Mar 1, 2015
trinifox Gulwing Doors & Snow Cover
Hi folks,
I have searched and I am not seeing anyone talk about what happens if the top of the car is covered in snow or it's raining and you open the Gullwings. Any ideas?
Also what about winter gear or a skibox? can this be accommodated some how?
Thanks
TF�
Mar 1, 2015
Yggdrasill 1. If the car is covered in snow, you really should remove the snow before opening the back doors. This can be done as easily as hitting the pre-heat button on your phone half an hour before needing to use the car, and then quickly brushing off the remaining snow.
2. If it's snowing or raining, and there's no wind, the falcon wing doors will shield the occupants from getting wet. If it's windy, however, it's unavoidable that the occupants will get some snow/rain on them.
3. Skibox doesn't look like it will be possible. But some sort of solution utilizing the tow hitch for transporting skis has been hinted at. (Or rather - promised.)�
Mar 1, 2015
Paul Carter Welcome to TMC!
With preheating I'm sure this snow covered roof won't be a big deal. I believe Tesla has a solution for stowing skis, we just don't have the details yet. If I were to speculate its a going to be sometime attached to the tow hitch. At the same time this will have minimal effect on the aerodynamics.
+1
Its illegal in some places to not clear your vehicle. Understandable, its very dangerous to leave snow on it only to later fly off into the way of the vehicle behind you or slide onto your own windshield. Having the snow brush stowed in the frunk or trunk for easy access to clear before you use the rear doors like any other vehicle in winter should come naturally, IMHO.�
Mar 1, 2015
Saghost Lots of things we don't know.
I suspect the car has a fairly large overlap between the inner and outer seals, which would reduce the tendency of snow or rain to fall inside. (As in, the portion of the roof that lifts up is say 36", but the opening on the indie is only 32", leaving a two inch overlap on each side - numbers out of thin air to illustrate the point.)
Also, they showed us that the car has a hinge at the outside of the roof in addition to the standard gullwing one at the center. It seems like everyone is assuming that hinge exists solely for the reason they've shown, to swing the lower door inwards to allow it to open more vertically in smaller parking spaces.
What if that hinge can move outwards, as well?
The door might have to move vertically just a bit to clear the latch, but then the side wall section could be articulated up at the outboard hinge while leaving the roof section more or less flat - this would provide overhead protection for rain/snow, and allow the use of a roof rack - at the cost of needing a fair amount of space to the side to open the door that way.
I'm expecting to see power articulation at both joints and some flexibility in both directions at the outer joint, and possibly ultrasonic sensors in the door looking up and sideways to ensure adequate clearance and control the door's opening pattern.
Walter�
Mar 1, 2015
BerTX This has been discussed fairly extensively. Perhaps your failure to find the discussions are due to searching for "gullwing" doors, when Tesla (and those on this forum) refer to them as "falcon wing" doors, due to their double-hinged, articulated design.�
Mar 1, 2015
bonnie It's one of the first threads on the Model X forum. Model X Falcon Doors
I think we've probably discussed every possible scenario .. snow, bike riders, wind, sleet, dogs, etc. Happy reading!
�
Mar 2, 2015
EchoDelta The "Insane Snow" mode flaps the falcon wing doors frantically until snow is shed. You may want to take a step back early iterations had the door proximity sensors turned off which got the feature the 'uppercut' nickname.�
Mar 7, 2015
tga No need to wait for something official from Tesla that has been "hinted at or promised". Yakama (and, presumably, others) have had hitch racks for, literally, decades. I have a Yakama one I bought used with bike and ski carriers 10+ years ago. It was probably a good 10 years old when I bought it.
Hitch Bike Racks | Yakima
Although I still prefer a ski box over roof or hitch racks to keep crap out of my bindings.�
Sep 30, 2015
UMD86 SNOW REMOVAL on the ROOF?
What happens when you get 2+ inches of snow and you need to gain access to the rear seats? Will all that snow drop into the car??? Does that mean you have to CLEAN the ROOF off first before opening the FWD?�
Sep 30, 2015
Johan <sarcasm>Yes you have to clean off the snow! Can you imagine such a thing! Crazy if you ask me.
