Apr 5, 2013
efusco Over the past week I began to notice that when I would turn my steering wheel more than about 180 degrees in either direction I would hear and feel (slighly) a click that seems to come from under the dash/frunk area. I can get up to 3 clicks at varying intervals in each direction the last occurring just before hitting the stop. The clicking is noticable when driving at very low speed (below ~10mph) when making hard turns (eg turning into a parking spot), but is not present at all with normal driving speeds.
Leo McAdams was here today to address some of my other minor issues and I asked him to look at it and he took an audio recording to send to engineering. He said he'd never noticed it before but hadn't looked for it and was going to check the next car he's looking at in Little Rock today to see if it does it or not. He didn't feel it was a safety issue since it doesn't occur when driving normally.
Just wondering if anyone else has seen/heard this?
�
Apr 5, 2013
steve841 That's a tough one to describe.
I know on blacktop surfaces I get an occasional sound/feel ...but I know it's the tire slipping on the blacktop in a mid to tight turn...
Don't know if that sounds familiar....�
Apr 5, 2013
efusco No, this is clearly mechanical clicking of internal components of the steering system. Uploading a video now, but I can't promise how good the sound quality will be.
- - - Updated - - -
Video added to the first post.�
Apr 5, 2013
steve841 Whoa..... Way off from what I first thought...�
Apr 5, 2013
MikeC That's loud! I just checked and do not have the clicking on mine.�
Apr 5, 2013
efusco Yea, it's very noticable...the service guy gave a "Whoa!" when he heard it too.
Thanks for confirming that it's not on yours Mike...I think it just started a week or so ago, but it's one of those things that's not so bad as to be confident that it couldn't have been there before.�
Apr 5, 2013
mcornwell My car developed that about a month ago, after 2 months of not having it. I mentioned it in the Technical/Mechanical issues thread on March 5th.
I reported it to my local service center, but they failed to address it when they had my car overnight earlier in the week
�
Apr 6, 2013
Quibbs My 2012 Porsche 911 makes noise worse than that when I turn the wheels all the way to the left or right. It's a known issue and it feels mechanical, but Porsche says it's "normal". Some Pcar owners say it's the tires, others say it's the electric power steering. That developed on mine after the first 2000 miles.
Currently my MS does not have the click yours does, but now I'm worried. How many miles do you on your MS?�
Apr 6, 2013
efusco Started somewhere around 5000 miles, at 6000 now.�
Apr 6, 2013
Born 2 Skydive My P85 started doing it too. I only hear it during parking maneuvers. Javier from Tesla Raleigh NC came and took care of it. He removed the bin from the frunk and we could hear where the sound originated from. He loosen a couple of bolts and lubed it and the clicking disappeared�
Apr 6, 2013
efusco No idea what it was, exactly? Glad to know it was an easy fix, but it seems odd, it sounds like something catching on something and it's unusual that it's only at low speed or when stopped that it occurs...
Thank you for letting me know that though.�
Apr 7, 2013
brianman Just an FYI...
I heard what sounded like the same clicking (from outside the vehicle) when someone was moving a vehicle around at the event at Metropolitan Detail today. I meant to mention it to the owner but got distracted.�
Apr 8, 2013
Twiddler Could it be the CV joints? Would be awfully early for those to be the problem, having wore down many myself :cursing:�
Apr 8, 2013
strider MS is rear-wheel drive only. No CV's.�
Apr 9, 2013
alset I'm getting this now too, was just occasionally, now becoming more regular. Happens near full lock so naturally only at low speed maneuvering.
Going in for service today so I will see what they can do.�
Apr 9, 2013
efusco Ok...let me add another twist...
About the same time I started noticing the steering wheel click phenomenon, I started noticing that every once in a while, usually after a period of 6-12 hours left undriven and usually after being charged, that when I stepped on the brake it seemed FAR more firm that usual and would take a bit to gradually depress to the normal "full depressed" position. Once it was down the brake pedal feedback pressure is the same as it always was.
