward from thereon. There is less need for a moving mono-pole second row in a five seater (indeed the current design might even be problematic for a five-seater as it stands) and if they are having trouble with a folding second row in the mono-pole format, having a five-seater use some other type of second row that folds could be a workaroud... or they are close to solving the folding second row and will wait for that before unleashing the five-seater...

    I seriously doubt this long delay is just about a new trunk floor panels for non-third-row cars. Not installing a third row and having a new floor panel made is not very hard and should not be cause for a year+ delay. On the other hand, a new rear seat-design with the mandatory crash testing etc. would be a far more plausible cause for delay. Of course, it is possible there is a new bench design that won't fold completely, but it seems plausible some bigger change is in the air in any case.

    My earlier speculation: Any guesses when MX 75D, 5 Seat, Coil...

    What else could realistically explain the long delay, if not some re-design of the rear seating for the five-seater?
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  • Aug 29, 2016
    Kincaid
    Let's give credit where credit is due in so far as my conversation last week with the Tesla representative. When discussing the fold down rear seat issue on the 5 seat Model X version, she repeatedly assured me that Tesla intended to take into account the opinions of its customers who preferred the 5 seat version of the Model X, and also that Tesla was currently testing the 5 seat design. I took the word "testing" to encompass crash and safety factors, not merely interior design factors. Nevertheless, she could not say whether the seats would fold down. She attributed that, and I did as well, to the fact that she was part of the Tesla sales and delivery team, and not part of the mechanical design and engineering team. So what do we have? We have the troubling fact that the engineering team has not yet put together a design that has been finalized to the point that it can be communicated to the sales team. But, let's give Tesla credit. First, they like nice surprises. We all do. Second, they have produced wonderful cars with very sophisticated designs. They are not timid with their design objectives, they are not dumb enough, or irresponsible enough, to attempt to sell their "wonderful and sophisticated" buyers 5 seat Model X cars with rear seats that do not fold down. After all, Tesla has the same culture as Space X, and Space X safely landed the spent first stage of a Falcon 9 rocket on a barge floating in the middle of the ocean. How about that?
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  • Aug 29, 2016
    Yggdrasill
    Confirming that the 5 seat version will have folding rear seats will increase the number of people waiting for the 5 seat version. Tesla doesn't want that. They want people to go for the 6 or 7 seat versions, until the 5 seat version is available.
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  • Aug 30, 2016
    sunnyvale
    I got call from Tesla too! We agreed that my delivery will take place on February 2017.
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  • Aug 30, 2016
    Kincaid
    I hope that the excitement reflected by your exclamation point is justified.

    Full disclosure: I was told in March that my 5 seat Model X would be delivered by the end of June. Then I was told in July that my 5 seat Model X would be delivered by "the end of the year." I joked in response, "which year?" The response was a friendly laugh, accompanied by "probably this November or December." I asked: "more likely November or more likely December?" The reply: "more likely December."

    The moral of the story: I am sure they are trying their very best, but they don't really know. I'm waiting out the process with a sympathetic perspective.
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  • Aug 30, 2016
    Uncle Paul
    Might have another scenario here.

    It has been mentioned that Tesla is working on a Van that is built on the Model X chassis.

    It might just be that that design will feature fold down seats (Makes sense in that configuration)

    Perhaps that cargo van seating will end up in the Model X 5 seater.

    Makes a lot of sense, considering the delaying tatics of Tesla.

    Believe they want their customers happy, that while the delay is uncomfortable, maybe they have decided that this option is what many SUV owners are desiring.
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  • Aug 31, 2016
    Kincaid
    I received another call from Tesla, a response to my request during my conversation with the Tesla representative who called last week, that someone call me who could give me a reasonable explanation about why manufacture of the 5 seat Model X version has lagged behind the 6 and 7 seat version. The explanation was convincing. The 6 and 7 seat versions use the same basic location, structure, and design for the middle row seats. That produces the limited leg room for the middle row seats. The 5 seat version is being designed to have more leg room, a different support system, fold down ability, and interior changes to accommodate the adjusted location for the middle row. In other words, as usual, an ambitious plan that will deliver on all counts. Tesla gets credit. I considered the conversation very positive.
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  • Aug 31, 2016
    beths11
    Is this actually confirmation of folding seats??? This is huge.
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  • Aug 31, 2016
    ChadS
    Not only huge, it's contrary to recent reports on these forums (sorry, I searched but can't find it now) from a "high-level Tesla employee" that supposedly confirmed - though anonymously, so apply your credibility factor - that there were no plans to develop folding seats. (Which I found disappointing, as it was what I was waiting for. I had canceled my Model X reservation because of the lack of folding seats). So it would be great to learn more about this if possible.

    I understand that Tesla doesn't want to talk about folding seats, because they don't want people to wait for something they don't have yet. But not talking about something is different than saying it will never come.