With all the cars I've own to this day I've never cleared the snow and never once has a single snowflake fallen in to the car as the door opens.</sarcasm>�
Sep 30, 2015
hockeythug Unless you are one of the people that don't brush the snow off the top of their car, yes.�
Sep 30, 2015
boofagle Even in cars with regular doors if there's 2 inches of snow and you try to open a door without cleaning it off snow will still fall in. Also, in my state (PA) it's illegal to drive with snow on the roof anyway. I would imagine other states have similar laws.�
Sep 30, 2015
Jeva First world problems�
Sep 30, 2015
gavine I have a friend who got hit in the face on the highway by a chunk of ice that flew off of a truck in front of him. Mangled his face (badly).Fortunately, his wife was able to take control of the car from the passenger seat because it knocked him out. Everyone should clean the snow off of their roof regardless. They held a fundraiser to help pay for the reconstructive surgery that he needed.
Plus, you'll want to keep that panoramic view on the Model X so there's your motivation to clean it off.�
Sep 30, 2015
JohnSnowNW You should be cleaning snow off the roof of whatever car you own...it's a danger to other motorists.�
Sep 30, 2015
Johan You know nothing John Snow.�
Sep 30, 2015
yobigd20 thats me.�
Sep 30, 2015
MileHighMotoring I have never opened a car with any amount of snow on it without brushing the snow off first. Even in standard doors, doing so would result in tons of snow inside the car, on the door panel (electronic controls, armrest, etc) and on the seat! I am not worried about this in the Model X. I already do it.�
Sep 30, 2015
Blossom Typically in a regular car, you have to clean the roof before opening or you get chunks falling in (at least this was my experience in a Subaru in Montana). So I always would brush off the driver's side door, get the car started and then grab the scrapper. Then I'd go to town removing the snow. If you don't remove snow on the hood it will at some point come flying up and blind you for a bit. More dangerously, snow on the roof can slide forward when you stop and you end up with the windshield covered and it is too heavy for the wipers.
So, having falcon wing doors only changes how much work you have to do before people can get into the car, but doesn't change the overall amount of work you have to do before you are ready to drive.
Amazon.com: Hopkins 532 Mallory 26 Snow Brush with Foam Grip (Colors may vary): Automotive�
Sep 30, 2015
yobigd20 it doesnt help the fact that hte Model X has a feature wehre the doors open automatically as you approach it. so you're not even going to be given the chance to wipe the snow off. it'll fall into the car before you even get to it.�
Sep 30, 2015
Krugerrand Wild guess here: That feature can likely be turned on/off at any given time.�
Sep 30, 2015
Johan Good observation. Perhaps the FWD will recognize the snow having fallen and, as you approach, quickly flap up and down several times at an abnormally rapid pace, thereby creating turbulent airflow that clears the snow from the front part of the car, allowing the front doors to automatically open out to greet the driver ("like an invisible chauffeur") without snow entering the interior of the car.
(Yes if you can't tell I also question the auto openingen front doors, seems like over engineering to me).�
Sep 30, 2015
MileHighMotoring I'm sure that'll be an option in the menu, not mandatory, so turn it off during the winter. That's a good idea.�
Sep 30, 2015
KJennerator In my experience it is illegal to leave snow on the roof of your car while you drive. I have been pulled over for this. Therefore, you should be cleaning the snow off before you go anywhere.�
Sep 30, 2015
MrBigSmiles I'm sure Elon has some sort of defroster lining integrated into the top of the vehicle to prevent snow from accumulating at the rooftop of the X.�
Sep 30, 2015
ecarfan Gulwing Doors & Snow Cover
The smart X owner will disable the auto drivers door open function in the winter. If they don't, the first time that door auto opens with snow on the roof they will remember to turn off that function.
Not an issue. But you can continue to maintain that it is a serious issue if you wish.�
Oct 1, 2015
mmccord sounds like an idea someone who has never lived where it snows would come up with.