Any connection?�
Apr 9, 2013
Plug Me In I just noticed the click as well the past couple of days, while maneuvering in a friend's driveway. It's more low speed/no speed extreme steering wheel turning than I normally do. Haven't noticed anything else out of the ordinary other than I got the TPMS service warning for the first time today. I'm still waiting on 4.3, so hope that will make that warning go away.�
Apr 9, 2013
alset Service adjusted torque on some nuts somewhere (steering rack?) and it's all good. Seems like nothing to worry about and just take care of it when convenient.
BTW, the first time anyone gets a TPMS warning, I would check tire pressures. It would be unusual to have a low tire pressure warning though with temperatures increasing (+1 psi for every 10 degrees F). Could also be a slow leak, it can actually work as intended sometimes.�
Apr 10, 2013
Robert.Boston No, that's normal. Something to do with the brake fluids pressurizing.�
Apr 10, 2013
efusco Yea, I'll have to get Leo to look at that too, certainly once I'm rolling it's not an issue, but feels odd that the pedal doesn't depress normally when stepping on it.�
Apr 26, 2013
Duckjybe I am now getting the steering click as well at 6500 km (4,000 miles). It is quite loud and seemed to start, strangely enough, right after I had an alignment done. Called Toronto service and I mentioned that other cars are having this issue. They also think its a matter of loosening and tightening some bolts on the steering rack (as someone else posted). His reasoning was a temperature and humidity change causing different expansion/contraction of the different metals used??? I was trying to schedule a ranger visit but he indicated he had no visibility as to when he could make it out. Still waiting for the call. He did say it was not a safety concern and there was no problem driving it like this. I am self conscious driving in parking lots now because you can hear it outside the car, especially given the car is so silent otherwise.�
Apr 30, 2013
AnOutsider Mine started up with this yesterday. As mentioned its worse since the car is so quiet. Got a double blast yesterday with the clicking and the sound of the ac compressor in a parking lot with on lookers
I'll shoot service a message.�
Apr 30, 2013
yobigd20 ditto, I noticed this as well on my P85. only during low speed parking maneuvers and turning really hard. I didnt think anything of it until I saw this thread.�
Apr 30, 2013
dgmanny I am getting my spoiler installed on Thursday and I mentioned the clicking to my service mgr. he said he knew the issue and would repair it. I will let you know the specific issue after it is fixed.�
May 9, 2013
Duckjybe Just got mine back from being serviced and it is still clicking once in a while. Not as badly though. Apparently the clicking is in a steering column bushing, which they replaced or adjusted? Maybe not since it is not fixed. Not going back until they have the loaner roadsters ready.�
May 9, 2013
mknox I've noticed this on mine lately as well. On old ICE cars, that usually meant a leak in the power brake vacuum assist. Most cars are able to hold enough vacuum to keep power brakes "powered" for days on end. When new, my Model S maintained power brakes overnight (that's as long as the car ever sat), but now with 4,000 miles, the brake has no power assist by morning until I "start" it up when I assume some sort of electric vacuum pump comes on.
EDIT: I wonder if in past software versions the brake assist was left running all the time but with 4.4 they turned it off when the car is off to save power?�
May 10, 2013
efusco Glad to know it's not just me. I notice this over night or when undriven for 6-8 hours.�
May 10, 2013
JohnQ As a point of reference, I've had my car for 3 weeks and have the same behavior you describe.�
May 10, 2013
ToddRLockwood Here's what's causing the steering click...
The photo below shows what's under the frunk of the Model S. About one-third the way down from the top of the image you will see the steering rack and its associated motor. You'll also see the steering wheel shaft angling off to the right.
The steering rack is secured by two bolts � one at each end. These bolts attach the steering rack mounting ears to a similar part of the car's frame. This is where the problem comes in. When the car is stationary and the wheels are turned to their limit, considerable lateral forces act on these mounting points. Even with the bolts torqued to spec, a tiny amount of slippage can occur between the mounting ears and the frame. That slippage creates the clicking sound. The fix being employed by Tesla service involves loosening the bolts and applying some grease between the mounting ear and the frame. This will resolve the clicking noises, but the tiny bit of movement will still be there. By any measure, this is not unsafe.