    Developing folding seats is by far the most-logical-sounding reason I've heard for the 5-seater delay...
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  • Aug 31, 2016
    bonaire
    Might be a design to accommodate larger rear seating area for executive second row seating for areas like China.
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  • Aug 31, 2016
    beths11
    Who did you speak with at Tesla that confirmed the folding seats?
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  • Aug 31, 2016
    Kincaid
    He said his name was Chris. He made a point of saying "we intend to do it right." When I hung up, the name reminded me of a possible backstory on why the 5 seat Model X is delayed: Chris Porritt, former vice president of vehicle engineering at Tesla, now works at Apple. It may well have been Porritt's departure from Tesla that disrupted the engineering process for the 5 seat Model X (pure, total speculation). But take a look at the long, long list of seat related jobs currently offered at Tesla. They clearly have had to play some catch up.
    Search for Jobs | Tesla
    At this point in my 5 seat saga, I am inclined to believe "they intend to do it right." I don't mind the wait, and when I get the itch to drive a Tesla, I sneak off with my wife's Model S and drive it to Whole Foods under the pretext that we need some avocados and clementines. That's where most of those blasted 6 and 7 seat Model X's are parked in my neighborhood.
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  • Aug 31, 2016
    vigge50
    They have started to deliver new top versions of Model S with the Model X seat, could this mean that they are trying to develop a back seat that could fit both Model X and Model S or is it to big difference in the cars to share back seat?
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  • Sep 3, 2016
    jsollender
    I recorded my phone call with high ranking tesla HQ manager/VP in June when upsold from 5 to 6 seat with discusion that no folding seats was planned...
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  • Sep 3, 2016
    Ti3034
    was in a Tesla store in the Bay Area yesterday speaking with an associate about the MX 5,6 & 7 seat options. He said "if people want a 5 seater they should order a MS...Tesla may never produce a 5 seat MX"
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  • Sep 3, 2016
    Kincaid
    Reality check: then we would all need to believe that the company from whom we are all purchasing a vehicle commits fraud on its sales website page by offering a five seat version of the Model X available in late 2016 for new orders. Very dramatic, but not likely, despite Tesla's bait and switch act going on with wannabe 5 seat IGT (instant gratification types) folks transitioning to 6 seats. My experience is that employees who work in car sales stores, any car sales store from a Kia to Tesla to Lamborghini, have as their highest purpose the ambition to tell you whatever they think they need to tell you to convince you to buy the car they are most able to sell you at that very instant.
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  • Sep 3, 2016
    Ti3034
    Tesla has, from time to time, over promised and failed to deliver.
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  • Sep 3, 2016
    Kincaid
    Actually, and I say this with affection, Tesla always promises more than it can deliver. That's what I like about Tesla. Heck, the truth is I've spent most of my life promising more than I was actually able to deliver: it's not malice or arrogance or underachievement, I just try to set the bar high and then try to get as close as I can.
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  • Sep 5, 2016
    esk8mw
    Lol at the use of "fraud." Are you serious? It's not fraud to promise a product and fail to deliver...unless they take your payment and refuse to refund it to you. Are you suggesting that tesla wouldn't provide a refund if the five seater isn't ever built?

    Some of you guys need to step away from the computer and breathe. Tesla is working as hard as it can to please as many people as it can. There's nothing nefarious or underhanded going on.
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  • Sep 6, 2016
    Fiddler
    I really hope my 5 seat X90D has fold down 2nd row seats.
    The Leaf Hauls More than Model X!?
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  • Sep 9, 2016
    Nevetsyad
    The X hauls slightly less, but also holds 5 people. Leaf holds 2 when hauling, and not even comfortably. Plus, X has the smugglers compartment under the floor, and a frunk. Leaf...maybe room for a small bag on the passenger's lap?
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  • Sep 9, 2016
    number12
    I wish they would have pulled middle to seats all the way forward in X and compared apples to apples. If only two people are going to pick up table either way. You can scoot middle row up.
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  • Sep 10, 2016
    Nevetsyad
    Exactly, the middle seats scoot forward and the backs push all the way forward. At least another 12-20" of room.
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  • Sep 10, 2016
    number12
    Negative would be great way to guarantee destroying the gloss back of the seats vs probably destroying them with normal wear and tear.
    �
  • Sep 10, 2016
    Nevetsyad
    Good point, but lets face it, if we're hauling bed frames and crap in a 100K SUV, we obviously aren't concerned about resale value. $50 gets a nice little U-Haul trailer with way more room, something a Leaf can't do.
    �
  • Sep 10, 2016
    bonaire
    There is a market for the hitch + a Tesla Trailer (tm) - a nice, light aluminum structure utility trailer, that can be used for added utility. $4500 option at order, $5000... Roll it into the car pricing. Remember that they are pushing "go camping". Then go to other manufacturers for actual camping choices.
    This idea, but take it a bit further for the MX + trailer. Add a powerwall inside and "beautiful roof" of solar PV and you're self-contained.

    [?IMG]

    [?IMG]
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  • Sep 10, 2016
    Kincaid
    Yup. Just what I was hoping for. The Tesla forum is now a venue for folks who wish to feature pictures of yellow Jeep Grand Cherokees plastered with bumper stickers, towing tacky tiny house campers with turquoise trim. Next we can expect a ground swell of sentiment in favor of yellow and turquoise two-tone Teslas. Add a Trump bumper sticker to complete the image.
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  • Sep 11, 2016
    bonaire
    Kincaid, you missed it. There is a reason to be creative and a trailer built by Tesla can be useful. It can match the MX and supplement the cargo carrying capability. There can also be partnerships with firms like Thor Industries (right now, using Airstream for the mobile studio) for a Tesla-styled model as well. The towing package Model X should have a towing product associated with it - and I would bet it would sell reasonably well. To go camping, you might want the camping unit to pull. I'm a follower of the RV industry and see a lot of activity in the small "Pod" campers (like the green one shown above) which are astheticaly pleasing and meant to do just what Tesla is showing in the "Go Camping" posts. One key point about the picture below, however, is that portions of the tent will melt if positioned this close to a campfire.

    [?IMG]
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  • 1/1/2015
    guest
    I spoke with the Tesla Orlando store on September 8, 2016. I was told that production of the 5-seater would start in time for delivery at the end of the year (with an estimated time from production to delivery of 6-8 weeks). I was told that the second row will be on monoposts and that the seats will not fold. I don�t know whether any of this is reliable. That production time frame is consistent with Tesla�s most recently promised �end of 2016.� Time is running out for production to actually start.
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