This would just create a giant layer of ice under the snow.�
Nov 28, 2015
Matias I'm curious how falcon-wing doors will function in snow. I'm rather sure Tesla has not tested them completely, based on a fact that they are still (according to Elon) fine tuning things like door seals. If they are still fine tuning doors they have not been able to test final design in winter.
In traditional door you wipe snow out from door frame area before you open the door. Doing so will prevent snow falling inside the car. You don't have any problems closing the door, because you close the door manually and there is no snow or ice between door and door frame.
How this works in falcon-wing doors? You have to at least wipe the whole door area from snow. If you don't do this, snow will fall inside the car when you open it. But even if you do this, I'm afraid that if some snow or ice still gets between door's joints it will prevent the door from closing completely.
What are your thoughts? And please don't respond "Tesla has tested this". They have not, because the final design has not been ready until maybe few days (if it even is ready now).�
Nov 28, 2015
vigge50 I don't now how it's in other country but in Sweden it's not legel to drive the car with snow on the roof. If you think of how the roof it's shaped on a Model X it's not hard to think that if you drive with snow on the roof, you have heat on in the car and you stop fast all the snow on the roof could slide down over the front window wish make it hard to see forward. I can give you one tip, clean the roof from snow before you drive the Model X or any other car.�
Nov 28, 2015
Matias You are right. I'm just wondering, how sensitive door joints are for snow getting inside the joint. Also snowing while you are driving is one thing.�
Nov 28, 2015
jerry33 No one really knows, but I wouldn't think it would be any worse than a minivan with sliding doors.�
Nov 28, 2015
wdolson Laws may vary from state to state in the US, but here in Washington State I see cars with snow on the roof all the time. It rarely snows where we live (about once a year), but the hills get up over 400 m around here and often get snow when we just get rain.
The OP's question is a good one. They may have done some simulated experiments indoors with a snow maker, and/or went up to the Sierra Nevada Mountains in the winter. Though last winter was the driest on record for California, so there was little snow to experience. Light powdery snow probably wouldn't be a serious problem mechanically, though it probably would fall inside the car as the doors opened if you didn't brush it off first. Heavy wet snow could stress the opening mechanism quite a bit. The area to collect snow that would move when the door opens isn't that large though.
I grew up in California and have lived at lower altitudes in Washington State since the late 80s. My total cumulative experience with driving in snow is probably less than those of you from Scandinavia have experienced in one winter, but I did end up bending the key to my trunk once when I tried to open the trunk with six inches of wet snow on it. I learned to appreciate how heavy wet snow can be.
This may be an area where Tesla being a California company is at a disadvantage. Some of the design team are probably from snowy parts of the world, but where Tesla has it's design and production offices, snow is so rare, the designers may not have thought it completely through.�
Nov 28, 2015
Yggdrasill In all probability, it's possible to get problematic amounts of snow in the doors joints, but I don't think it will be a huge issue. Preheat the car from your phone 15 minutes before you leave, brush the snow off, and everything will be fine. In any case, it's only a problem if you haven't parked under a roof, and it's snowed while the car has been parked. Most people who can afford a Model X will probably have a garage or carport, at least in northern Europe, which means it's for the most part only an issue if you are away from home.
There's no roof where I park at work, but I do it so rarely that over the course of a winter season, the car gets snow on it maybe once. (I usually walk to work.) All the shopping malls around hare have multi-storey parking, so they aren't an issue. Maybe it'll happen once or twice at superchargers, at friends' houses, etc.�
Nov 28, 2015
ecarfan Norway is one of Tesla's major markets. After over three years of Model S production, don't you think that Tesla engineering is aware of the need to extensively test new mechanical designs in harsh winter climates? I am sure they are fully aware by now of what snow and ice are and how they effect their products.�
Nov 28, 2015
CmdrThor You should search before starting a new thread. http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/43657-Gulwing-Doors-Snow-Cover?highlight=Falcon+snow
There are also several other threads discussing the topic.�
Nov 28, 2015
Krugerrand I'm going to need an official source before I believe your 'They have not...'. In the meantime I'll respond, Tesla has (quite likely) tested this regardless of them (fiddling) with the design, the seals etc... during the (partially) intended delay of the release of the X.