The problem is a result of a engineering design decision in the way the steering rack is secured. Typically, a good deal more surface area would comprise a rack-to-frame mounting point, and would thereby eliminate the possibility of lateral slippage. I imagine we'll see a reworking of this the next time the Model S frame is updated. In the scheme of things, this seems like a very minor issue.�
May 10, 2013
efusco Thanks, TR, for the excellent explanation and picture.�
May 10, 2013
AnOutsider ditto, I'd give you positive rep, but it would appear I can't�
May 10, 2013
Bipo I agree, thank you very much!�
May 11, 2013
brianman Took care of it for you.�
May 16, 2013
Duckjybe As well, I now have the stiff brake issue after sitting as of this morning. I noticed a whirring or fan noise occurring at the time I put my foot on the brake possibly coming from the AC?�
May 16, 2013
brianman I think I have an idea for the next Cinergi Instructional Video: "Sounds of the Model S".
@Cinergi - It would be very helpful if we had the frequently discussed sounds that the Model S makes catalogued so that instead of "Does anybody have the whirring pop sizzle plop sound?" they can just say "I'm hearing sound #27 when I'm not expecting it."�
May 17, 2013
mknox Probably the brake assist vacuum pump if you hear it right after hitting the brake to start the car (my guess).�
May 17, 2013
EdA I had this clicking fixed by the Service Center a week or so after I had my snow tires removed, the last week in April.
The clicking is back...Anyone had this re-occur?
Thanks�
May 17, 2013
Chris Yes the clicking came back after it was fixed a few months ago. It is not as bad though and I can live with it. Will probably bring it to their attention when my first service comes up.�
May 17, 2013
mknox I guess my normal driving routine doesn't usually see me making sharp turns, but yesterday backing into a tight spot, I had to crank the wheel tighter than usual and hear the snap/click sound...�
May 18, 2013
agentsmith1612 special thanks for the picuture, can somebody explain what the marked parts are ?
�
May 18, 2013
DEinspanjer Had nickle lubricant applied to bolts week before last. Kept the creaks away for a few days, but they started back again during tight turns such as parking.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 4 Beta�
May 18, 2013
Musterion TR posted great info in What's hiding under the Frunk?
Your circles: red is A/C, yellow is suspension compressor (I confirmed this also in factory), blue is water heater.�
May 21, 2013
ToddRLockwood Mine came back a little bit too. Perhaps there will be a shim solution coming from the factory.�
Jul 5, 2013
yobigd20 service manager around here said the new fix they are doing is applying a new shim since 're-tightening and lubricating' wasn't a real fix - that was just a temp workaround until they could figure out a way to permanently get rid of it.�
Jul 5, 2013
mknox Just reporting back that while I had the click for a few days, it somehow went away by itself. I have been "click free" for several weeks now. Weird.�
Jul 5, 2013
efusco Interesting observation. I think mine has diminished too...not sure if that's good or even more worrisome? Mines still there though.�
Jul 5, 2013
Btrflyl8e Likely not... My car came with 4.4 and still has. Didn't have this occurring until after the first month or so.
- - - Updated - - -
Oh, I also have the steering clicking at very low speed...�
Jul 22, 2013
Duckjybe I had mine in to Toronto service last week for the second time to resolve the steering click (among other things). It seems better than before but I can still force the click by turning the steering wheel to both extremes while hardly moving. They said there is a shim they can try. I am a little disappointed in Toronto service as this was the third time in for an alignment (which they did get right this time), second time for steering click, still no Tesla loaners, told me they resolved two creaks and rattles which are still present. Reminds me of my GM/Ford dealership service days where they give a half hearted attempt at solving these nagging, time consuming, seemingly trivial annoyance issues. I have started another thread on this but I still strongly believe I should have been referred to discussion with the Tech by default. The advisor relayed information to/from me and the tech. When subjective intermittent creaks and rattles are at issue, talking to the tech would have been more efficient and would facilitate a quicker resolution to the problems, saving Tesla time and my time.�
Jul 22, 2013
NigelM My experience is that the Service Centers have always made the SC Manager and/or the Technicians readily available in person. Just go ahead and ask to talk to someone directly.�
Jul 22, 2013
Duckjybe The SC manager happened to be on a call with Elon. I think that they would summon the Tech if asked, however, for the ultimate service I shouldn't have to ask and I needed to go.�
Jul 22, 2013
Zextraterrestrial Does anyone know what is actually producing the click?