Additionally, people have been asking this question for years. It was actually recently answered by Tesla. Can't remember when, but I'm pretty sure the question was asked of Elon and the answer was: if there's a good amount of snow on the roof, brush it off, otherwise you'll get snowed on and get snow in the vehicle just like you would with any other vehicle when opening doors/hatches/trunks/hoods. And if there's a large amount of snow on the roof, the falcon doors will be impeded from opening because of the inability to compress the snow between them on the small amount of roof that remains when the doors are opened.
Further, like pretty much every other car door - if circumstances are just right - you'll sometimes get a door that won't close OR open due to icing/piece of ice falling into a hinge. I believe it was mentioned by Tesla that there will be some sort of heating/defrost mechanism for the door hinges.�
Nov 28, 2015
Discoducky To anyone who believes or thinks that the doors won't be able to handle wind, rain or snow, I would challenge you to look at the pictures of the door sills, study the motion of the doors (especially how it initially pops open) and the sensors that are in the door as well as around the door. These all add up to a very well thought out design that not only satisfies these environmental conditions, but should accel in that you solve some basic issues with respect to current style doors.
Snow: Arriving at the car after a foot of snow I would assume that when the door opens that some snow will fall into the cabin and on the sill. This should only happen for dry snow, which compresses easily and shouldn't accumulate in a manner on the sill which will cause the door to not seal or close properly or otherwise fail to close.
Rain: Even on a slope, rain should accumulate in the sill and be directed to away from the cabin, but would assume that even when covered by the door that some rain will get in to the cabin. I am making the assumption that less would get in than a conventional door
Wind: I'm assuming that the doors will open and close without issue in windy conditions. Operation and functionality is much better than conventional doors that fly open and close in wind.�
Nov 28, 2015
Yggdrasill Wind is my biggest worry. Where I'm from (Bod�), 20+ m/s winds is common September through April. But if the Model X doesn't like wind, Tesla-Bj�rn vill find out.�
Nov 28, 2015
Discoducky Will be waiting to watch that video of wind, rain and snow with falcon wings by Bjorn and friends. Instant classic!�
Nov 28, 2015
patrick42h Trinidad and Tobago is about 10� above the equator. Do you guys get any snow at all?�
Nov 28, 2015
wdolson I'm sure snow has been considered.
I was just thinking of what Consumer Reports had to say about Japanese and American cars back when Japanese cars were beating American cars in almost every category. There was one area where American cars continued to be superior to Japanese cars and that was in corrosion resistance. All American cars back in those days were designed in Michigan which salts the roads in the winter. Because the design engineers lived in that environment, they gave better consideration to protecting the cars they designed from salt damage. Because the Japanese engineers didn't live somewhere where salt on the roads was an issue, corrosion resistance wasn't on their minds as much as the American engineers.
Tesla does all it's design in a place that doesn't get snow (except for a couple of freak times in the last century), it's possible they overlooked something engineers from a snowy climate might not have missed. As someone who has done a lot of software designs, there is almost always something you didn't think of that becomes obvious when someone in a different situation and mindset sees it. That's why you do extensive testing, but even then things slip through.
Nobody will know for sure until some people live through some winters with a Model X. It may be completely thought through and no problems, or something might crop up in the real world. We just don't know.�
Nov 28, 2015
MileHighMotoring Tesla designs their vehicles for all climates.
I'm not sure what time period you're referring to exactly; in the 70's Japanese cars did tend to rust a lot (but then again, so did American cars), but at that time they weren't considered superior to American cars. In the 80's the tide started turning and in the 90's it was becoming known that Japanese vehicles' reliability and build quality was exceeding American cars by a large margin. By that time they were certainly applying copious corrosion resistance to the chassis as a matter of course. Modern vehicles don't tend to rust, regardless what ethnicity it's designers are.�
Nov 28, 2015
wdolson When I was researching for my 1992 car Consumer Reports was giving credit to American car designs for better corrosion resistance, but not much else.�
Nov 28, 2015
MileHighMotoring By the 90's all mainstream vehicles (excepting small volume imports like Alfa Romeo, Renault, Triumph, etc) were using galvanized steel, zinc coatings, and included super long rust-through warranties, (7 year 100,000 mile was common by 1990). Honda and Toyota were more than on-par with American brands at the time in that regard. Anyway, this tangent has run it's course and we can get back to arguing over whether the Model X will cause Higgs Boson particles to destroy the universe if a snowflake gets jammed in the hinge.�
Nov 28, 2015
wdolson ie more important stuff :smile:�
Nov 29, 2015
JonathanD #FeelingSadforTeslasWithoutaGarage�
Nov 29, 2015
Marcos Not sure why "design isn't finalized" has to equate to "Tesla hasn't tested it." Even assuming that the design isn't final, perhaps it's being tweaked BECAUSE of field testing. In fact, that is the most plausible assumption.�
Nov 30, 2015
Vitold Well, Falcon Wing Doors idea was borne out of a need for better access to 2nd and 3rd row (plus marketing) and it may have been an overriding factor over such 'inconveniences' as snow. Every design has it's pluses and minuses and one can only tweak it so much.
It's pretty much given that Falcon Wing Doors will gather snow and ice within upper seal where traditional or sliding doors would not. We all hope that Tesla has designed seals and gutters to mitigate that for most circumstances but that's not given - especially since Tesla finalized electric actuators, hinges, seals and latches most likely just this summer.�
Nov 30, 2015
Johan Why is it given?�
Nov 30, 2015
Vitold In short, because of gravity and friction. When snow accumulates around the door opening - which one would expect that it will since roof is flat - once door opens some of the snow will be either blown in by wind or collapse into the upper gutter. I read that gutters have hydrophobic coating which will definitively help with evacuating partially melted snow down the gutter but on the other hand it's an indication that engineers have recognized it as being an issue and designed to mitigate it (note that hydrophobic coatings wear out so I'm curious how they designed it to be long lasting). It's all speculation at this point (except gravity and friction part) and I'm looking forward to see how it will work in the 'wild'.�
Nov 30, 2015
Johan
This is why snow is usually removed from the roof of the car before opening the door, regardless of if the door is a regular door opening outward, a falcon wing door or a sliding door. Unless one enjoys getting the car full of snow, and in the case of the falcon door in addition possible impaction of snow in the fold(s).�
Nov 30, 2015
AnOutsider Discussion about the gap around the front T has been moved:
What purpose does the cavity behind the front serve?�
Nov 30, 2015
Vitold Comparing traditional doors to Falcon Wing Doors is like comparing apples to oranges since opening shape and door motion is quite different. For example, I don't think anyone would mind couple of cm of snow on their roof when opening regular doors but it could be an issue with Falcon Wing Doors.�
Nov 30, 2015
Discoducky Exactly, speculation.
There are a few scenarios where it will be the most worrisome if it is not designed 'good enough'.
This is the worst snow scenario that came to mind: Heavy snow where there is a foot or more on top of the car and breezy. I say a foot or more since less most likely won't be enough to fall into the opening to cause a problem.
NOTE: I'll be preheating the car anyway, so when I arrive 5 minutes later at the car and I am obliged, by law in every state, to clear the snow from the car so as not to blind cars behind me.
But lets say I open the falcons anyway and it is breezy. Well, the snow has to be "dry" for any to blow into the car and possibly gum up the catch rail. Even if a bunch falls, dry snow is very little water and easily melts on a slightly warm surface, then drains away. This is what I think will happen with little actually getting in the car.
If wet snow snow and breezy a big chunk could fall into the gutter or catch rail and gum up the mechanism. If this happens, which is the worst case scenario (IMO) then you'd have to manually clean the area to allow the door to close, most likely, as wet snow contains substantially more water and is harder to melt with a slightly warm surface.
Just don't see a way that this will be a big issue in most cases unless you commonly get to the car with a foot of wet snow on the car and have to open the falcons prior to or just not wiping the roof off...and it is breezy or you are parked on a high grade slope.