My car is going in on the 31st for the 1year service. I didn't have any click until 6 months (10k miles)�
Jul 22, 2013
Plug Me In Hey Z,
I just got mine fixed, which has been present since day 1. They placed a shim and the click is completely gone. The tech gave me a detailed explanation which made perfect sense and I've mostly forgotten. It was something to the effect of the rack being mounted to a non-fixed surface. The shim prevents some small movement of the steering column at the extremes of steering. Mine was fixed a couple of weeks ago and hasn't made a sound since.�
Jul 30, 2013
Borgie Glad to know there is a fix for this, although it doesn't necessarily sound like a long-term solution. Just noticed mine making this noise today (approx 5K miles). Also during a parking maneuver. One more item to add to the list (which is actually short) when I bring the car in for installation of the carbon fiber spoiler (which has been missing since delivery; and when I scheduled a service appt they called back and cancelled it due to lack of parts). I actually must say that I have found this car to be quite trouble-free, esp. considering it's a brand-new car from a brand-new company. When I think of the nightmares we could all have experienced, I'm amazed things have gone so well.�
Jul 30, 2013
100thMonkey ours started doing it last week, had the shim fix and all is good for now.�
Jul 31, 2013
FlasherZ As I understand, some need shims, some just need a new torque for the steering rack. Mine was handled last week.�
Aug 2, 2013
pilotSteve Had mine fixed two weeks ago. According to the service report the solution was "Performed update: SB-13-32-001" in case anybody gets the "what problem? never heard of that before" or some such line.
Actually Tesla Service has been very courteous and entered *every* item I asked them to check into the work order system. They closed *every* issue even if it was something like when I asked for my AlloyGators to be installed where they declined and closed the item as "Unfortunately we cannot install aftermarket accessories".�
Aug 7, 2013
znino I 100% agree with you and have had recent issues being told are fixed, I get in the car and nothing has changed. Where is your other thread on this by the way?
- - - Updated - - -
I had the same low speed clicking sound start a couple of months ago. I had it in the SC then for some other things and when I had the tech listen to it he seemed to think it could be a harness that is around the steering column to guide many wires and this harness could be broken etc and might need replacement. I actually seem to hear two types of clicks. One type is the low volume as i turn the wheel back and forth. The other happens less often and mostly, it seems, when the car has not been driven for a few hours. These are usually louder but happen only on the first turn of the wheel either way.
Today I brought the car in to address this issue. They told me they torqued some bolts in the steering and did nothing with the harness (it was actually a different tech who worked on it than the one who had the harness theory). I got into the car and the clicks were still there. I have to say I did not hear the louder variety but who knows. I will have to listen more tomorrow. After a night in the garage it would be guaranteed to happen. If everything is still present I will tell them to look at the bulletin SB-13-32-001 that was mentioned.
At least i know I am not alone and it does not seem to be a safety issue which is always my biggest concern. If any more resolutions are found, please post.�
Aug 7, 2013
Todd Burch My steering click was fixed.
The work order said "checked spacing, found shims not needed. Retorqued bolts to new specification".
Almost a week of driving, have not heard the clicking.�
Aug 8, 2013
William13 Resolved clicks and pano creak.�
Aug 8, 2013
znino do you know how they resolved it?�
Aug 9, 2013
Duckjybe My other thread on my service suggestion of talking to the tech by default, isn't getting many comments and is here�
Aug 9, 2013
Zextraterrestrial Just got my car back with the steering shim update and it seems good so far.�
Dec 31, 2013
Zextraterrestrial FYI
After my 1 year service where I had the shim update, I had clicks return a couple of months later. A ranger came and re-did the shims/ added a couple that weren't done at the 1 year (there are 4 that they were adding) About a month later, after a bit of hard driving, my steering started squeaking instead of clicking due to the shims that were put in. Very horrible sound.
you might not want to see/hear it...