This gets me thinking where I'm going to keep my snow/ice removal tool/brush...most likely in the frunk since I think opening the frunk would allow the snow to more easily be removed anyway and avoids the risk of any getting in the car all together.�
Nov 30, 2015
Krugerrand I mind when I drive behind people on the road/highway and get a windshield full of blowing snow or ice chips that impede my ability to see. And no, I don't typically tailgate. What is the difficulty in simply brushing off the roof of the car/around door hinges? I've been doing it for a few decades now and it's never killed me. And yes, even a couple of cms of snow on the roof of the car with other types of doors can cause me, my car seats or the floor of my car to be snowed on if I open the doors without cleaning off the vehicle first. It's as if people are looking for ways to cause themselves grief - darn it, I can't put my shoes back on when I've pulled them off my feet prior to unlacing them. What a terrible shoe design.�
Nov 30, 2015
Johan I don't want to seem conceited in any way, but it's kind of telling that many of those who have posted worries are from places like Mexico, Trinidad and what-not. While people living in Norway, Canada and the like seem less worried.�
Nov 30, 2015
AudubonB C'mon, Johan! When we Alaskans take our Model X to Trinidad and it snows on it...and us....we've got REAL PROBLEMS!�
Nov 30, 2015
Johan Only if you forget to brush the snow off the roof
Also before it snows there I think both Trinidad and Tobago will be far below sea level.
Time to bring this:
�
Nov 30, 2015
wdolson Freezing rain will be a pain to deal with or a thaw/frost cycle when there was snow on the roof of the car.�
Nov 30, 2015
Discoducky Why do you think so? You don't think the falcons will be able to pop open with ice on them?�
Nov 30, 2015
jerry33 I think he means that the snow is hard to brush off if there is a crust of frozen snow and ice.�
Nov 30, 2015
wdolson Ice can glue regular car doors shut. I had a few minor cases in Seattle.
Water will also run down in the seams between the door and the car body and then if it refreezes, it will act like glue sealing the door shut.
I have also had to deal with a couple of inches of snow with an inch of freezing rain on top. My car was in the garage that time, but it was a mess anywhere I had to deal with it around the house as well as being treacherous to walk on. We weren't able to open the garage door for a couple of days because the freezing rain driven by high winds coated the entire front of the house.�
Nov 30, 2015
Spidy Some people here seem ignore that the Model X will often be used as family car, often driven by a women with maybe small kids.
She is certainly not going to go the frunk with the baby on the arm and a toddler on the hand, get the snow removal tool and then clear the roof of a car that might be taller than her.�
Nov 30, 2015
wdolson Someone in this thread said that driving with snow on the roof of a car is illegal in Sweden and it might be illegal in some other places too. In those places, women who want to drive the car either get someone else to sweep the snow off the roof or she does it herself. In places where driving with snow on the roof is legal, it might be a new concept. Light snow probably wouldn't be a serious problem, though some of it might get inside the car.
Ultimately this is a car that might not be for everyone. I wouldn't want one, but I've never liked SUVs of minivans though we did own a minivan for about a year. It was useful when we had to do a lot of hauling, but if I had a Model X, I'd want to take out the seats and make it a cargo van and it's not well suited for that.
The falcon wings doors may prove to be popular with some people and hated by others.�
Nov 30, 2015
Ocelot agree with spidy. also as someone who grew up in snow, and then lived in newfoundland for five years...there is a LARGE per cent of the population who does bare minimum brushing before driving away. even if you brush off the "fluffy" top layer, often there is a frozen layer of icy crust on top of the car. should be interesting to see the first few videos of a good crusty snow/model x door opening videos.
as a sidenote i know Elon made a big deal of these doors, but to me, the ergonomics theoretically are no diferent than a minivan sliding door. again, will wait and see.�
Nov 30, 2015
JohnSnowNW I'm sure there are some, but how many people purchasing a Model X don't have access to garage? I'm thinking a pretty small minority.
Of course, there will be times when one can't park in a garage during a snow storm...at work, perhaps. In those instances it would be particularly beneficial to brush the snow off the roof.
In the event that the vehicle is being driven by someone with a babe-in-arms, who didn't have access to shelter during a snow storm, I recommend asking for assistance.
Regardless of the law in your location, brushing off the snow/ice from your vehicle is the responsible thing to do.�
Nov 30, 2015
MileHighMotoring How does said mother deal with her SUV today? My wife is not a large person and had no problems clearing snow off our SUV with a baby in tow. Women are surprisingly capable, nearly equaling their male counterparts
�
Nov 30, 2015
Krugerrand Yes, short women with children are stupid, helpless and lack any forethought. /sarcasm off
Did I really just read what I read?!?!?�
Nov 30, 2015
MikeL Ding ding. Aaaand there's the bell - can you believe it's only the end of round 7 ?! Unless there's a knockout, this one's only half over! Sorry, just dropped by to say how happy I am to see yet another snow on the roof thread going strong.
There's this thing called a "sno br?m". Seriously, look it up, it works great! Got mine off the SkyMall which is, tragically, bankrupt as I understand. If you big time jet setters had just bought more crappy junk from SkyMall, we wouldn't be in this predicament.�
Nov 30, 2015
Yggdrasill If you preheat the car, the ice should slide right off.�
Nov 30, 2015
bonnie Thanks for the laugh. After having spent the majority of my adult (and pre-adult) life in snow country (before landing in northern California), I just don't understand all this angst over snow on cars. Brush it off. If you must park outside and you believe a major ice storm is going to happen, either cover it OR park it so that at least one door is taking a direct hit from the sun once the snow stops. And with the X, I assume we'll all have the same pre-heating option that the S currently enjoys. Life is good.
SkyMall may be out of business, but you're all getting a second chance at one of these on eBay. Have at it!
�
Nov 30, 2015
Canuck The Snow Joe is better because not all snow is fluffy and that easy to wipe. So you brush with one end, and scrape with the other:
SJBLZD - Snow Joe Telescoping Snow Broom - Live Demo - YouTube
http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/snow-joe-telescoping-snow-broom-with-ice-scraper-sjblzd/6000188302089�
Nov 30, 2015
ohmman I believe I've said it before, but the logical thing is to have Tesla make a superpower door mode that whips the falcon wing door open so rapidly that it catapults all of the snow atop the neighboring cars. Note - stand clear of the door during this process. :wink:�
Nov 30, 2015
Canuck Well if it can do that, it might as well also fly you home!�
Nov 30, 2015
Yggdrasill Both of those were pretty ideal snow brush conditions. You can tell the temperature isn't very low, as the snow is wet. The water acts as a lubricant allowing the snow to easily slide off the car. (This effect will be similar when preheating the car, even when really cold.)
Personally, the worst conditions I expecience is when I park next to a river in -20C/0F, and you have a continuous flow of humid air over the car, where it freezes. You can easily get half an inch of ice covering the car in a few hours. Without preheating, you'll be stuck scraping the ice of the car for ages.�
Nov 30, 2015
Matias Yes. With previous cars there has been times when I have been forced to pull iced door with so much force, that I've been affraid that the handle will detach.�
Nov 30, 2015
abasile IMHO, this is probably the best answer. Ideally, perhaps, an optional "winter package" could in the future include simple resistance heaters in the roof and the upper part of the doors. Because it can sometimes take more than a few minutes of preheating the cabin to get ice and crusty snow to slide off, as we've experienced with our EV.
The best part is that, while preheating, no one has to breathe exhaust fumes from running an engine rich in the cold.�
Nov 30, 2015
Canuck Freezing rain, followed by heavy snow, is the worse. You get thick ice forming a barrier followed by snow that you need to brush off before you can even get to the ice. But that Snow Joe works really good. I don't take my S to my cabin where we get those conditions, but my Tahoe Hybrid has remote start and it preheats. Still, it takes a while to get it warm enough to scrape the windows and you can get a lot of pressure on the soft side, for the roof and other parts where there's paint but it doesn't damage it, and the scrapper is much better for the windows than smaller ones since you get more pressure. It works really well.�
Nov 30, 2015
goneskiian Probably best to do one door at a time too! ;-)�
Dec 1, 2015
jerry33 I've found that extra wide clear wrap over the windows helps.