So, I opened it all up to see what exactly was going on(since it isn't really drivable with that noise!). As you can see, the keeper bolt (with orange shim under) is loose enough that it moves. This is the problem location that produces the steering 'clicks'. Without the shims, the metal binds and clicks when the keeper bracket(painted steel) is horizontally stressed/slid on the steering rack(aluminum) with a bolt trying to keep them tight but the bolt hole has a tiny bit of play in the keeper hole. I tried every material I could to replace the shims and found either a teflon or a fiber washer to work the best. I didn't notice at this time that the bigger horizontal bolts (that hold the steering rack to the subframe) were also loose on my car. So loose after my last drive that I could hand unscrew the passenger side bolt all the way. I figured this out when my steering started to get about a dead spot when turning left from straight.
I think one of the problems was that the ranger didn't use a torque wrench after putting the shims in. The keeper bolts are a pretty low torque but the main steering bolts are closer to the wheel specs
After I got the bolt torque specs for the 4 bolts it all seems pretty good�
Dec 31, 2013
sp4rk It's a known problem on a couple of cars. Mine started doing it at around 12,000 mi. And at my 12k service it was fixed.�
Dec 31, 2013
yobigd20 They applied this shim TSB to mine over the summer but the next day I could still hear it. The shim only seems to "muffle" the sound but it's still there and very audible. So the shims aren't really a real fix for this problem...�
Jan 1, 2014
nrcooled I also had the shim fix applied at my 12k service and the noise has come back. I plan to take the car back in for another round of fixes. Tesla really needs to get this fixed.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4�
Jan 1, 2014
Doug_G I recently started getting the dreaded clicks. Fortunately my annual service is on Monday.�
Jan 1, 2014
efusco Wow, that was god aweful!�
Jan 2, 2014
mknox I got the clicks/snap sound fairly early on. Whatever they did at my service interval seems to have fixed it.�
Jan 2, 2014
Zextraterrestrial That is what I said in my e-mail! They really need a bolt with a wider shaft or a smaller hole in the steel keeper bracket that wont allow for play. I hope that they put some thread lock in when they redid mine. I pulled my frunk out a couple of times and don't really want to do it again (pretty easy but...I'm not working on a stereo upgrade or something fun!). I almost laughed when I first saw the 'shim' fix. thin orange plastic? not even Tesla red :wink:�
Jan 3, 2014
SeminoleFSU That is beyond terrible! I have the clicking noise too- nothing like that though. I also have a clunking noise (two clunks) whenever my steering wheel collapses all the way forward from me changing to my "exit" profile.�
Jan 5, 2014
Musterion @Zextra, can you share the bolt torque specs and where you found them? Thx�
Jan 8, 2014
neroden The clicking/clunking noise on sharp turns is not normal. The service center will fix it by installing shims somewhere in the steering system. I found this out a month or two ago.�
Jan 8, 2014
carrerascott Service is coming to fix this today for me, happened about 6 months ago as well (they fixed it then too).�
Feb 26, 2014
iffatall Not sure if my issue is related with what is discussed in this thread, but I will ask anyway. Every time I turn the turn indicator on, and begin to turn the steering wheel, I hear a faint click - as if the auto turning off of the indicator upon steering wheel returning to normal position just got enabled. Is this normal?
(Note that the click I am talking about is at the beginning of turning the wheel, not at 180�. Also, it is not as loud as in the videos posted here.)�
Jul 25, 2014
paco3791 Interesting that there haven't been many comments on this thread recently but my car has started to get "the click". Planning on getting my annual service in Sept. - Oct., haven't decided if I'll wait till then to get it fixed or not, I have a growing list of little things for the service center to look into.�
Jul 25, 2014
efusco I would have expected that the new bushings would be standard now, and that's probably why we haven't seen any cases. Perhaps you had a bushing fail or something.�
Jul 25, 2014
Vger Our car now has the click, but it only became noticeable at around 30,000 miles (We are at ~34k now). I am taking it in for service next week, and we shall see what the state of the art solution is now...�
Jul 25, 2014
paco3791 my cars early enough that it probably didn't get the fix at the factory so with 18k miles it's not a total surprise given previous comments in this thread.�
Jul 26, 2014
mgboyes My RHD car (1 month old today) has this clicking issue (not quite as severe as in the original video, but quite noticeable). Have included in snagging list of items to sort out - the car is going in to be looked at last week.