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Dec 1, 2015
Krugerrand No way a short-armed woman with children (and you know she'll have a baby in one arm arms and a toddler in her other hand) is going to be able to put plastic wrap on her car like that jerry33. And what if she has a mini-van!? :scared:�
Dec 1, 2015
Yggdrasill Helps with what? I can imagine it must be really annoying to try to remove once it's frozen solid to the wind screen.�
Dec 1, 2015
jerry33 1) You put the plastic wrap on before the snow falls.
2) If a person can't put on the plastic wrap, how are they ever going to get the ice out of the windshield wiper "tray"?
3) It's obviously a separate task from the act of leaving.
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What's very hard to do is to get the ice out of the wiper tray. The plastic wrap pulls right off and breaks up the ice. Works great.�
Dec 1, 2015
AudubonB Well, as long as we're posting photos irrelevant to the thread this morning, here's one for all o' yez. Free drop-off; just tell me where to deliver:
(And by the way, my garage is....somewhere...behind that background pile.)�
Dec 1, 2015
Yggdrasill The above picture is the reason why pickups are very unpopular in Norway.
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I've never had a problem with this. But I haven't owned a Model S, so I can't say it isn't necessary.�
Dec 1, 2015
Johan Brushing off is for sissies.
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Dec 1, 2015
AudubonB I lived one winter* in Sapporo, and such sights were common then!
*don't ask me how many centuries ago that was. The tempus is really fugitting around here.�
Dec 1, 2015
gjunky Can you bring a few of those back to AZ on your next trip? You'll be making a lot of kids happy.�
Dec 1, 2015
Spidy Does she not put the baby in the child seat before she starts removing the snow?
I really don't get why all people have such a hard time understanding the difference.
Women (or honestly everyone) with baby normal car:
Open door => put baby into child seat => start removing snow from car
With the model X:
Remove snow with child on arm => open door => put child in the car
I'm not saying women are incapable. But doing it in one order is clearly a lot easier. Not to mention if you have another toddler.�
Dec 1, 2015
Johan Why not just ==> remove snow using child ==> open door ==> put child in the car?�
Dec 1, 2015
Ocelot :biggrin:
i do question those who say just pre-heat the car and scrape. I had a remote starter in Newfoundland, and while preheating helps defrost the windows and heat the cabin, ..often you are still scraping for a long time, and your doors can still be really hard to open/frozen shut.
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Dec 1, 2015
AudubonB Just pre-heat the car and scrape.�
Dec 1, 2015
wdolson I know some pretty capable women, but it would be hard to get a child into the child seat if the falcon wing doors are frozen shut. Hopefully the motors have some kind of safety that shuts off the door opening mechanism if it isn't making progress so the motors don't burn out. I would expect Tesla to think of that. Even without snow you could have someone leaning on a door when you try to open it.
In any case, the only time I can see a real problem would be when the doors are frozen shut and it might be more of a problem with the Model X than with a regular car. The gaps at the top of the door are horizontal so water could pool up there (even a little) when there is a thaw and then it freezes. With a normal door, the gaps are all vertical so there is less opportunity for water to pool before freezing.
In general, people are resourceful and usually come up with ways to cope with most common scenarios. Even if a given individual doesn't hit on a good solution, usually someone else figures it out and it catches on.�
Dec 1, 2015
Krugerrand Where's her husband? This is why we keep them around - to remove snow and ice from car for us.�
Dec 2, 2015
sigurdi A ladie with a child under here arm is not a common sight in norway when arriving a car that have not been diven for a while.
They use trollies or child seats to carey the smal ones.
And the child is sitting in their trolley or seat when the ladie brushes the snow of the roof.
To make a problem is no problem.
If falcon doors is a large problem, lots of other cars, like Model S. ;-)�
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