Thanks for a very helpful/informative thread!�
Jul 26, 2014
Ugliest1 At 13,000 miles now and my Nov2013 car just started the steering wheel clicking yesterday. This was immediately after the big screen showed the red "car needs service" banner. Because of this thread I'm not worried, and I'm nowhere near a service centre for the next few weeks. A reboot took care of the banner. We'll see what happens today.�
Jul 26, 2014
Ugliest1 Well, colour me confused. The clicking I heard yesterday, which sure sounded mechanical at the time, seems to have been fixed by a) the new Tesla Service Nighttime Stealth Team; b) leprechauns; c) that reboot I did after parking. It just wasn't there this morning. Also drove 450 miles today with no problems.�
Jul 27, 2014
J1mbo
Same, except I couldn't get an appointment at WD next week�
Jul 27, 2014
403portside Have had my car in to fix the steering click 4 times now. First fix is that they add some shims, per a service bulletin. Since then, they have been just tightening some part of the steering setup. Latest for me is that they tightened to 150nm and it now seems to have gone away. Fingers crossed. I also learned that Tesla uses a Range Rover rack.�
Jul 27, 2014
Theshadows Mine came back too. I notified them but haven't taken it in yet because the service center is 180 miles away.
Does anyone have a picture of what gets tightened? A procedure would be great, however not necessary. I have a torque wrench and I'll just tighten it to the 150nm if I can see what needs tightened.�
Jul 30, 2014
SarahsDad Didn't even notice mine clicking but got it fixed recently when in for other service:
�
Aug 1, 2014
nrcooled Mine has been in three (?) different times to get fixed (may be four times). Everytime it goes away for about a week then comes back. It starts off as a quiet click then it progressively gets louder. Definietly annoying but I inquired if I didn't bring it back if it would do damage and the the SC told me that it wouldn't so I haven't bothered to take it back in.
When I need something else done I will add it on but I am not making a special trip to get it "fixed" again.�
Aug 1, 2014
Vger Ours was just fixed today. The order says they re-torqued the bolts to a (much?) higher value.
We shall see how it lasts. I specifically asked about re-occurence, and Vancouver service assured me they get most cars fully fixed the first time. We shall see; fingers crossed!�
Aug 2, 2014
Lawsteve i had had exactly the same thing happen last week in Tampa. I never heard anything, but they fixed it.�
Aug 2, 2014
mknox My "click" cropped up fairly early and I had it seen to (I think) last November. It has not recurred.�
Aug 2, 2014
dsmith2189 I've had to bring my car into the SC twice for clicking. it only shows up when making tight turns while backing into my parking space. hopefully the new torque specs do the trick.�
Aug 10, 2014
xhawk101 Mine started clicking after service replacement of the 3 cooling pumps. 19 k miles. Hope to have fixed when I can schedule ac compressor noise suppression repair.
Strange that not present at all until after in for other work.�
Aug 10, 2014
brianman I discovered a click while turning the wheel at a stop sign (not moving). Service center addressed it. Shims.
Just another data point.�
Nov 13, 2015
siai47 My car has been doing this for a while and matches both the sounds and the problems reported by others-low speed or stopped turning with high loads on the rack. Fix done today was via a replacement of the rack bolts, adding shims and re-torqueing suspension components (per service bulletin). Problem gone for now but at least I know what it is if it returns.�
Nov 14, 2015
mobe My 85D 92xxx started this at about 4500 miles. I mentioned it to the SC and they mentioned that they replaced a couple of bolts. So far so good.�
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